Why *SHOULD* You believe In Jesus Christ as God/Son of God, etc?

Can anyone come up with any rational reasons? Excluding faith, that is.

Yes, I can tell you why I should believe in him. I have asked for signs and been given them. I have prayed and had prayers answered. I have had numerous other things that you would dismiss as religious speculation and "over faith" or something, but what I can't do is give you proof, and that seems to be your only way in. It seems that unless something is put under your nose it doesn't exist.

Because our ancestors said he was

Totally read the following and attempt to understand:
tektonics.org...

...why excluding faith...

...because faith is not rational is the likely answer...thing is, faith IS rational to those experiencing it.

Now...working in Mental Health I'm well aware that people sometimes have a belief in something that doesn't exist...heck, just this morning I was talking with someone who is certain that the crew of the Enterprise (Star Trek) are attempting to contact him...and the Star Trek episodes he watches are actually real-life real-time transmissions recorded aboard the orbitting Enterprise and being beamed directly to his TV as a means of communication.

Is his belief, his 'faith', irrational?? Oh, in my eyes and the eyes of probably the greater majority of people he'll encounter in life, its completely bonkers. But does that change the strength of his 'faith'? Not a bean.

So whats my point? Probably nothing...maybe just highlighting that sometimes 'rational' is a personal thing, defined by our own personal parametres.



Peace,
ALIEN

Rational is a relative term. When used as a guise for belittlement and self-rightousness, the very definition of 'rational' is self-evident.

Well, let me guess Anarchist......another one of your intellectual traps? Just another case of you showing us just how intelligent you are by proving what anyone has to say as irrational, beyond reason, unfounded, not based on reality, etc.............?

I see no value in the pursuit of this game.....besides the obvious post count received from it.

regards
seekerof

[Edited on 14-7-2003 by Seekerof]

Hey alien one day was confronted by a man who thought he was princess Lia (again in a mental hospital), with my white coat and all that. He took the trouble of saying I was too small to be a storm-trooper (at 5'10 and 180lbs had no idea what he
was talking about) (This for real homeboy).

Primarily the basis for religion as a truism (be it Jesus or for the matter of argument Quexalcote) is fundamentally related to ancestry.

Any thoughts?

ACS in post above I gave this link:
tektonics.org...

After reading what was in that page, read the following:
www.truthnet.org...

Read and then get back to us.

Originally posted by Toltec
Primarily the basis for religion as a truism (be it Jesus or for the matter of argument Quexalcote) is fundamentally related to ancestry.

Any thoughts?

Hmmm...belief being passed down from generation to generation?? Or the strength a previous generation worshipped?? Interesting. And may well have some weight to it. I do know that my own ancestry is principally comprised of people with strong spiritual beliefs...and beliefs that don't (in some ways) conform too well with Christian Doctrine. So, in a way, maybe the beliefs I hold are somewhat 'inherited'...though I think we also 'personalise' and 'customise' that which we believe. Maybe its a case of not so much WHAT we believe...but HOW we believe.


By the way...the "too small to be a StormTrooper" thing cracked me up...



Peace,
ALIEN

Are The Believers winning yet?

Don't worry Tyriffic, we win in the end. Right now the non-believers are supposed to be reading the two web pages I posted. Doubt if they do.

jag,

Are you capable of answering the question in your own words? I think it's unfair to link websites to do your talking for you. Yeah, go read 500 pages of text and get back to me. You have your own thoughts on the subject? Good. Share them here, don't link, that's cheap and defeats the purpose of this forum entirely.

And yes, we know the theists always win in the end. You'll go to your palace in heaven and the non-believers will endure an eternity of damnation. It's very scary to be sure. I shudder to think, that without this belief, what you would do with yourself...

fixx

Originally posted by fixx
jag,

Are you capable of answering the question in your own words? I think it's unfair to link websites to do your talking for you. Yeah, go read 500 pages of text and get back to me. You have your own thoughts on the subject? Good. Share them here, don't link, that's cheap and defeats the purpose of this forum entirely.



fixx

Huh? I thought the purpose was to find the truth and share information, not a contest on who can argue the best - thats what debates are for. I don't think fairness is an issue when you are trying to get a point across to someone......as long as the person hears what you are saying, does it matter how you tell them?

Well Fixx, you can read can't you. You want an answer in 25 words or less? Is you attention span that short? You expect difficult questions to be answered with sound bytes? The person asked a question, and he got an answer. Why should I replicate something that can be accessed at another web site. It is what were are supposed to do to conserve band width. Do you really want to know - I told you and I was called a liar.

.....boil, boil, toil and trouble..

I think he is somewhat capable to do this Fixx.......

By the way, my reply was to Tyriffic - not to you.

Hey, you can prove me wrong if you can, but I recall reading years ago that Voltaire asked for Christ's forgiveness for his philosophic practice on his death bed!....?

[Edited on 14-7-2003 by Tyriffic]

Originally posted by fixx
jag,

Are you capable of answering the question in your own words? I think it's unfair to link websites to do your talking for you. Yeah, go read 500 pages of text and get back to me. You have your own thoughts on the subject? Good. Share them here, don't link, that's cheap and defeats the purpose of this forum entirely.

And yes, we know the theists always win in the end. You'll go to your palace in heaven and the non-believers will endure an eternity of damnation. It's very scary to be sure. I shudder to think, that without this belief, what you would do with yourself...

fixx

Fixx, you going to partake of the topic or just one who runs from topic to topic, pointing out what everyone is or isn't doing?

regards
seekerof

Seeker,

I do not believe in Jesus Christ as God/Son of God, therefore I will not offer any reasoning for the issue. Irony = your response to me after reading your response to anarchist.


Jag,

I would like to respond to you in detail, but please follow my link instead. Read everything there and then report back to me. At that point I will give you another link so you can further understand everything. Once I have had you read half the internet you should understand my point.
www.positiveatheism.org...

fixx

...uhh, didn't he just slam Jagd for link a mania????