I can't take this crap anymore. I need to speak my mind!

originally posted by: JAGStorm

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: alldaylong

The US GDP is losing $25 Billion a day and has been for over a month. We've seen 28,000 deaths in this country. Does anyone with half a rat's ass hair worth of economic knowledge really believe an individual's life is worth $27 million apiece to the nation as a whole?

To me every life is worth that and more.

Then YOU personally fund it. Pretty simple, ya?

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: JAGStorm

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: alldaylong

The US GDP is losing $25 Billion a day and has been for over a month. We've seen 28,000 deaths in this country. Does anyone with half a rat's ass hair worth of economic knowledge really believe an individual's life is worth $27 million apiece to the nation as a whole?

To me every life is worth that and more.

Then YOU personally fund it. Pretty simple, ya?

Then YOU personally fund all the medical care for people that will need it.

www.nytimes.com...

Pastor Who Defied Social Distancing Dies After Contracting Covid-19, Church Says......Ms. Crawley said at the time that her father was on a ventilator at the hospital.

Why should people like him get a ventilator, he didn't believe in social distancing.

Check your PMs

a reply to: JAGStorm

I never said he should get a ventilator. Choices have consequences... let those consequences happen good or bad. That upholds the Constitution, it upholds the concept of equality, due process, and it doesn't deep 6 the entire economy over something that is presently reported as infecting less than 1/10th of 1% of the damn country.

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: PhyllidaDavenport

The Nightingale field Hospital opened with all the pomp & circumstance befitting a campaign victory has had just a few dozen patients

Something we should be celebrating then.

I feel that you are missing the point, but do carry on...

originally posted by: timequake

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: PhyllidaDavenport

The Nightingale field Hospital opened with all the pomp & circumstance befitting a campaign victory has had just a few dozen patients

Something we should be celebrating then.

I feel that you are missing the point, but do carry on...

So you would be happier if these hospitals where full then ?

How odd.

a reply to: alldaylong

The snide part of me wants to say
"What's the point on getting gussied up if we ain't goin' out to dance?"

Now I don't mean that in the way one would think.
But more as, for all the hype, pomp, and circumstance, the return (I suppose thankfully🙄), has been less than exhilarating in general.
There are those who have and are suffering.
But we had those stories and travails well before Corona. And will after.

a reply to: DoctorBluechip

I've seen the manipulation first hand, so I don't need to get my facts straight.
I've heard it from the Health Minister first hand, so I don't need to get my facts straight.

The person passed away with cancer and not any signs of the virus.

originally posted by: chelsealad
The person passed away with cancer and not any signs of the virus.

Then that person died of cancer. If you think that that there has been a corruption of the legal process around the recording of death, then you could whistle-blow. That would at least start an investigation.

To what end would a clinician independently falsify the cause of death? This goes against professional conduct and could be criminal in intent.

a reply to: chelsealad

Hello OP from someone who actually knows what they're talking about, I am a critical care nurse and I honestly don't post much anymore but I think I can address a few of your comments and as someone working on the literal front line of this it might be of interest to you.

First of all the figures are FAKE! MANUFACTURED!
How do I know this??
Because someone know to the Mrs was dying of cancer.
Cause of death on the death certificate? Covid-19!
What an absolute load of garbage

So this is how it works, let say Mrs A has terminal Cancer and has a prognosis of 6-12 months, yet a month after she gets that prognosis she gets COVID-19 and sadly dies. Her life has been cut short by COVID-19 and therefore the cause of death is Covid with underlying terminal cancer. We see this all the time, most Dementia patients don't die from the dementia, lots of COPD patients don't die from the COPD but some nasty chest infection. Let me take this to a total extreme to try to make it a little clearer. Lets say poor Mrs A has made it to 11 months but has days to live so is in the back of a ambulance on her way to a hospice when the ambulance crashes and she dies....cause of death is going to be the trauma of the crash isn't it.

"A Dr will put Covid-19 as the cause of death " IF " they " they feel" or "suspect" it may of been a contributing factor.
What no test? Just that you cannot be bothered to test?

When this happens its usually because they know it was probably COVID but can't prove it, so for example, Mrs A died in a nursing home with respiratory symptoms consistent with Covid, the home has 2 or 3 others who have had the same, 2 members of staff are off sick with it....so Mrs A probably died of Covid. Thats usually how that works, so on the news you will see these horror stories of nursing homes with 15 dead in 3 weeks, most of them won't be tested but its a fair guess its the old Covid. Interestingly enough though the government recently announced they're going to increase testing in this population.

Testing though after the death is problematic, the system just cannot test everyone, so there are lots of people out there who have it or have had it and just don't know. Current estimates are that up to 80% of the UK population will get Covid-19 and with the best will in the world testing them all just isn't going to happen. Its not that the Dr can't be bothered testing poor Mrs A its just that there is limited testing capacity and what the point in testing a dead person when its pretty obvious it's Covid.

On the issue of numbers themselves they're actually being under reported. So the UK has been pretty bad with reporting, I know for example early on in the area I work in we were initially a bit miffed at our numbers because our region would show say 5 deaths when we knew for a fact we had just thad 7. There is a lag in the numbers so that impacts the numbers. There is also the issue of what we record as a Covid Death, currently the numbers actually only account for patients in hospital and not for poor Mrs A in the nursing home. Its estimated that the real numbers are much higher for this reason.

Nurses and Dr's are NOT overwhelmed nor are they finding it difficult to get PPE!

This is utter BS. We ran out of eye protection the other day and where told to just reuse the old stuff, all our PPE is massively rationed. So yeah PPE is a massive issue, in fact there was a Doctor recently who warned the government about lack of PPE who is now dead from the virus. I have personally looked after staff critically unwell after working in Covid units. That is an absolute reality it is happening, its not fake news, I have personally seen a lack of PPE and its consequences.

The question though of being overwhelmed is a bit different though, as far as I know there have only been 2 trusts in England that have had to declare a major incident over lack of beds which isn't to bad. The issue really is that the NHS was already overwhelmed before this and the virus is just a new challenge. most hospitals have managed to increase capacity and social distancing measures along with canceling of all non urgent operations has also helped increase capacity.

There are 1600 NHS hospitals in the UK, obviously not including private hospitals, and there have been
Approximately 12,000 "deaths" so in my calculations that's only 7.5 Covid-19 deaths per hospital.

I think part of the issue here is that you don't quite get how hospitals work, they are very complex places. So firstly not all 1600 hospitals can take COVID, the trust I work in has technically got 6 or 7 hospitals but its only got one main hospital that is equipped with a ITU. All Coivid's go there because you need a hospital with an ITU to take them and it makes sense to try to keep all Covid cases on one hospital site. But not only that you need to isolate those patients so you pretty much have to split your ITU into "Clean" and "Dirty" this means setting up a second ITU. We know from the experiences in Europe that these patients require long term ITU care so we actually need to make extra ITU beds, the physical beds isn't so much the problem, its trained staff to care for them because believe me, its not simple.

So because of that you're maths is just flat out wrong.

it also doesn't account for the fact that different trusts are experiencing different numbers, some area's of Scotland are pretty much fine yet if you look at some parts of London trusts are seeing over 100 deaths a day.

I even saw a Dr (minimum annual salary £80,000+) ask to be bought a new bike to get to work!

UK starting annual salary for a Dr is about 28K for someone right out of Uni, second year its about 32K, its not really until you get to consultant level that your hitting 80K. So its only the most senior Docs that are making that kind of money so you comment about it being a "Minimum" is utter tripe.

you also talk about nurses salary:

I'm seeing food donated to staff and everything else! Average salary for a UK nurse £35,000 per annum.

The average salary for a teacher in the UK is 38k, that means that its totally possible that the nurse who is looking after your sick kids ventilator, literally keeping him alive is earning less that his geography teacher....just think about that for a second. Thats why nurses complain about pay, its not so much that others should get paid less in my view but rather that society should be looking at what it values and paying appropriately. I know that most IT guys working in our trust earn more than a nurses basic salary.

Now on your wider point though about food being donated I totally agree, I personally find it pretty disgusting that M&S donate boxes of food to NHS hospitals other than food banks but I have noticed most supermarkets seem to be improving on this. That though is a issue with the companies who wish to donate and not so much to do with the NHS.

Now the rest of your points seem to get into epidemiology, something I am not quite so well versed on and the rest looks like political point scoring that am not interested in.

If you have any questions feel free to ask and I hope my response has informed your views a little.

Hope you have a nice Covid free day!

a reply to: paraphi

It's the same Doctors that are forcing elderly patients to sign DNR forms, which is well documented but hardly a mention.

originally posted by: chelsealad
a reply to: paraphi

It's the same Doctors that are forcing elderly patients to sign DNR forms, which is well documented but hardly a mention.

Again you really don't know what you're talking about.

Patients don't sign a DNR in the UK, there is a discussion that is had which usually goes along the lines of "sorry Betty but you're 93, have lots of health conditions CPR for you would just be a really undignified death so we wouldn't do CPR, am putting in a form just so you know, I will speak to you family if you want about it".

And boom that's it.

I really feel like you don't know what you're talking about.

I can't take this crap anymore. I need to speak my mind!

You are not the only one, mate, the way the UK government is dealing with this so-called pandemic is extremely suspect. It is quite clear they are using the virus to distract from other issues and are stalling for time for something. The way you manage a crisis is to make it as small as possible in order it does not affect everything else. Instead of allowing economic and financial disruption and damage affect the whole UK, they should have contained it so that it affected a small percentage of the population, and not the whole of it.

Right now, and the reasons are irrelevant, the UK is currently under a tyranny. Our grandparents and our great grandparents fought in two world wars to stop tyranny, and our governments now see it as an option to use. Hancock is acting like a little Hitler, whilst our police are acting like 'Stasi' enforcers. It is unacceptable!

I never thought that the British people would turn into snivelling cowards and sheep of the most compliant and worse kind, our grandparents who fought to stop tyranny ever coming to these shores must be spinning in their graves. It is despairing what we have become!

The cries "Oh! Won't anyone think of the virus!" is a woeful attempt to shut down questions and criticism on the methods being used. You do not lockdown the country for a #ing virus! You allow for community immunity to develop. Yes, sadly some will die, not specifically of the virus itself, but because of the way the body tries to deal with it, and also, through the methods of treatment applied, which for the elderly and infirm patients, and those with underlying health issues, is too aggressive, and the fact is, people have been killed by it. A twitter user tweeted something on the NHS saying that 'the insufferable NHS worship looks like to continue.'

You don't allow the economy to crash due to a #ing virus! The only reason you do this is because the economy was already in dire straits and you want to somehow reset it, but to a new paradigm, one that many people won't accept.

Nobody wants civil unrest, that is the last resort a people take to deal with a roguish government at odds with what the people need and want as a society, but civil disobedience is required. Disregard of tyrannical orders lets them know they have crossed a line that is unacceptable, and if we love and honour our grandparents and great parents who made the ultimate sacrifices, then we have to show the same courage and bravery.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

DNRs can be quite controversial and a bitter pill to swallow. Clearly, as demonstrated above by @chelsealad there's also a lot of ignorance attached to the subject too.

In reality the clinician is trying to factor in the dignity of the patient. Dignity in dying is a real thing. I have experienced this when my father was dying and where his treatment was withheld. Very painful, but necessary.

Slightly off topic.

originally posted by: underwerks
I saw a YouTube video where a guy with hair said Elon Musk and Bill Gates are working together. Elon is beaming Coronavirus down from his Starlink satellites and Bill Gates is working with him to create a fake “vaccine” to force on everyone. They’re going to take the money they make from it and institute a new world order at the same time as depopulating the planet.

Stay woke fam.

There could be some truth to that, just not THAT truth.

If it were so - that Bill and Elon were doing some evil stuff to the world... I imagine that it could go hand in hand.

Seems old Elon may have put those sats in orbit at the right time to prepare for old Bill's taggum and baggum idea and all of it could be connected through the 5G network.

New Order
New Currency

All connected through Bill and Elon's success. No? Well, you can't deny that Elon is trying to build a rocket to get away from the virus. He wants to go to Mars! ...and I'm telling ya... Stephen Hawking IS the StarMan driving the Tesla, listening to his fave song "Space Oddity". can't deny it!

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

All due respect .... the lie of socialism is that some people don’t deserve to live because they are old used people with ill health.... or just old... and doctors are deciding who gets to live and who gets to die. I did in-home health care for a few years and had one client who was a WWII veteran who needed a wheelchair. The family love me and I interfaced well with the visiting nurses who also praised me for my care. One day I noticed a DNR order above his bed. It really made me so sad. Then the family moved him to a care facility and within a few weeks he was gone.
I had cleaned up a lot when I worked with him and I mean porta potty plus.....sometimes working over my shift time to get it done. It’s probably a good thing for me I found a desk job in my area or I’d be worrying about face masks and gloves with nowhere to get them.
My father had cancer and then had a stroke ... would you say he died of a stroke or cancer, the underlying cause ? I believe that while yes covid 19 has come upon people with underlying conditions.... many people have had it and recovered just like many people do with any flu. My concern is that they are closing the entire world down and this is nothing like the dreaded Ebola... which there were cases of in the US but there were no shutdowns over it.....strangely while Obama was Potus.....
I just hope it’s not a weaponized virus( as they say some hiv inserts were discovered by some researchers), but again the “ cure” is worse than the outbreak in my humble opinion.
Why are people like Gates promoting vaccines not developed yet instead of other things like the things doctors have actually used and suggesting we need a vaccine certificate to go back to work. I’m sorry but that is just medical establishment tyranny.

a reply to: ThirdEyeofHorus

Here is what I don't understand.

A vaccine does not cure someone that has a virus. In fact, if you have been exposed, or have had a virus, you already have better antibodies to the virus than can be expected from a man made vaccine.

A test is not a cure, and the information obtained from testing is not only possibly flawed, but is only good for the time frame that falls inside the range of contamination and infection. It will not show if you got infected yesterday not will it show if you become infected on the way home.

So why are they pushing testings and a vaccine that will not be available for over a year, which is guess work and may be harmful for some?

It is pure obfuscation. It is a tool they are using to keep us afraid, self confined, and manageable. We all know what is going to happen when the people wake up to the true crisis that we are in the middle of. They have to keep us from gathering in unmanageable numbers.

a reply to: NightSkyeB4DawnI agree NightSkye... I think it’s mostly pretext to forced vaccination and tracking etc. it’s a NWO thing they’ve wanted for a long time. Gates said at a Ted Talk he likes vaccines for zero pop growth and has been caught red-handed peddling sterilant-laced vaccines to an unsuspecting population in both India and Brazil. His coziness with Fauci on this matter is sickening. The cognitive dissonance regarding vaccines is deafening, but a typical tool for new world order people. I think right now Gates is the most dangerous man next to Soros.

They want to test everyone before school or work.
This would be a great way to swab everyone's DNA and create a data base

originally posted by: paraphi
a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

DNRs can be quite controversial and a bitter pill to swallow. Clearly, as demonstrated above by @chelsealad there's also a lot of ignorance attached to the subject too.

In reality the clinician is trying to factor in the dignity of the patient. Dignity in dying is a real thing. I have experienced this when my father was dying and where his treatment was withheld. Very painful, but necessary.

Slightly off topic.

Perhaps the real ignorance is the lie of socialism that the State ( and therefore doctors who answer to the State) should decide who lives and dies, and that for the common good ( or should I say the commie good) the State must ration health care because socialism is and always was for the purpose of State control. If old age is the determining factor on who gets cpr, then what’s happened to our respect for the aged ?
Then again, why does the entire world have to suffer for a disease which clearly does not have a particularly high rate of morbidity comparative to other things ?