Fing Plastic

originally posted by: pteridine
There goes the "promise" of wind power. Wait until the world learns about the big piles of used blades that will be laying about and, at present, are not recyclable. "Green Power" is not nearly as green as the propaganda says it is.
One solution is to burn non-recyclable used plastics for power. In a high temperature combustor with scrubbers, all of the nasty stuff is broken down or filtered out.

Good point about "green" energy.
Solar is another issue with the same problems as wind power-massive energy cost to produce,relativley short lifespan,as yet unrecycleable.

How many solar panels are made using coal as the energy source for manufacturing?
Green isn't always as green as it claims to be sadly.

They have found microplastics in sea life 11 kilometers down, in the Marianas Trench

a reply to: putnam6

I was going to say hemp too!

hashmuseum.com...#:~:text=Hemp%20grows%20prolifically%2C%20making%20it,( oil%2Dbased%20plastics).

It seems reasonable that microplastic could be cracked into it's molecular components and returned to petroleum from whence it came. And reused as fuel for cars that are mostly plastic now.

If interested, a sound investment in this technology might be advised.


nationalhempcoop.us...

originally posted by: FauxMulder

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: FauxMulder
Like I said in the OP, the plastic industry spends millions every year convincing everyone this isn't a problem and makes it look as if most of it IS being recycled.

Coke and Pepsi, who helped contribute to the mentality that all their packaging gets recycled, are the two largest recipients of SNAP/EBT money spent by those who are on the plans so they are poisoning you at both ends of the process.

I have to admit I've always been a big Coke drinker. But I've more and more been trying to drink tea instead of soda. That ish is delicious though.

I make the most delicious ice tea in the world, and you can too.
Get a large acrylic infuser pitcher on Amazon.
Get a ripe Honeydew melon at the market, The skin will have a slight tackyness to them. Dusty like smooth ones are not ripe.
Fill your infuser with melon chunks, and drop 6 quality tea bags such as PG Tips in the pitcher, and fill it to the top with cold filtered water, letting it steep for a day or two.

Sometimes I will have 3 large pitchers going in the fridge, all with different fruit. Strawberries, blueberries, Cara cara oranges, Ambrosia apples, Meyers lemons, Texas red grapefruits.

If you use sugar, try raw organic turbinado style.

originally posted by: new_here
a reply to: putnam6

I was going to say hemp too!

hashmuseum.com...#:~:text=Hemp%20grows%20prolifically%2C%20making%20it,( oil%2Dbased%20plastics).

IIRC one reason Ganja was made illegal and demonised so much was due to lobbying by major synthetic chemical companies including Dupont,who knew full well hemp is a far superior and sustainable material for making many materials from than the chemical # they pushed on us.
The other reason was that government racists could use the newly designated"Evil" plant to demonise those who didn't have the "correct" skin pigmentation.

Mother nature gave us so many wonderful miracles,hemp being one IMO.
And what did humans do with these miracles?

We ground them into dust under our heels so the greedy evil demonic people could collect more money and continue to opress.

a reply to: visitedbythem

I'll have to try this, thanks

and you can too.

This made me LOL. From that point forward I read it in a Billy Mays infomercial voice. Hahaha

originally posted by: FauxMulder
a reply to: MrRCflying

Probably why some cities have started to make you BYOB.

I use shopping bags but thanks to covid the stores make you pack your own.They won't touch them yet they will pack in plastic the very products you just had your hands all over. So sensible.

a reply to: Asktheanimals

I find it funny that we all rush to use the "self checkout" now. We are doing their jobs and helping them cut costs.

Then we have this going on... Some good news at least.

Estimates of marine plastic stocks, a major threat to marine life, are far lower than expected from exponentially-increasing litter inputs, suggesting important loss factors. These may involve microbial degradation, as the plastic-degrading polyethylene terephthalate enzyme (PETase) has been reported in marine microbial communities. An assessment of 416 metagenomes of planktonic communities across the global ocean identifies 68 oceanic PETase variants (oPETase) that evolved from ancestral enzymes degrading polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons. Twenty oPETases show predicted efficiencies comparable to those of laboratory-optimized PETases, suggesting strong selective pressures directing the evolution of these enzymes. We found oPETases in 90.1% of samples across all oceans and depths, particularly abundant at 1,000 m depth, with a strong dominance of Pseudomonadales containing putative highly-efficient oPETase variants in the dark ocean. Enzymatic degradation may be removing plastic from the marine environment while providing a carbon source for bathypelagic microbial communities.

Then we have this...seems all this plastics likes to collect in some areas in the Pacific.

According to the Ocean Cleanup Foundation, “the Great Pacific Garbage Patch (GPGP) covers an estimated surface area of 1.6 million square kilometers, an area twice the size of Texas or three times the size of France.”

Of course plastic is in the food chain. We put it there!

Does anyone here know what "partially hydrogenated soybean oil" is? It's all over the place; margarine (fake butter) is made from it. Manufacturers take soybeans, press them to remove the oil, then force hydrogen into that oil under high pressure. The hydrogen bonds with the oil molecules and forms longer molecules of hydrocarbons, aka polymers. What is a polymer? In the vernacular we call it "plastic."

Yes, that's right... that smooth, yellow, better-for-you-than-butter stuff that you buy at the grocery store to put on that steaming baked 'tater or use to cook with? It's yellow plastic. That's why it's better for you than butter... your digestive tract can't absorb it. It's pretty much inert.

It's also not really yellow. That's food coloring. It's more of a dull grey before they put the food coloring in. Doesn't really have a taste either; that's flavoring.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here's the science for anyone who wants to follow it: Plastic is a catch-all name for a whole litany of various materials. It covers polypropylene, polystyrene, polyester, nylon, teflon, and a whole range of other trade names and poly-somethings. Nature even produces plastics... what do you think natural rubber is? It's a plastic.

All a plastic is, is a long chain of hydrocarbon molecules that have bonded together. Hydrocarbon chains have the ability to bend easily, giving plastic its name. Some chains bend easier than others, meaning those materials are more flexible than others. Some chains tend to be difficult to bend because of the specific atoms in them, giving us more rigid plastics. Any hydrocarbon chain can be used to make a plastic... that includes plant oils, crude oil, even animal fats. Most plastic is still made from crude oil, but a good deal is also being made from plant oils now.

Most plastic is also non-toxic. That's one big reason for its widespread use. It's not the toxicity that becomes the problem, though... it's the buildup over time. That margarine passes right through you like water through a funnel and eggs through a hen... other plastics, not so much. They can get hung up in our digestive systems and, while not really dangerous, do tend to slow things down. The real danger to wildlife is not the toxicity in the food chain, but the shapes and the fact that plastics can stretch and bend, leading to all sorts of problematic encounters. Quite a few animals die every year from sporting those new fashionable neckties made from a six-pack ring. Smaller pieces can get lodged in throats and cause suffocation.

In short, it is not that plastic is bad... plastic is misused.

I remember a time not all that long ago when one would buy groceries in these big paper bags. Then for some reason, people decided that paper was bad because we were killing trees (folks, there is no tree shortage... one look out any of my windows will verify that. Get out of the city and see for yourself, because those idiots on TV are lying to you). I liked paper bags... they were strong (at least when dry), large enough to reuse as garbage bags, and they folded up nice and flat for future use. Plus, they would turn into dirt in less than a year in a landfill. No, no, we had to go plastic! Plastic was the wave of the future! Now we use these flimsy little bags that have thicknesses one can measure in nanometers, tend to tear and stretch under the slightest load, and aren't big enough to use for most things. They do not fold up nice and flat... keep a few around and they're a major eyesore. And they do not degrade in landfills! Leave these things for ten years, and they're still a plastic bag.

No, we switched because they are cheap and the grocers didn't want to spend money on paper. Now that plastic is bad (worse), they want us to bring our own bags! Apparently they think they shouldn't spend $0.001 (that's right, 1/10 of a penny) so we can carry groceries to the car. And what do we do? We talk about how wonderfully "environmentally friendly" it is to use reusable bags.

We had reusable, environmentally-friendly bags and they were a thank you from the people we bought groceries from. We rejected that.

-----------------------------------------------

A quick point on why plastic is made from crude oil. Plastic is not a byproduct of making fuel. Tar is a byproduct of making fuel. Fuel is simply the result of partially distilling crude oil. You heat it to a certain temperature, the lighter hydrocarbon chains turn to gas, you collect and cool the gas, and you have one grade of fuel. Then you heat it to a higher temperature, do the same thing again, and you get another grade of fuel. Eventually, you're left with a messy, tarry substance that doesn't turn into any grade of fuel... that gets used in one of two ways: as an additive for asphalt, or as a source to make plastic from.

That's the quick and dirty explanation anyway. There are a lot of details left out, but one should be able to get my gist. The point is that plastic is a way to reuse that messy, tarry crap that we can't burn as fuel. If we didn't turn it into plastic, it would still be called "pollution." At least plastic is a bit easier to clean up than oil.

I just had to buy a scan tool for my car. It's a small device based around a computer chip. Inside, it is made on a circuit board which is etched copper traces on a plastic backing. That is screwed into a hard plastic case, nice and thick to make it "rugged." It came in a plastic formed clear wrapping. That entire thing was encased in several layers of plastic bubble wrap. That was all packed into a cardboard box which has a thin plastic coating and is sealed with plastic tape. then a plastic-coated shipping label is applied with more plastic tape.

Why? Because plastic is cheap. It isn't strong, so we have to use more of it, but it's cheap enough so we can use more of it without spending much money. So we use a LOT of plastic, even where we don't need a lot of plastic! if we used plastic responsibly, it would indeed be the boon to mankind that we were once told it was. But that would require us to actually listen to and understand science... much easier to listen to people we don't know but who must be smart because they're inside that flat screen somehow.

TheRedneck

None of it's good but there is a bigger problem than just simply plastic in the oceans

Dumped fishing gear is biggest plastic polluter in ocean, finds report

Lost and abandoned fishing gear which is deadly to marine life makes up the majority of large plastic pollution in the oceans, according to a report by Greenpeace.

More than 640,000 tonnes of nets, lines, pots and traps used in commercial fishing are dumped and discarded in the sea every year, the same weight as 55,000 double-decker buses.

Draw your own conclusions to the problem ... peace

Don't forget that most of your clothes ate made from plastics as well.

Polyesters(including fleece/microfleece, polyurethane, PVC, acrylic, rayon/viscose, nylon/polyamide, Elastane(Spandex,Lycra)

And even the "eco-friendly" Tencel, Lyocell, and Modal textiles create the same issues.

Even the plastics that do get recycled still leech and disperse microplastics into the environment.

Going further, along with what Augustus brought up is also all the materials we use that have teflon or other non-stick/water-proofing chemicals you use.

Pots and pans, plastic cooking ware, and such leech that crap into the foods you cook, it's in car wash products, athletic gear, hiking/camping gear.

Plastic/rubber materials are literally in everything we use and throw away.

You're bedsheets, clothing, hygiene products, electronics, your mode of transportation, writing utensils, medical equipment, etc. The list goes on and on.

This crap is even in your toothpaste, shampoo, eye drops, you name it.

Unless you are 100 percent on top of what you consume and how it's made, you are literally bathing and eating the crap.

a reply to: FauxMulder

First of all, GREAT OP! S&F!

Second, plastic is the poison of the planet (and I'm not even an enviro-freak). I was stationed over in SE Asia for several years and I swear, you couldn't go into a store where they wouldn't try to push a plastic bag on you. If you denied taking a bag for your sale, they'd chase you out of the store trying to make you take one! I'm not kidding either! They would dump Cokes out of a completely bio-degradable glass bottle and pour them into a plastic bag (about glass sized with ice inside) and put a straw in it. They were completely NUTS about plastic bags.

When you were out on the S. China Sea, like I often was, there was no end to the plastic trash floating in the water. You just knew it would never degrade. The only thing which pissed me off more than the plastic pollution was the trawl nets which just wiped out hundreds of square miles of reef coral. And, you see, this is the problem...when you start getting really motivated about one problem, you discover an even bigger, more immediate, problem and get distracted.

Greta Thunberg (or whatever her name is) and Al Gore, can sit down and SHUT UP about environmental "carbon credits" (which are really just a tax, and insignificant) until they address the Asian pollution of the oceans!!

And, do you know why these people don't do exactly that???? Because...it's HARD. And, they don't do anything which is HARD. They only do things which Sad-Sack people will pay money just to make their "feelz" feel better!

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Yea, man. I've been across the Atlantic all the way up into the North Atlantic and don't remember seeing much if ANY trash. Then being in the pacific you couldn't miss it. And I wasn't even close to Asia. Mostly around South America. I can only imagine what the South China sea looks like.

originally posted by: Xtrozero
Then we have this going on... Some good news at least.

Estimates of marine plastic stocks, a major threat to marine life, are far lower than expected from exponentially-increasing litter inputs, suggesting important loss factors. These may involve microbial degradation, as the plastic-degrading polyethylene terephthalate enzyme (PETase) has been reported in marine microbial communities. An assessment of 416 metagenomes of planktonic communities across the global ocean identifies 68 oceanic PETase variants (oPETase) that evolved from ancestral enzymes degrading polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons. Twenty oPETases show predicted efficiencies comparable to those of laboratory-optimized PETases, suggesting strong selective pressures directing the evolution of these enzymes. We found oPETases in 90.1% of samples across all oceans and depths, particularly abundant at 1,000 m depth, with a strong dominance of Pseudomonadales containing putative highly-efficient oPETase variants in the dark ocean. Enzymatic degradation may be removing plastic from the marine environment while providing a carbon source for bathypelagic microbial communities.

Then we have this...seems all this plastics likes to collect in some areas in the Pacific.

According to the Ocean Cleanup Foundation, “the Great Pacific Garbage Patch (GPGP) covers an estimated surface area of 1.6 million square kilometers, an area twice the size of Texas or three times the size of France.”

All well and good until they mutate and your car starts to decompose. LOL

Honestly, it is one form of pollution replacing the other. It may be causing a proliferation of these organisms and upset the balance of the oceans. Probably too early to tell.

a reply to: FauxMulder

We actually had procedures for "de-plastic-ing" our gear, because that S*** WILL foul your gear! And, if you get enough of it on you, it will tangle you up. Nylon rope is always a hazard, but this stuff will get on you and tangle you up as bad, if not worse, than nylon rope!! Especially, if the water/visibility (low viz) get's bad. People freak out. And it only tangles them up worse! I've had divers completely freaking out, just spazzing to the max. You almost have to slam them off a bulkhead to get them to calm down, and just relax. All they're doing by freaking out is burning air (and a LOT of it), and if you pin them, just make them calm down; you can cut them free.

originally posted by: new_here
a reply to: putnam6

I was going to say hemp too!

hashmuseum.com...#:~:text=Hemp%20grows%20prolifically%2C%20making%20it,( oil%2Dbased%20plastics).

Cool site

I can't even remember the book it was in but it was back in the 80's reading about how William Randolph Hearst demonized hemp and marijuana because it threatened his lumber and paper companies. Even then they were using hemp for hundreds of things

My dad was a plastics engineer for General Motors. They sold his ideas to other companies that could utilize what he'd designed. For example, when I was in kindergarten, 1961-62, he had a leather-like plastic "brief case" he carried around. It was soft plastic with a plastic toothless zipper that went either direction. I was fascinated. That idea was sold off as Ziplock baggies.
There are more and I feel bad that he was so inventive. He did not gain from the patents, that was GM. He just got his salary. But his legacy is that of destructive permanence.
My conscience's saving grace is that my dad was an only child, and his prodigy of 3 sons could not produce a single male to carry on the name, so there is that.
Maybe the Mandela Effect can make the Great Pacific Plastic Patch never happen!!

Half a pound of plastic a year in my fish?

Im a bit skeptical of that number.

a reply to: FauxMulder