Corona Virus Updates Part 6

a reply to: tanstaafl

Also...(continuing from my previous response)

originally posted by: whereislogic
a reply to: puzzled2
...
As the Eastern Virginia Medical School puts it:

Furthermore, it is likely that there will not be a single “magic bullet” to cure COVID-19. Rather, we should be using multiple drugs/interventions that have synergistic and overlapping biological effects that are safe, cheap and “readily” available.

Source: EVMS_Critical_Care_COVID-19_Protoco l.pdf

Why put all your eggs in one basket with high dose vitamin C? Which, btw, is also part of the EVMS protocol, but not the only component of their protocol, nor the main component in dampening the cytokine storm, which is how you safe lives when patients have reached that stage of the disease, by dampening the storm.

originally posted by: whereislogic
HCQ works great even at the latest stages of the disease during the cytokine storm.

This totally contradicts the studies that have been done. The main reason they said it was ineffective was because it was used too late.

High dose vitamin C works pretty good at this stage as well, but not as effective at dampening the storm.

So, I guess you forgot to provide links to those studies that prove this from one of your approved sources.

And yes, I know I haven't done the same for C, because those studies don't exist - because there is no money in it.

originally posted by: whereislogic
Why put all your eggs in one basket with high dose vitamin C?

Because it works, every time, all by itself, and is the safest substance on the planet (the only substance that I am aware of that does not have a known LD-50 level).

Which, btw, is also part of the EVMS protocol, but not the only component of their protocol, nor the main component in dampening the cytokine storm, which is how you safe lives when patients have reached that stage of the disease, by dampening the storm.

Which C will do - again, all by itself - if you use a high enough dose.

I have not seen one single protocol of any of the protocols you are mentioning that use high enough doses.

a reply to: whereislogic

Yes MEDCRAM covers all of that in greater detail and not with just anecdotal evidence and an odd reference to an unlinked paper but using many papers with links to those references for easier follow-ups.
As well as updating the information previously discussed as new information is brought to light, not 1 video on this changing situation from 2 months ago.

But again, they are both spreading the same message, if you want to listen to Dr Seheult's opinion against Youtube / WHO
censorship then listen to the second half of this video


It's not a matter of a playground "my sources are better than yours" verbal spat - it's about passing information that can be verified, understood and helpful to others.

So thank you for giving as old information but currently I'll continue to reference those I already have. If you find more interesting and up-to-date information else where please let us know.

originally posted by: tanstaafl

originally posted by: whereislogic
HCQ works great even at the latest stages of the disease during the cytokine storm.

This totally contradicts the studies that have been done. The main reason they said it was ineffective was because it was used too late.

You probably shouldn't believe everything you hear. Not even from those who appear pro-HCQ, they have a tendency to say things slightly wrong and fall for setups setup by those who want to make it appear health care workers and those who write hospital protocols and policies did nothing wrong by not using HCQ in the hospital for all patients as soon as possible (but also still in the IC), without waiting for a testresult; and not combining it with horrible care ('too late' for the max. effect*, too little, not long enough, not combined with the right substances, no escalation or follow-up treatment as the patient enters different stages of the disease, etc.). *: They should finish their sentence, 'too late ... for max. effect', for the best effect, or max. effect, the sooner the better, so it's always 'too late' in that sense once a patient is in the hospital or IC. Doesn't mean it has no significant effect on dampening the storm though or isn't useful in the hospital anymore, just don't rush people to intubation and then blame it on HCQ not working well enough (and other forms of "horrible care"; the studies you speak of are unreliable reports written by people with a motive to mislead and give a false impression, they are usually done with HCQ + "horrible care" to make it appear that HCQ has no or little effect, or is even harmful. There are no reliable inpatient studies from trustworthy sources that actually show what you imply they show; we do have an excellent inpatient study from the IHU, Dr. Raoult's hospital, that shows the exact opposite, that HCQ + Azitromycin on their own already have great effect on inpatients, about a 40-fold reduction in nr. of deaths, if not more, compared to other hospitals in France not using that treatment, the fatality rate differs a bit from hospital to hospital; the videos with the statistics are in the playlist).

So, I guess you forgot to provide links to those studies that prove this from one of your approved sources.

And yes, I know I haven't done the same for C, because those studies don't exist - because there is no money in it.

Links regarding scientific studies concerning vitamin C can be found in the EVMS protocol link, just look up where they have vitamin C listed there, check the number between brackets behind it, then you can go to the references and look up the article referenced there. The EVMS also has high dose IV vitamin C in their protocol, which is a hospital protocol, that's where you can give patients this stuff IV, which allows you to use more. Obviously that's not going to be part of any treatment used in the outpatient setting. When I'm mentioning vitamin C as part of HCQ + quality care, Dr. Ban-style, I'm including the notion of increasing the dosage by means of IV when that option becomes available; it's also more important once that patient enters later stages of the disease than in the outpatient setting. "Dr. Ban-style" is a style, not a protocol, one does not have to limit this form of quality care to the same limitations Dr. Ban has to deal with. Attitude is involved as well in "quality care, Dr. Ban-style".

So that's also a response to your other comment. If you look a little deeper into the vitamin C articles linked in the EVMS protocol, perhaps you can figure out for yourself why high dose IV vitamin C during the cytokine storm could really use some extra help for optimum results; HCQ being the greatest help in that regards if you understand how important IL-6 is (IL stands for interleukin). But I'm not going to explain every little detail to you, where's the fun in that for you making your own discoveries and doing your own research? Vitamin D3 is also very important at this stage (to dampen the cytokine storm). But none are as important as HCQ who directly targets IL-6 as explained in the Chinese article that I used regarding that subject.

By the way, it'll be hard to understand almost half my comment if you haven't seen the video linked under "horrible care", or have a hard time swallowing what that NYC nurse is saying about certain "horrible" realities that are much more widespread than just that hospital she is speaking of. It's a reflection of global hospital policies and protocols (not everything, but the stuff she says about HCQ + quality care, i.e. the other substances she mentions, counts for most hospitals, this too is "horrible care", it's not only about the neglect). Like the rushing to intubation not allowing what the EVMS refers to as "permissive hypoxemia" in their protocol, skipping HFNC or CPAP/BiPAP is also a common occurance in hospitals across the world. Not using corticosteroid immunosuppressors like prednisone/methylprednisolone or anticoagulants against blood clotting and not making any attempt at 'dampening the storm' as explained in the EVMS protocol is also a problem of "horrible care" in many hospitals (they call it "supportive care"). See EVMS protocol how the CDC, WHO and other bureaucratic and political organizations were involved again in preventing hospitals from doing the right thing in regards to corticosteroids, just like they're doing with HCQ. They want to block anything that prevents death, damage or the spread of the virus, and for that they manipulate hospital protocol and policy worldwide to create "horrible care", for obvious reasons, and among other sneaky stuff they pull. They are fighting on the side of corona, cause it's just too damn profitable if the corona problem gets worse. Who's going to worry about getting vaccins if the number of global deaths for SARS-CoV-2 was the same as for SARS-CoV-1 (as it easily could have been with HCQ + quality care, Dr. Ban-style, for everyone)?

originally posted by: whereislogic
...snip...
The EVMS also has high dose IV vitamin C in their protocol, which is a hospital protocol, that's where you can give patients this stuff IV, which allows you to use more.

Yes, and they never use very much... 1 gram, maybe 5 grams, 10 at most. But much more is necessary to bring someone back from deaths door.

Obviously that's not going to be part of any treatment used in the outpatient setting.

Obviously? I can get 100G IV treatments outpatient any time I want.

When I'm mentioning vitamin C as part of HCQ + quality care, Dr. Ban-style,

You go on worshiping Dr. Ban, I'll just take care of me and my own...

originally posted by: puzzled2
a reply to: whereislogic

...
It's not a matter of a playground "my sources are better than yours" verbal spat - it's about passing information that can be verified, understood and helpful to others.

Odd that that seems exactly what you were doing in the rest of your comment there. The very usage of the terms "anecdotal" and "old information" seems part of an attempt to argue why 'your sources are better than mine'. Earlier you did something similar by telling me to get multiple sources, as if I only get my information from 1, implying 'your way is better than mine', and that the single Dr. Ban video that you 'watched' (not very attentively apparently) had "No science No details of what is happening." But Dr. Seheult's were so much better in comparison, i.e. 'your source is better than mine'.

Your video-link isn't working. Look, if you don't want to expand your horizon that's fine, no need to try to use the degrading, or downgrading terminology "anecdotal" to help ignore the facts of "Real frontline reports: ...". As per the title of the playlist Dr. Ban's videos can be found in, as part of many sources with useful information. Oh and I didn't exactly ask about someone's "opinion against Youtube / WHO censorship" when I was referring to murder and "they want people to die, and some people are going to follow the recommendations by the WHO and stop precribing a drug, the only known drug that works. Remdesivir is going to fail..." in relation to the Lancet lying about HCQ for financial motives, and someone stating it as it is before the retraction.

Any videos from Dr. Seheult that mention the Lancet study before they retracted it? How does he talk about it, as if it's a useful 'scientific' study? Did he have anything to say of the kind discussed by the Doctor in the video that I was referring to? Have you watched that one before responding so you have an idea what I'm talking about (I'm obviously not only talking about the things I quoted, but the nature of that commentary)?

originally posted by: tanstaafl
...
Obviously? I can get 100G IV treatments outpatient any time I want.

Good for you. When you are a highly contageous Covid-19 patient that is too sick to even get out of bed as Dr. Ban explains regarding his patients suffering from severe weakness/fatigue and not having eaten for quite a while, other considerations may apply though (such as a more continuous daily need for and dose of vitamin C, something you can't really go to the Doctor for every day).

In the hospital, you get an IV-tube on admittal, or whatever it's called in English.

Yes, and they never use very much... 1 gram, maybe 5 grams, 10 at most.

They use (in the section "Dampening the Storm"):

2.Ascorbic acid (Vitamin C) 3g IV q 6 hourly for at least 7 days and/or until transferred out of ICU. Note caution with POC glucose testing (see below). [38-46]

That's 12g per day and 84g total for 7 days. More than the "10 at most" you mentioned. At least bother to take a quick peek, you won't sound so reluctant to look into anything that doesn't tickle your ears.

“For there will be a period of time when they will not put up with the wholesome* [Or “healthful; beneficial.”] teaching, but according to their own desires, they will surround themselves with teachers to have their ears tickled.* [Or “to tell them what they want to hear.”] They will turn away from listening to the truth and give attention to false stories.” (2 Timothy 4:3,4)

In case you can overcome that issue one day, otherwise for others here, here are the references concerning vitamin C from the EVMS protocol (also the earlier mentioned ones under prophylaxis, the vitamin C supplements):

1. Maggini S. A combination of high-dose vitamin C plus zinc for the common cold. Journal of International Medical Research 2012; 40:28-42.
2. Colunga Biancatelli RM, Berrill M, Catravas JD et al. Quercetin and Vitamin C: experimental therapy for the prevention and treatment of SARS-CoV-2 via synergistic action. medRxiv 2020.
3. Colunga Biancatelli RM, Berrill M, Marik PE. The antiviral properties of vitamin C. Expert Rev Anti Infect Ther 2020; 18:99-101.
4. Khaerunnisa S. Potential inhibitor of COVID-19 main protease (Mpro) from several medicinal plant compuns by molecular docking study. medRxiv 2020.
5. Yi L. Small molecules blocking the entry of severe respiratory syndrome coronavirus into host cells. J Virol 2020; 78:11334-39.
...
38. Marik PE, Khangoora V, Rivera R et al. Hydrocortisone, Vitamin C and Thiamine for the treatment of severe sepsis and septic shock: A retrospective before-after study. Chest 2017; 151:1229-38.
39. Barabutis N, Khangoora V, Marik PE et al. Hydrocortisone and Ascorbic Acid synergistically protect and repair lipopolysaccharide-induced pulmonary endothelial barrier dysfunction. Chest 2017; 152:954-62.
40. Marik PE. Hydrocortisone, Ascorbic Acid and Thiamine (HAT therapy) for the treatment of sepsis. Focus on ascorbic acid. Nutrients 2018; 10:1762.
41. Marik PE. Vitamin C for the treatment of sepsis: The scientific rationale. Pharmacol Therapeut 2018; 189:63-70.
42. Cheng RZ. Can early and high-dose vitamin C prevent and treat coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19). Medicine in Drug Discovery 2020.
43. Wang Y, Lin H, Lin BW et al. Effects of different ascorbic acid doses on the mortality of critically ill patients: a meta-analysis. Ann Intensive Care 2019; 9:58.
44. Fowler AA, Truwit JD, Hite D et al. Vitamin C Infusion for TReatment In Sepsis-Induced Acute Lung Injury- CITRIS-ALI: A Randomized, Placebo Controlled Clinical Trial. JAMA 2018; 322:1261-70.
45. Boretti A, Banik BK. Intravenous vitamin C for reduction of cytokines storm in acute respiratory distress syndrome. PharmaNutrition 2020; 12:100190.
46. Iglesias J, Vassallo AV, Patel V et al. Outcomes of metabolic resuscitation using ascorbic acid, thiamine, and glucocorticoids in the early treatment of sepsis. Chest 2020.

Numbers Update for Europe, and Elsewhere (No Bno) :






www.worldometers.info...

After 25 days of zero cases in Aotearoa/New Zealand we have two new cases, both come in from overseas and both given exemption to grieve with family members for funeral purpose the same funeral. This sucks big time.
Kia kaha world

a reply to: whereislogic

Seen the video's of the nyc nurse when it first came out, know there is a hit job on hcq ever since trump mentioned it. Even posted the french video you posted earlier on the better advisers.
Read the protocol from EVMS from earlier on ATS and tailored my own on theirs and that of Dr Seheult's protocol. Which he spoke about.

Understand you have a thing against medcram because they won't call the lancet a marketing publisher or the WHO murderers like the book selling DR you linked, but it doesn't stop the information from being worthwhile. You should check out the Q&A session from this week where the talk about the MATH+ protocol.

So if Dr Ban has more videos / information than the 1 video on his patient care then link them.
Did you see the links I posted about WHO trying to bribe the president of Madagascar no to release their organic Tea?

I really do think the vitamin deficiencies are a huge clue to the problems with the immune system. But can the word be got out without rampant panic stockpiling? Can all the 3rd world (internet deprived ) areas get the message?

I don't trust the vaccine industry with a virus as there are way to many coincidences of the FLU originating from the same part of China every year. With just the odd year it doesn't match the vaccine they sold to overt suspicion.

Hoping with the hand washing, boasting the immune system and dieting this pandemic will help reduce many more preventable deaths from all virus / heart / diabetes etc .

Now if only we could get everyone to love each other regardless of differences of opinions.

Have a great life .

a reply to: Cloudbuster

it does suck big time but doesn't this tell you something?
Who gave them the exception?
Why?

So they arrived 07/06/2020 from Australia on officail site but UK in papers - humm 10 days ago - did they catch it on the plane?

Me thinks there many be a conspiracy theory somewhere on this situation - Don't you?

Feels like we're slowly starting to form a 2nd wave.



Daily New Cases has started taking a rise again and deaths were falling, but the curve seems ever so slightly on its way up again.

Couple this with Beijing shutting down parts of the city and walling of residential area's, they're very scared of a 2nd outbreak.
Wuhan compared to China is small and easily contained, a mass outbreak in Beijing would be devastating - for the economy as well.

100 new community transmissions in 5 days
www.reuters.com... Y

BEIJING (Reuters) - Beijing banned high-risk people from leaving the Chinese capital and halted some transportation services on Tuesday to stop the spread of a fresh corona-virus outbreak to other cities and provinces.

Beijing had designated 22 neighborhoods as medium-risk areas as of Monday. Medium-risk areas are required to take stringent measures to block the potential entry of infection.
All high-risk people in Beijing, such as close contacts of confirmed cases, are not allowed to leave the city, state media reported on Tuesday, citing municipal officials.
All outbound taxi and car-hailing services have also been suspended. Some long-distance bus routes between Beijing and nearby Hebei and Shandong provinces were suspended.

The US race riots started around 16-20 days ago, just long enough for incubation.
en.wikipedia.org...

The next several days will be telling, if Beijing and the US pickup numbers then 8 million could seem small in the over all context.

Edit to add,

As Beijing Starts to close of neighborhoods due to an outbreak, international flights are still departing the airport.

a reply to: Agit8dChop

The US race riots started around 16-20 days ago,

As did relaxation of mitigation measures in very many places.

Not really race riots though.

Its not over yet. (Sounds like a song title).

Beijing back in lockdown: Parts of the city are fenced off and new travel bans introduced to stop new 'extremely severe' coronavirus outbreak

www.dailymail.co.uk...

China has put parts of Beijing back into lockdown and reimposed some travel restrictions in an attempt to contain a new coronavirus outbreak amid fears that a second wave is about to hit the country. Beijing's coronavirus situation is 'extremely severe', a city official warned Tuesday, as 27 new infections were reported in the Chinese capital from a cluster has sparked a huge trace-and-test programme. The coronavirus resurgence - believed to have started at the city's sprawling Xinfadi wholesale food market - has prompted alarm as China had largely brought its outbreak under control through mass testing and draconian lockdowns imposed earlier in the year.

Some people suggest its coming from the Lab in Beijing this time.

originally posted by: whereislogic
originally posted by: tanstaafl
"I can get 100G IV treatments outpatient any time I want."

Good for you. When you are a highly contageous Covid-19 patient that is too sick to even get out of bed as Dr. Ban explains regarding his patients suffering from severe weakness/fatigue and not having eaten for quite a while, other considerations may apply though (such as a more continuous daily need for and dose of vitamin C, something you can't really go to the Doctor for every day).

Of course not, you take it yourself, but if you are deathly ill, you make sure that your Doctor knows your wishes - the 'Right to Try' law allows you to demand and insist and get your treatment of choice, so make it high dose IV vitamin C.

In the hospital, you get an IV-tube on admittal, or whatever it's called in English.

On admission - yes, and because you are already tied into an IV, adding Vitamin C is easy peasy.

"Yes, and they never use very much... 1 gram, maybe 5 grams, 10 at most."
They use (in the section "Dampening the Storm"):
"2.Ascorbic acid (Vitamin C) 3g IV q 6 hourly for at least 7 days and/or until transferred out of ICU. Note caution with POC glucose testing (see below). [38-46]"
That's 12g per day

Exactly. Way too low. I take more than that orally every day.

The starting point for high dose is 25G per day, topping out usually around 100G, but you can take a lot more too... as much as it takes.

and 84g total for 7 days. More than the "10 at most" you mentioned.

A whopping 2G more in this case, but still less than half the recommended starting point, and less than the daily dose I would start myself at (100G).

At least bother to take a quick peek, you won't sound so reluctant to look into anything that doesn't tickle your ears.

Wouldn't have made a difference (or tickle)...

“For there will be a period of time when they will not put up with the wholesome* [Or “healthful; beneficial.”] teaching, but according to their own desires, they will surround themselves with teachers to have their ears tickled.* [Or “to tell them what they want to hear.”] They will turn away from listening to the truth and give attention to false stories.” (2 Timothy 4:3,4)

You should listen to your own counsel.

OMG>>>>>>>>

BREAKING: The Arizona health department reported 2,392 new coronavirus cases, a new daily high, and 25 additional deaths Tuesday morning.

Yes..... indeed.....2nd wave is here!!!

ktar.com...

Numbers Update for Europe, and Elsewhere (No Bno) :






www.worldometers.info...

Edit : Holy Sh!t Brazil !!
India, Chile, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Bangladesh, are all on the up and up at the moment.

Zero new cases today in Aotearoa/New Zealand but I am about to go get tested as required for my work. I have been sick since Sunday and have almost all the symptoms. Will keep you up to date on my results. Kia kaha world

a reply to: Cloudbuster

I've been happy to see your updates bearing good news from New Zealand, but your personal situation is far from happy. I hope that you've just got some normal seasonal flu.

Take care! Kia kaha, Kia ora!