Final Conclusions Regarding UFOs

Since ATS and/or the UFO forum may be going away, I thought it only civil to wrap up a few things, and if anyone has been shy about asking me anything, now's your chance.

Regarding the USG and 'UFOs'
Assuming the USG 'knows all about 'UFOs' is like assuming the Pope 'knows all about god'. It's a complete non-starter. Yes, the USG has massive resources, and yes, there have been many unstable personalities within the USG over the years, who have attempted to spend taxpayer dollars on their private aspiration to be Fox Mulder. If you get to know any of these folks, I think you will find that they are all attempting to 'trade up' -- for example the 'aviary' kept trying to 'trade up'; some of the individuals that the 'aviary' was attempting to trade up to, was themselves attempting to 'trade up' to even higher 'authorities'. It's like a traffic accident; everyone is going "go around idiot", "go around" to everyone, while they are themselves such an idiot. All available information (and there's a fair amount of it) indicates that the USG is a Russian Doll within Doll sort of thing, where everyone assumes there is something there, if ONLY they had higher clearance, while the final guy with ridiculous clearance, also wishes to find someone more in the know than they themselves are. In the final analysis, if you take out 'metaphysical things', you are left with only the Null Hypothesis.

Regarding the USG and Metaphysical Things
The USG has been infiltrating occult groups since forever, and there certainly have been many of the same individuals referenced in the previous section who are poking around with ghosts and such, on the taxpayer's dime. Now there are the two major divisions, that being the Christian "it's all demons" (and some Gnostics "It's Archons") and then the non-religiously inclined pseudoscience/occultists types.

Now I'll be the last person to say, that occult things don't exist, but occult does just mean 'hidden', and I for one like to say that 'occult things' are simply undiscovered laws of physics.. of course it may be that we are 'turtles all the way down' with the 'laws of physics' being just simulated nonsense, but then that would indicate there are 'magical laws', and any sort of laws are still laws, and may as well be called 'undiscovered laws of physics'. It's a good general term.

The thing is, with the occult, that humans are capable of infinite self-deception, and the human brain is actually a virtual reality generator carried around by legs. If you go into enough of a 'shamanic frenzy' you can completely break with reality and experience almost anything you want 'inside of your virtual reality generator'.

So if you manage to pull off some rare 'shamanic thing' , are you just burrowing into your own brain and showing yourself movies? Or are you affecting the 'real world'? Perhaps both?

There's certainly been enough effects in the physical world associated with 'paranormal events', or there certainly SEEMS to be. It's very slippery stuff to prove.

And that's the point.

I highly suspect that the reason the USG isn't 'interested in the 'real UFOs' is that they have chased it around a whole bunch, and while they 'believe in it', Casper has not cooperate for them either, and has not allowed himself to be captured and dissected for them either.

But if 'real disclosure' is something like "sometimes occult critters / ghosts" really exist, that's the LAST thing the USG would put out there. Instead, they'd ram nuts and bolts UFOs down our throats, which is exactly what they've been doing since day one.

Now of course, the false belief in nuts and bolts UFOs has been vigorously put forward by the USG, (either by promoting as in Rosewell) or even more effectively by denying (you want what is denied to you), to cover black project operations.

Good or Evil Spirits
If there really is something 'spiritual' out there, whether you want to call it 'spirit' or 'demon' or 'djinn' or 'plasma' or 'Boltzmann brains'; it doesn't matter what you call it, all those concepts are wrong IMHO, the question always comes down to, are the 'hypothetical spirits' 'good' or 'evil'?

Well, humans killed about 1 billion cattle in the year 2014; those innocent, peaceful, inoffensive cattle.. I had one as a pet as a kid.. it licked my hand and wanted me to pet it. Later that year, I found it's carcass hanging upside down from tree as it was being skinned and gutted by my stepfather. The same stepfather who killed my pet rabbit, fried it up and forced me to eat it.

So are humans 'evil'? the cattle would probably think so, if they were a bit more aware.

Humans want 'good and evil' so that they can switch their brains off; they also want a 'free lunch' from some metaphysical sky daddy, who will kiss their boo boos and tell them that they are the center of all creation.

We've no evidence that sort of thinking is rational or effective in any way. Living creatures compete with some, predate on some, and cooperate with some.. if 'hypothetical spirits' exist, almost certainly they would live based on 'self-interest' like any other living thing, and it would be pointless to call them 'good or evil'.

Now, finally, is it valid to say that 'spirits' are more evil than good? Well, contrary to much wailing and gnashing of teeth, 'spirits' have never been observed to help anybody (rare exceptions, but it was due to self-interest no doubt). So that would APPEAR to make them 'evil' to a human being, who worships himself and his species as being special.

What I do know, is that humans beings are busy exterminating all life on Earth.. we don't need to worry about metaphysical boogey men, real or not; we should stop our own madness first.

Is Chasing after UFOs / Metaphysics Worth it?
I'd recommend that we stop the destruction of all life on Earth FIRST; do useful things for humans and stop being so savage and heartless to the rest of Earth's ecosystem. THEN sure.

But be very careful of course. Nothing will screw up someone faster than chasing after 'UFOs' and "the occult". (or god or your own soul, it's all the same stuff).

The human brain just CRAVES certainty, which then leads to a bit of mental illness when taken too far.. it's how we evolved.. we simply MUST, most of us, poke around the edges of reality looking for more. It's how we evolved.

It's really hazardous, and our attempts to scratch this itch, or at least deaden it, is largely behind why we are destroying all life on Earth.
So yah... getting to the bottom of that would be very good. But almost nobody would accept the results. What if the answer for our 'occult thirstiness' as a species were discovered to be a couple mangled base pairs of DNA? Who would want to accept that?

Ok... I'll leave it there for now, as a conversation starter.

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

Well done!!

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

Fried rabbit is delicious.

a reply to: TheAlleghenyGentleman

I did not find Commander Fluffers delicious. I've never had rabbit since.

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

Sorry about ol’ commander bigwig fluffers.

Great op.

So sorry about hearing what happened to your pet cow and rabbit.

I used to have a pet rooster...who would chase me down the front yard...till my mother had the working butcher, that lived next door, kill and pluck that rooster. She showed me that plucked rooster, which suddenly shocked an saddened me so much --- that made the image forever locked in my memory.

Though I still partake in the joys of eating meat...every once and awhile.

But that image of that possible foo fighter I saw one night back in 76...has it also forever locked in my memory.

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

So glad you decided to make a last post. You were my favorite UFO theorist and one of the reasons I joined ATS.

I think you’re closer than most people in unraveling this mystery. There’s definitely something there, and I seriously doubt it has anything to do with nuts and bolts craft. Whatever the phenomenon is, it’s intertwined with us as experiencers. I believe it’s all connected. UFOs, ghosts, certain cryptids.

I’ve had a belief for a while that certain ideas focus our collective intent as a species. When something is believed by enough people it gives it power. Maybe even enough to manifest in a physical way depending on the idea. This may be how the power of prayer works as well. It’s a deep rabbit hole, and thank you for contributing what you have to this site. As someone who’s had multiple ufo and paranormal experiences it’s led me to a better understanding of what we’re dealing with.

If you’re involved in other forums where you discuss this type of thing send me a PM. If ATS goes down I’d like to continue to pick your brain. Thanks for the ideas you’ve brought here.

a reply to: underwerks

Thank you very much for the kind words.

I'd consider posting on another forum, but i'm not aware of any such forum at this time where i'd feel comfortable. I certainly have no interest in Q-CHAN Q-KUN, etc.

As for this:

I’ve had a belief for a while that certain ideas focus our collective intent as a species. When something is believed by enough people it gives it power. Maybe even enough to manifest in a physical way depending on the idea.

I talked to George P. Hansen and a Canadian parapsychologist Eric Ouellet about this,
(you might consider reading this book: ILLUMINATIONS: The UFO Experience as a Parapsychological Event)

There's also an offshoot of the Princeton PEAR project that tracks this sort of thing.

I'm not certain they've made their case.

But i'm certainly open to the 'accidental summoning hypothesis'.

I think there's a missing element that has not been accounted for, in this sort of thinking, or that it's possibly just wrong; but I personally do not think that it's entirely wrong; just that we are missing something.

You can pick my brain some more in this thread if that's helpful. I don't know how long the lights will be on at ATS/UFO Forum.
I'd imagine that some folks don't like that this forum even exists here and it's pretty convenient it may be going away.

We are expected to remain prisoners of the current disinformation initiative you know, the pablum for the masses that we are supposed to swallow.

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

I don't know, I've heard so many credible witnesses describing UFOs as being nuts and bolts crafts with "space people" in side of them that I find any other explanation to be lacking.

Probably the best evidence of them being physical craft is that accounts by witnesses have changed over the decades. Alien craft have become more technologically advanced. The first reports described metal struts with rivets and display screens like television sets. They eventually became seamless craft with holographic displays. It stands to reason that a craft made by an alien species would become more and more advanced over the decades. Which is exactly what people are reporting.

People are also reporting different types of UFO. Just like we have different makes and models of aircraft. We've got saucers and triangles and cigar shaped craft, and a variety of species being described as piloting them. Just as you would have with human space travel. A Chinese space craft would look different from an American one, and the occupants would look different as well.

a reply to: Erno86

Everything is food for something else; I don't mind that I grew up as a farm boy. You have to grow up fast, and that's ok.

a reply to: AaarghZombies

When a person experiences a 'genuine' 'UFO' their senses do not belong to them at all,
some other process is in total control.

I know that people want to believe in sky daddies, unicorns and nuts and bolts 'ufos'.

But 'reality' is a pretty slippery place; one cannot trust one's senses, as any scientist
or any informed person would tell you.

'My' CE5 'UFO' encounter looked 100% nuts and bolts, AT FiRST.. only the bolts never changed in
size no matter how far away the 'craft' travelled. i won't go into the shape-changing,
and all the 'weird things'. 'UFOs' can look like a stealth fighter or a ham sandwich or
anything in-between.

originally posted by: KellyPrettyBear
Now of course, the false belief in nuts and bolts UFOs has been vigorously put forward by the USG, (either by promoting as in Rosewell) or even more effectively by denying (you want what is denied to you), to cover black project operations.

I don't see that nuts and bolts ufos have been discredited. The evidence is that they are 'interdimensional beings'/spirits is strong and the evidence that they are physical is also strong. So why can't they be both? Perhaps they are spirits from other worlds who can enter physical reality in physical bodies that are appropriate to their nature. This is what the evidence suggests. It doesn't have to be one or the other. Are we ourselves not incarnate spirits?

I'm seeing multiple posts today about ATS 'going away'. Did the sale fall through?

a reply to: EnPassant

Good point.

I meant 'standard nuts and bolts' using the standard laws of physics from our regular space/time.

One of the major differences between matter and energy is the higgs boson.

So if something can either control the higgs field/boson or is not affected by it,
then it might be 'solid' (even nuts and bolts) in a manner of speaking, with it's
'home dimensions laws of physics' so to speak, and might have total control over
it's appearance and 'solidity' when 'here'.

I talked to JV about this quite a lot.

Now.. there ALSO might be 'regular nuts and bolts' UFOs somewhere in our universe, but they
don't seem to have visited here yet.. at least there is no evidence for it (yet).

Kev

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

I wasn't aware of the current state of ATS, but if it's so I would like to stop by and tell that for some reason I've always liked your view on these subjects and discussing certain theories. Always the challenge (in a good way), always interesting food for thought!

One advice stood out to me though, and I'm aware I'm paraphrasing you but it was something along the lines of "besides all this, never forget to be happy and chase your pupps". I don't have dogs, but I still took that one away.

Thanks Kev!

a reply to: zeroPointOneQ

I have enjoyed conversations with you too!

It's true; rarely do our obsessions make us happy.

Pupp dogs are just happy.. unless they are all alone or abused.

Much to learn from them.

Kev

a reply to: vlawde

I have no idea!

I saw the 'for sale sign' go away.. I don't know how to take that.

But in any case, I'm not active in research any more.. it seemed wise to
do a recap post.

I dunno why but I’m strangely aroused by this OP.

Maybe the way the tangents are folded in?

Our reality/tapestry is what we make it?

The Synchronicity?

Wow. That was fun! Thank you. Golly this a damn fine OP.

originally posted by: underwerks
a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

So glad you decided to make a last post. You were my favorite UFO theorist and one of the reasons I joined ATS.

I think you’re closer than most people in unraveling this mystery. There’s definitely something there, and I seriously doubt it has anything to do with nuts and bolts craft. Whatever the phenomenon is, it’s intertwined with us as experiencers. I believe it’s all connected. UFOs, ghosts, certain cryptids.

I’ve had a belief for a while that certain ideas focus our collective intent as a species. When something is believed by enough people it gives it power. Maybe even enough to manifest in a physical way depending on the idea. This may be how the power of prayer works as well. It’s a deep rabbit hole, and thank you for contributing what you have to this site. As someone who’s had multiple ufo and paranormal experiences it’s led me to a better understanding of what we’re dealing with.

If you’re involved in other forums where you discuss this type of thing send me a PM. If ATS goes down I’d like to continue to pick your brain. Thanks for the ideas you’ve brought here.

Strange. I just started playing this game called Control. It’s a masterpiece and is loosely based on what you’re saying.

I’ve always believed thoughts are things. The Maharishi effect. ME maybe?

I was blown away when I was told not only are they things, but they’re alive. And not only help create our world, but can even interact independently.

See examples:

Birds learning behaviors across the globe they could not have seen in action....

“Improbability Drive” - Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy

“Dream are like fish, they gots to keep breathing” - G. Love
Edit: Apologies Kelly! In no way am I trying to drift this thread. Just food for thought is all...

a reply to: vlawde

I'm seeing multiple posts today about ATS 'going away'. Did the sale fall through?

don't know where they getting their information. SO posted again tonight review of contract with new owners is pending.
hell he is even giving the site a Christmas present, no ads.

We will soon be reviewing the contract.
As a gift to everyone this holiday season, for sticking with us. I'll be turning off all the ads. More as we know it.
SO's post