They called us Covid conspiracy theorists...

originally posted by: Edumakated
a reply to: Madviking

My childrens' pediatrician was excoriated on the local facebook / social media groups because she dared publicly say that masking children was ineffective and not good (concerned about the mental effects of constant masking of young children in school). It was crazy to see all these Karens attacking her and trying to hurt the business she built her. Nothing you can say to many of these people will get them to just chill out and hear other view points.

They are victims of the monolithic narratives.

Going back to the point of the thread, now they are admitting that all but n95 + masks don't do much for Covid. After all that, and after all people such as your pediatrician went through..

a reply to: Edumakated

You will laugh, but i'm being headhunted as we speak for a position with one of these relevant organizations of my own op..

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: Edumakated

At this point, instead of calling it conspiracy theories they should just say "spoiler alert".

Well, the problem is there are still a good vocal lot who give fodder to the people who believe in every institution.

For example, there were many early on who were saying it was absolutely nothing, or were picking their words poorly. I know it sounds nitpicky but it was damaging.

That said, those who have authority have screwed the pooch every which direction on this, and they ultimately carry the burden of all responsibility. They didn't do anything right on all of this. I don't think we've really even seen the lions share of ramifications for this yet.

The scariest part after the societal and economic fallout to me is what happens if a truly terrible contagion comes in the near future. People are going to be immediately skeptical, and I can't blame them.

Yes, there are some fringe comments in the opposition that don't help. That's true with almost all major issues.

"OMG the Iraq War is really about Ancient Alien Stargates in Iraq."

One thing, to your point, that is a consistent frustration of mine is that for any societal issue for which opposition is demonized, from questions about identity politics to Covid policy, too often those who might articulate best in a professional manner real critiques, are publicly silent due to the danger to them professionally or socially. So what this leaves only is some of the wilder fringe groups and voices to present critiques, some of which are valid and some of which are not. Then, the establishment points to these fringe groups as evidence that only insane people question the narratives.

a reply to: Madviking

You're absolutely right. The people who are renowned are self censorshiping, and the proxy mouthpieces speak in hyperbole.

Then the people loyal to the cause try to out loyal each other and speak in furthering extremes. It happens with every issue now a days.

The best thing to do IMO is speak calmly, extend small olive branches by telling opposition you see where they're coming from on certain aspects, point out what parts of your own "side" you know needs to be worked on... And work from there.

a reply to: Edumakated

It's not conspiracy. We're just spoiling the narrative.

a reply to: [post=26320386]CriticalStinker[on-site.

I work with a Karen. They are inflexible.

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: Madviking

You're absolutely right. The people who are renowned are self censorshiping, and the proxy mouthpieces speak in hyperbole.

Then the people loyal to the cause try to out loyal each other and speak in furthering extremes. It happens with every issue now a days.

The best thing to do IMO is speak calmly, extend small olive branches by telling opposition you see where they're coming from on certain aspects, point out what parts of your own "side" you know needs to be worked on... And work from there.

Agreed, and also focus on rational, reasonable arguments and evidence. Acknowledging their viewpoint, focusing in on basic, evidenced points. Planting seeds so to speak.

originally posted by: Madviking
a reply to: Edumakated

At this point, I'd be willing to accept a tacit admission by leadership dropping so many of the failed policies, so we can attempt to just move on.

You're can't be serious...

No. Just no. People need to HANG for what they have done.

a reply to: Madviking

Mate if you will notice most of the People who were on ATS calling us Conspiracy theorist have Magically disappeared and or created new accounts.

I think if a truly deadly contagion were ever to strike us as globally that the evidence would direct humanity appropriately, ie. bodies in the streets and corpses being removed from homes.

We wouldn’t be relying on statistics and opinions. It would be self evident and the reaction would begin locally and lead to countries leaders being forced by the public to meet and develop and implement a plan.

Not this top down retardation of a response and power crazy directives.

People will react differently when the evidence is everywhere and unmistakably catastrophic.

a reply to: CriticalStinker

originally posted by: rickymouse
I am not against the medical industry,

I am... 1000%.

That said, I am not against individual doctors. But the industry as a whole? Yep. Every single bit of it.

originally posted by: Edumakated
a reply to: Madviking

My childrens' pediatrician was excoriated on the local facebook / social media groups because she dared publicly say that masking children was ineffective and not good (concerned about the mental effects of constant masking of young children in school). It was crazy to see all these Karens attacking her and trying to hurt the business she built her. Nothing you can say to many of these people will get them to just chill out and hear other view points.

I agree but if we are not going to be the followers why use their constant controlling slang?
The people attacking her could be any sex and any type why use their chosen and mind controlling word?

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: [post=26320386]CriticalStinker[on-site.

I work with a Karen. They are inflexible.

There's an apocalyptic pandemic of Karens, to be sure. Covid 19 mandates have awoken their internal-Karen identity.

Not Conspiracy Theorist . . .

I prefer "Early Adopter"

or maybe "Early Not Adopter" . . .

originally posted by: Madviking
"Difference between Covid conspiracy and acknowledged fact is about 6 months." -Tomb of the Unknown Tweeter

For the past two years, many of us who have been doing our own research and also have a healthy awareness of the the misdeeds of government past, have been correctly calling many Covid issues well in advance of the mainstream media and the supposed "experts" at the CDC. If I (like others), was able to figure out these next steps or issues surrounding Covid using publiclly available data, and published studies before and during Covid, PHD
experts in these leading organizations should have been able to too. The fact that they have pushed false narratives, inaccurate data, and failed policies while censoring credible counterpoints and evidence, only leads me to suspect they really do have ulterior motives and are gaslighting us.

How many doctors or leaders have signed on to these problematic narratives, often quite publicly? How many are pushing endless lockdowns, mask mandates, and vaccine mandates? How many including Fauci pushed continuing school shut downs throughout 2021 when the evidence was clear that kids were very low risk and k-12 schools weren't a primary vector of spread, AND, kids' education and emotional well-being was being severely affected? How many are still pushing vaccines for little children, when less than 700 children have died in the US from covid, mostly those with severe comorbidities? How many would gleefully fire and destroy the careers of millions of people who don't want to get vaccinated, many of whom have naturally-acquired immunity? How many of them denied the existence of this group of people with natural immunity until literally the last few months? How many medical leaders, social media platforms, and politicians suppressed any potential cures that were generic, existing, time tested, and not lucrative for Big Pharma and control?

Leaders such as Fauci and public health organizations such as the CDC have dealt a horrible blow to the credibility of the the medical profession and relevant organizations. They can only blame themselves.

I literally had a woman online with a PHD in molecular biology recently tell me that "she knew the science and natural immunity isn't legitimate," one month before these recent studies showing previous infection likely imbued superior immunity to vaccination for Delta. LOL! What is wrong with these people? I actually am a strong supporter of real scientific inquiry, so I find these cynical hacks to be disturbing.

I did not enter 2020 being extremely skeptical of the mainstream medical establishment, nor such organizations as the WHO or CDC. I did know about the dangers of Big Pharma. As of today, my perspective has changed deeply.

Never underestimate the power of opportunity and grant funding, especially in a public health crisis.

a reply to: TzarChasm

Billy Gates saw opportunity all right.

I like that

originally posted by: sraven
Not Conspiracy Theorist . . .

I prefer "Early Adopter"

or maybe "Early Not Adopter" . . .

originally posted by: underpass61
a reply to: TzarChasm

Billy Gates saw opportunity all right.

And was it not Dr. Fauci in 2017 who stated that he guaranteed there would be a pandemic soon?

There will be a surprise epidemic: Fauci 2017

Dr. Anthony Fauci, the U.S. government’s top infectious disease specialist, warned in early 2017 that a “surprise outbreak” would occur during the Trump administration, and he said that more needed to be done to prepare for a pandemic.

“There is no question that there will be a challenge to the coming administration in the arena of infectious diseases,” he said in a speech titled “Pandemic Preparedness in the Next Administration” at Georgetown University Medical Center. He delivered it just days before Trump was inaugurated on Jan. 20, 2017.

Why thank you Lord Fauci, you should set up a psychic hotline a la 90's.

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: Madviking
"Difference between Covid conspiracy and acknowledged fact is about 6 months." -Tomb of the Unknown Tweeter

For the past two years, many of us who have been doing our own research and also have a healthy awareness of the the misdeeds of government past, have been correctly calling many Covid issues well in advance of the mainstream media and the supposed "experts" at the CDC. If I (like others), was able to figure out these next steps or issues surrounding Covid using publiclly available data, and published studies before and during Covid, PHD
experts in these leading organizations should have been able to too. The fact that they have pushed false narratives, inaccurate data, and failed policies while censoring credible counterpoints and evidence, only leads me to suspect they really do have ulterior motives and are gaslighting us.

How many doctors or leaders have signed on to these problematic narratives, often quite publicly? How many are pushing endless lockdowns, mask mandates, and vaccine mandates? How many including Fauci pushed continuing school shut downs throughout 2021 when the evidence was clear that kids were very low risk and k-12 schools weren't a primary vector of spread, AND, kids' education and emotional well-being was being severely affected? How many are still pushing vaccines for little children, when less than 700 children have died in the US from covid, mostly those with severe comorbidities? How many would gleefully fire and destroy the careers of millions of people who don't want to get vaccinated, many of whom have naturally-acquired immunity? How many of them denied the existence of this group of people with natural immunity until literally the last few months? How many medical leaders, social media platforms, and politicians suppressed any potential cures that were generic, existing, time tested, and not lucrative for Big Pharma and control?

Leaders such as Fauci and public health organizations such as the CDC have dealt a horrible blow to the credibility of the the medical profession and relevant organizations. They can only blame themselves.

I literally had a woman online with a PHD in molecular biology recently tell me that "she knew the science and natural immunity isn't legitimate," one month before these recent studies showing previous infection likely imbued superior immunity to vaccination for Delta. LOL! What is wrong with these people? I actually am a strong supporter of real scientific inquiry, so I find these cynical hacks to be disturbing.

I did not enter 2020 being extremely skeptical of the mainstream medical establishment, nor such organizations as the WHO or CDC. I did know about the dangers of Big Pharma. As of today, my perspective has changed deeply.

Never underestimate the power of opportunity and grant funding, especially in a public health crisis.

I agree for sure, and some of the perverse financial incentives to medical organizations and researchers explains some of their compliance, but those who issued those incentives had larger plans.

a reply to: Madviking

For posterity, and regarding reported statistics on covid hospitalizations.

A recent scandal in the US is that almost half of "covid hospitalizations" were from people going to the hospital for other conditions such as broken arm, then getting tested for Covid and being positive. THen, they were included in the reported numbers for covid hospitalizations.

Half of Boston covid hospitalizations incidental

Oh wow, seems these dishonest stats are being employed in Ireland too, oh my!

Half of Irish covid hospitalizations incidental

OMG New York 40% covid hospitalization incidental

New statistics show that more than 40 percent of the state’s hospitalized coronavirus-infected patients were admitted for “non-COVID reasons” — with the ratio in New York City “about 50-50,” Gov. Kathy Hochul said Friday.

Wednesday’s statewide 42 percent figure was up from 39 percent Tuesday, Hochul said during a news conference in Manhattan.

Hochul noted that there were wide “variations in our different parts of the state” between people “in the hospital for COVID vs. non-COVID reasons.”

“The most number of people admitted for non-COVID reasons as of … a couple days ago are in New York City. It’s about 50-50,” she said.