Independent Order of Oddfellows

originally posted by: asabuvsobelow
Where did you first become a Mason ?

In my heart. Funny you ask this but wont mention what state this ritual allegedly takes place nor the name of it. Clifton #203, New Jersey. Don't try to test me bro.

You tried to bull**** everyone with your Odd Fellows nonsense and got caught.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

First off I will test you because your testing me , trying to get me to write what you know I shouldn't.

You tried to bull**** everyone with your Odd Fellows nonsense and got caught.

No reason to get angry mate , I'm not trying to Deceive anyone including you . I get the feeling you think you know everything when it comes to Masonry and the feeling that your wrong really gets under your skin .

It's simple really, Perhaps its just my district where the Masons and Odd-fellows share a relationship but I assure you it's not something I'm making up , there is a huge Tapestry or Quilt or something hanging on the wall in the dining room of my Lodge it was clearly hand made and its a common image showing all the Degrees in a sort of Pyramid with the all seeing eye at the top , there is also sewn into the tapestry all the associated groups and right to the top left is the Odd fellows. After seeing that it sparked the conversation years ago with my Mentor about the Odd fellows and Freemasonry , he told me about the associated ritual and connection the end .

I've spoke with a few others in my area and they all say the same , now my Mentor was a man I trusted with the upmost confidence and near his death they made him an ' Honorary 33rd degree mason ' .

originally posted by: asabuvsobelow
First off I will test you because your testing me , trying to get me to write what you know I shouldn't.

Naming a piece of ritual isn't against any Obligation. Watch....Second Section Lecture for the Fellow Craft Degree. Me going in to specifics about it is.

Now you cut it back to it 'there's a tapestry in my lodge'. Guess what? We have an apron from Cuba in ours. Doesn't mean we have anything to do with Masons in Cuba.

Odd Fellows and Masons share no ritual and have no relation.

I'd say - with members dwindling - in these type organizations - it would not be unheard of for them to come together - to share space and camaraderie.

But "blended"?

I don't think so.

Just my opinion

I know this is gripping debate, and I really hate to interrupt such philosophical pursuits along the lines of “ I know you are but what am I?” from the esteemed master Herman but…

IOOF was created to be a fraternal organization for those that were blackballed by the Masons or otherwise unacceptable to the Elks, Lions, K of C, Moose and other organizations including the VFW and AmVets. The point of being an Oddfellow was that you were accepted despite being the odd man out elsewhere.

Just another fraternity like college Greek frats.

Again -- I researched this long ago cuz of genealogy - I had an uncle who was an Oddfellow.

It began as a charity -- unusual for men -- reason they were called Odd.

From other sources it is known that the Lodges were originally formed by workingmen for social purposes, and for giving the brethren aid and assisting them to obtain employment when out of work. When a brother could not obtain work he was given a Card and funds enough to carry him to the next Lodge, and if unsuccessful there, that Lodge facilitated his farther progress in the same way. Where he found employment, there he deposited his Card. odd-fellows.org...

However, like most everything it evolved.

At first there was little or no Ritual, and no formal method of conducting the business of the Lodge. These were matters of gradual and slow growth. The English are and were very conservative, and do not readily yield to innovations. Time, however, works wonders, so that in the end many radical and necessary changes were made in the Order.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Naming a piece of ritual isn't against any Obligation. Watch....Second Section Lecture for the Fellow Craft Degree. Me going in to specifics about it is.

I respectfully disagree.

Now you cut it back to it 'there's a tapestry in my lodge'. Guess what? We have an apron from Cuba in ours. Doesn't mean we have anything to do with Masons in Cuba.

" Cut it Back " ? I'm simply telling you how the conversation started between my Mentor and I , I'm not using the Tapestry as proof . Augustus you are an unpleasant individual mate , I've been quite civil with you during this debate and you have been noting but hostile you've basically called me a Liar and made universal claims of Masonry concerning all of the USA .

Is it really that difficult for you to accept there are certain Rituals passed on and carried on in Lodges that are not in other Lodges ? There are a few we conduct that I've been told are not used in other Lodges and I'm not even talking about the Odd Fellows connection.

a reply to: DBCowboy

Aren't we all just odd fellows in the long run?

a reply to: Ahabstar

So basically a group of rejects? I mean even the rejected need acceptance too so I can see that. I just thought it was an interesting bit about my family and I think the document is pretty cool especially for being as old as it is from the late 1800's.

Also I really LOL'd at the gripping debate comment.

Long ago you joined the odd fellows and got invited to walk the path to a lodge if worthy from what I remember but wars decimated the population and the odd fellows all but vanished in some areas

geeze, here i am wracking my brain and just now realizing i was thinking of the league of extrordinay gentelmen

a reply to: asabuvsobelow
www.abovetopsecret.com...

originally posted by: asabuvsobelow
I respectfully disagree.

Good for you.

Is it really that difficult for you to accept there are certain Rituals passed on and carried on in Lodges that are not in other Lodges ?

You started off by stating quite decidedly that Masonry and the Odd Fellows are 100% related, you've now walked that back to maybe it's just in your lodge. You offer ZERO supporting evidence for any of your claims and use a weak copout that it would violate your Entered Apprentice Obligation when every Mason on here, including you, knows that's bull.

Don't like getting called out on making things up? Simple, don't make things up.

As to make making a universal claim, yeah, I'll make it again. The Odd Fellows and Masons are not the same, are not related and anyone saying as much is a liar.

In my jurisdiction, The Grand Lodge of New Brunswick Canada, there is zero connection between the Oddfellows and Masons. And I can speak to the Grand Lodge of Nova Scotia as well, no connection. Can't speak to the other Grand Lodges in Canada but I've never heard of it.

The Grand Lodge of Canada in the Provence of Ontario does not have any connection to or with the Odd Fellows.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

You started off by stating quite decidedly that Masonry and the Odd Fellows are 100% related, you've now walked that back to maybe it's just in your lodge.

Clearly yes the debate has evolved because I'm not making claims concerning all of Free Masonry How could I ? I was raised in one lodge in one city falling under the jurisdiction of one certain Grand Lodge . You are the one speaking for all of the USA when it comes to Free Masonry.

Ask yourself a Question , Did I 'asabuvsobelow' know that your pants would catch on fire when I said there was a Connection between the Odd fellows and Freemasons ?

No I had no Idea you would flip out , Because in my Lodge in my district The Freemasons and Oddfellows are connected there are Master Masons who are also Oddfellows in my Lodge , It is completely normal and common knowledge for me to make such a claim that the two are connected . So to me when I initially posted on this topic I genuinely believed there was a Universal connection between the Two Brotherhoods , now I have been made the wiser by you and others and apparently Two Super Moderators that its just my district .

So don't call me a Liar because I'm not Lying , I'm not just some asshole who makes sh*t up .

You offer ZERO supporting evidence for any of your claims and use a weak copout that it would violate your Entered Apprentice Obligation when every Mason on here, including you, knows that's bull.

That's bull# Augustus I'm not writing the damn Ritual or saying anything about it and the crazy part is it's a small ritual that makes the connection but even still its clearly a private ritual used at very few lodges , I understand some Lodges in other states are more lenient on the whole writing thing conducting there business and rituals from an actual Book , but In my Lodge everything is passed down from person to person by word of mouth and memorized nothing is ever written down ever .

So you can say I'm using the First degree oath as a cop out fine , but do not call me a Liar I'll say it again don't call me a F*cking Liar because to my knowledge and experience I am telling the Truth and I don't give a damn what you say on the subject.

originally posted by: asabuvsobelow
Clearly yes the debate has evolved because I'm not making claims concerning all of Free Masonry How could I ?

Quit your BS, dude, you made a blanket statement then kept moving the goalpost:

a reply to: beyondknowledge
From my understanding the Odd Fellows and Masons are completely separate organizations.

originally posted by: asabuvsobelow
I know for a fact that is not true .

You are the one speaking for all of the USA when it comes to Free Masonry.

I can, because I clearly stated there is zero connection, they are two wholly separate organizations, and that is a fact. You CANNOT because you made some asinine comment that they are a circle within the Masonic circle.

originally posted by: KSigMason
a reply to: asabuvsobelow
They are linked in that there are Masons who are also in the Oddfellows, but the Oddfellows is not a recognized concordant body of Freemasonry.

Yes your right , I see that now

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Quit your BS, dude, you made a blanket statement then kept moving the goalpost:

Text I can, because I clearly stated there is zero connection, they are two wholly separate organizations, and that is a fact. You CANNOT because you made some asinine comment that they are a circle within the Masonic circle.

Jesus Christ , you really think I'm lying don't you ?

Mate you've got issues I would have never debated you had I known you were a complete narcissist .

Go ahead think what you want, I'm done with you.

a reply to: asabuvsobelow

I don't think you are lying. I think you were telling me info that you had at hand from your experience. I appreciate yours and everyone else's input. We only learn more by questioning things, and I also think by keeping an open mind.