A breakdown of the situation in Ukraine

Federal government took over all the Native American communities a long time ago.a reply to: ElGoobero

originally posted by: ChaoticOrder
Before I go any further, let me just say this; if I had a gun to my head and was forced to choose between nuking Russia or Ukraine, I would probably choose to save Ukraine ...

Can I stop you there? If you would choose to live at the expense of hundreds of thousands, even millions of other people's live, and that doesn't include all the various other species of life that would perish, then you picked the wrong answer.

originally posted by: ChaoticOrder
- Putin didn't threaten nuclear war or even mention nuclear war in the speech where everyone claimed he did source

Of course he didn't explicitly threaten use of nuclear weapons, that would do him no favours at all. But what he said and the way it was worded leaves him plenty of room for plausible deniability.

- Zelensky lied about Russian forced attacking a nuclear plant and causing a meltdown to drum up western support source

One thing is clear to me, Zelensky is insane. He has repeatedly tried to enforce a no-fly zone, knowing the consequences for such a thing. He wants a world war and he's trying dirty trick after dirty trick to drag us all into one. Mark my words, history will not look upon Zelensky kindly (if anyone is left alive to remember him). Putin may be the perceived aggressor in this situation but Zelensky is not innocent by any means.

I can help

First of all its now brutally obvious that Russia is stealing conspiracies from Q-Clown world and likewise Q-Clown world is stealing ideas from Kremlin mouthpieces, basically throwing poopy at walls and seeing what sticks with the groupthink

It works identically for the far left Marxist & commies BLM clowns and the CCP mouthpieces, but we’ve know for nearly a decade now the Russian and Chinese were in our system carrying out extensive propaganda campaigns and now we’re seeing it come to ahead and people slowly waking up to the war which was being fought

But let’s get back on topic why Putin wants Ukraine and is FUMIN Ukraine should ever dare to chose a democratic path towards the EU and eventually defend that choice with a NATO membership

Why Putin wants Ukraine

1st in Europe in proven recoverable reserves of uranium ores;
2nd in Europe and 10th in the world in titanium
ore reserves;
2nd in the world in explored reserves of
manganese ores (2.3 billion tons, or 12% of the
world's reserves);
2nd largest iron ore reserves in the world (30
billion tons);
2nd in Europe in mercury ore reserves;
3rd in Europe (13th place in the world) in shale
gas reserves (22 trillion cubic meters)
4th in the world by the total value of natural
resources;
7th in the world in coal reserves (33.9 billion tons)
Ukraine is an agricultural country:
1st in Europe in arable land area;
3rd in the world by the area of black soil (25% of
world's volume);
1st in the world in exports of sunflower and
sunflower oil;
2nd in the world in barley production and 4th in
barley exports;
3rd largest producer and 4th largest exporter of
corn in the world;
4th largest producer of potatoes in the world;
5th largest rye producer in the world;
5th in the world in bee production (75,000 tons);
8th in the world in wheat exports;
9th in the world in the production of chicken

16th in the world in cheese exports.
Ukraine can meet the food needs of 600 million
people.
Ukraine is an industrialized country:
1st in Europe in ammonia production;
2nd in Europe's and 4th largest natural gas
pipeline system in the world (142.5 bln cubic
meters of gas throughput capacity in the EU);
3rd largest in Europe and 8th largest in the world
in installed capacity of nuclear power plants;
3rd in Europe and 11th in the world in rail network
length (21,700 km);
3rd in the world (after the U.S. and France) in
production of locators and locating equipment;
3rd largest iron exporter in the world
4th largest exporter of turbines for nuclear power
plants in the world;
4th world's largest manufacturer of rocket
launchers;
4th in the world in clav exports
4th in the world in titanium exports
8th in the world in exports of ores and
concentrates
9th in the world in exports of defence industry
products;
10th largest steel producer in the world (32.4
million tons).

a reply to: TritonTaranis

Spot on TT without Ukraine Russia is a regional power, with Ukraine and everything you listed above the union with Russia makes a superpower

a reply to: PatriotGames4u

That’s only outside of the country. Inside the country it’s worth the same as it was 2 months ago. Those figures are used for world trades and financial dealings. Just like when the dollar drops to being only worth .90c, in the US it’s still a dollar and buys the same. You will only feel the effects of it from imported goods you want to buy. Which Russia isn’t importing anything so nothings changed.

a reply to: Cutepants

Pirating in Russia isn’t like pirating everywhere else. It’s a serious crime that can get out you in prison for a very long time.

a reply to: Cutepants

How do you know Russia is weaker? Because the media told you? They have the best surface to air missiles in the world. They could wipe Ukraine off the map in an hour without using Nukes. They don’t because they are trying to save lives. You do realize Ukraine was once Soviet Ukraine? And not so long ago at that. Only a single generation gap. Which is why in the East most of the citizens call themselves Russians. Did you ever think maybe Russia doesn’t want the West ideology to spread into the country because of what it’s turning the world into? Why would a leader want a Godless, genderless, social media addicted, loose morales, with broken family ideals, integrated into their society when they can see first hand how destructive it is?
Looking around I wouldn’t want what the US and other western countries are turning into. Evil is spreading faster than Good can keep up too. Corporations pulling out of Russia exactly what he has wanted for the last 10 years. These companies will be hurt more than Russia will with their loss in revenues.

originally posted by: MetalChickAmy

originally posted by: ChaoticOrder
Before I go any further, let me just say this; if I had a gun to my head and was forced to choose between nuking Russia or Ukraine, I would probably choose to save Ukraine ...

Can I stop you there? If you would choose to live at the expense of hundreds of thousands, even millions of other people's live, and that doesn't include all the various other species of life that would perish, then you picked the wrong answer.

I thought it was a joke the first time but now I'm not so sure lol...

originally posted by: ElGoobero


imagine a Native American community being taken over by the federal government.

And this is EXACTLY what Ukraine was doing in Donbass for the past 8 years

Oh FFS can we here on ats try something that used to be normal?

Both sides are flooding the world with propaganda, that is not even debatable solid fact.

Is ukraine being manipulated from the west, yes they are not debatable, is Russia being manipulated by china high probability of yes.

But no matter which way you slice it, unless there is some amazing false flag example that is irrefutable to prove russia was provoked, bottom line is Putin is the aggressor!

the cities are being bombed, kids, and innocents are being killed also cant really argue against that statement.

everything else is what remains to be seen, if you are only pointing at one side you have probably drank to much koolaid.

I will freely admit my sympathies are with ukraine, they dont deserve whats happening, neither do the regular people in russia.

But some of yall need to go take a walk outside and clear your head.

I've been looking at reports about where the troops are fighting or moving, pics of equipment in the field, transports inside Russia, political happenings in Russia and Belarus. It's not rocket science. And it's a fact that many predicted Russia could take the capital within a few days, now it's been two weeks. I'm not here personally insult you if you're Russian or whatever, so chill.

originally posted by: mcsnacks77
They have the best surface to air missiles in the world. They could wipe Ukraine off the map in an hour without using Nukes. They don’t because they are trying to save lives.

Do they have enough missiles? For some reason they are underusing their air force, either because they lack smart bombs or because Ukraine is still able to contest the air. And they have been bombing Mariupol pretty badly for example, a lot of civilians dead.

originally posted by: mcsnacks77
You do realize Ukraine was once Soviet Ukraine? And not so long ago at that. Only a single generation gap. Which is why in the East most of the citizens call themselves Russians.

Yeah, of course. The Russians forced many Ukrainians to leave their homeland. But it wasn't just the Soviets, Imperial Russia tried to make the Ukrainians more Russian so they could be ruled easier.

And many in the east don't just call themselves Russian, they are ethnically Russian, they speak Russian. Even some of them have become Ukrainian patriots now, that shows how foolish this war was.

originally posted by: mcsnacks77
Did you ever think maybe Russia doesn’t want the West ideology to spread into the country because of what it’s turning the world into? Why would a leader want a Godless, genderless, social media addicted, loose morales, with broken family ideals, integrated into their society when they can see first hand how destructive it is?

Most certainly, I've often thought about that. It's part of what made me like Putin. But now Putin is throwing his life's work away. Can't you see that Ukrainians hate him now, maybe they'll even hate Russians. They love Zelensky now, and that's Putin's fault. Before this war, Zelensky had 30% approval, now it's 90%. He went from worse than Biden to Bush at 9/11.

I don't really care if Russia and Ukraine are reunited or not, but I wish Russia could provide the world with a traditional way of life like you said, an option to neoliberalism. But now, if the Russia and the West keep drifting apart more and more, Russia will become China's satellite. It's disgusting.

War just isn't the solution to every problem. Putin is not able to do what you want him to do, we need someone else now who can build that Russia you want to see. He had a good run, but he's out of touch and I think probably the system he built around himself is unable to challenge him and help him make decisions efficiently.

And this fight, the fight against Godlessness and so on, it can't be won just with military weapons and censorship. The more you push the more people will push back. You need to give them a vision instead, give them hope. Now Putin has made that impossible in Ukraine for at least a few generations.

originally posted by: mcsnacks77
Looking around I wouldn’t want what the US and other western countries are turning into. Evil is spreading faster than Good can keep up too. Corporations pulling out of Russia exactly what he has wanted for the last 10 years. These companies will be hurt more than Russia will with their loss in revenues.

Yeah. The West and Russia will be hurt, and China will gain from this. Brilliant.

originally posted by: mcsnacks77
a reply to: Cutepants

Pirating in Russia isn’t like pirating everywhere else. It’s a serious crime that can get out you in prison for a very long time.

So that's why they'll change they law, so people can watch porn. Sad.

a reply to: Cutepants
Maybe I was wrong I mean….
Just because Ukraine is full of neo-Nazis, and recent members of its government were neo-Nazis, and its military has neo-Nazi units (e.g., the notorious Azov Battalion), and it has a national holiday celebrating a Nazi, and government officials hang his portrait in their offices, and the military and neo-Nazi militias have been terrorizing and murdering ethnic Russians since the USA and the Forces of Goodness supported and stage-managed a “revolution” (i.e., a coup) back in 2014 with the assistance of a lot of neo-Nazis … that doesn’t mean Ukraine has a “Nazi problem.” After all, its current president is Jewish!

Because the role the United Forces of Goodness played in orchestrating this mess, starting with how members of the US government stage-managed that coup in 2014, and how they funded and worked with known neo-Nazis — not secret, dog-whistling, half-assed Nazis, but big fat, Jew-hating, Sieg-heiling Nazis — to foment and eventually execute it. All that, of course, is just “Russian propaganda,” despite the fact that it has been thoroughly documented, not just by the usual “conspiracy theory outlets,” but by official mouthpieces of the Forces of Goodness, like the BBC, The Nation, and even The Guardian.
And I should ignore the Ukrainians arrested by Europol January 21,2022. Who were making millions by human trafficking their own citizens to Mexico then picked up by Ukrainians living in Van Nuys,California who then sold them into slavery across the US.
What is happening is, Russia is rebelling against GloboCap, and, unlike the other rebellious parties that GloboCap has been dealing with recently, Russia has thermonuclear weapons.

I’m not trying to tell you who to root for. Root for the Globalists if you want. I’m just urging you, before you fly over to “Kyiv” and join the fight against the Putin-Nazis, or make a jackass of yourself on the Internet shrieking for nuclear Armageddon, or fire-bomb your local Russian restaurant, or beat the crap out of some Russian-looking person, to maybe take a moment or two and try to understand what is actually going on, and who the major players actually are, and where Globalist efforts to “clear and hold” the entire planet are inexorably taking us.

a reply to: Cutepants

You mean the one where Russia would wave any criminal or civil penalties involved with pirating software so long as it's from one of the companies that have supported the sanctions. The distinction is important because this doesn't mean that Russia is legalizing all forms of software piracy. It's specifically targeting the software companies based in countries that are sanctioning Russia. Which is software businesses need to conduct business and video game software.

a reply to: mcsnacks77

I'm not saying they'll legalize all forms of piracy, no

a reply to: mcsnacks77

Did you mean to mean to reply this to someone else's post? You aren't responding to what I wrote. I don't care about your Nazis any more than I care about Trudeau's. You're stuck in the 20th century with this propaganda. This is a real war going on with real consequences for both Russians and Europeans and even Americans.

Russia is rebelling in a sense, but what I'm telling you is that Russia's rebellion is a total failure. It's incompetent, it's retarded. I want a better Russia. Do you understand what I'm saying? Just having thermonuclear weapons isn't enough, globohomo has nukes too.

a reply to: Cutepants

Yeah, but what about the black suns?



Your comment the other day about black suns not implying membership in the SS was a keeper.

Cheers

a reply to: F2d5thCavv2

Thanks, I always thought it was a cool symbol

a reply to: Cutepants

A Ukraine hostile to Russia and strongly linked to the West negates any possibility of Russia leading a reasonably strong regional bloc of states. From this point of view, most Western observers have not understood just how severe was the defeat suffered by Russia when Ukraine experienced the revolution of 2014 and rejected membership of the Eurasian Union. Seizing part of the Donbas, and even annexing Crimea, were very miserable consolation prizes by comparison.

Ukraine is by far the biggest former Soviet republic apart from Russia, with 44 million people to Kazakhstan’s 18 million and Belarus’ nine million. Ukraine has by far the largest Russian ethnic minority outside Russia. Without a largely Russian-speaking Ukraine, Russia loses most of its status as an international language. Without Ukrainian membership, the Eurasian Union is a pathetic shadow.

This imparts a strong element of historically-based nationalism to the Russian and Putin attitude towards Ukraine. There is some understanding in Russia of why Ukrainians would want their own state, but almost none of why Ukrainians would want to define that state against Russia. Hence the Russian demonology of “Nazism” and “U.S. manipulation.”
Nobody in Moscow now appears to believe that there is any possibility of an agreement with NATO on conventional arms limitation, or on some form of new European security architecture. The most that can be hoped for by Moscow is a Cold War-style treaty on nuclear arms reductions, and perhaps some agreement on cybersecurity. When the Russian government decided to invade Ukraine, it chose to accept that relations with the West would be basically hostile for a long time to come.

The Russian government aims to establish a Russian sphere of influence, not a new version of the Soviet Union. Putin has stated that “whoever does not miss the Soviet Union has no heart, but whoever wants it back has no brain.”

Concerning Ukraine, there are two possible paths for Russia to take. Which one will be chosen will become apparent in the next days, or possibly hours. The first would be an agreement with the existing Ukrainian government (as publicly demanded by Russia immediately after the invasion) that would guarantee Ukrainian neutrality and the exclusion of Western armaments. Moscow will almost certainly also demand that the Donbas republics, and any other Russian-speaking areas occupied by the Russian army, receive fully autonomous status within a federal Ukraine. Moscow would likely present this to the West as an expanded version of the Minsk II agreement of 2015 on autonomy for the Donbas within Ukraine.

The second path would be for Russia to occupy Kiev itself, replace the Ukrainian government with Russian puppets, and draw up a new Ukrainian federal constitution by Russian diktat. At this point, Moscow might also try to force its Ukrainian client state to join the Eurasian Union and CSTO. This would be a vastly more dangerous project for Russia.
The purpose of Western sanctions against Russia should be to press Russia to withdraw its army from Ukraine and restore Ukrainian sovereignty and territorial integrity (minus Crimea). This however will inevitably now require some form of compromise with Russia on Ukrainian neutrality (but not membership of the Eurasian Union) and federalism. Short of the military defeat of the Russian army or the collapse of the Russian state, it appears impossible now to achieve unconditional Russian withdrawal from Ukraine.

The alternative is for the United States to use sanctions not to change Russian policy in Ukraine, but to overthrow the regime in Russia itself by crippling the Russian state and economy. This would be a vastly more ambitious and dangerous project, and probably futile. The U.S. use of sanctions to bring about regime change has been a universal and unmitigated failure – in Cuba, Venezuela, Iraq, Iran and North Korea.
Western sanctions should be intended to help the Ukrainian people. The latter strategy of guerilla warfare would instead instrumentalize Ukrainians as a weapon to weaken Russia and recall some of the worst U.S. actions of the Cold War, when Washington supported local insurgencies (sometimes led by evil figures like Jonas Savimbi and extremist ideologies like that of the Afghan Mujahedin), with no regard whatsoever for the interests of local peoples.
The best, fastest way to end the Ukrainian civil war is to partition off its Russian-speaking eastern regions, quench its surging nationalism, and promise Russia it will not join NATO or any other foreign alliance for 20 years. And tell CNN to refocus its hysteria on surging crime in New York City and Chicago.

So far, one of the few American politicians to get this right is Donald Trump.