U.S. CDC tells Coroners Hospitals - All Who Die With Covid-19 Should have COD Listed as Covid-19.

a reply to: carewemust
They have no way of knowing how many were asymptomatic or had mild symptoms and never sought out a place where their case would be registered.

Most of their estimates are extrapolated from confirmed cases. Can't really blame them. Not much else they can do.

In the case of the flu, the motivator was to get people to accept the jab. Was it because they really cared or just $$$. Makes no difference.

I had someone call me out for linking that post in another thread. They said that "they" have been trying to point out that the CDC and the WHO lie. Are they really lying when they tell you straight out that they are giving you estimates?

More to the point, does having Covid-19 on a death certificate allow them to calculate those estimates in real-time (or as close as possible), in order to better calculate the actions that need to be taken, instead of just pouring over the data after the fact? That seems like a plausible reason.

a reply to: daskakik

I have yet to see anyone give a plausible reason for the state of New York adding 3,700 people to their coronavirus death toll today, simply because they think the people might have had coronavirus when they died.

Source: news.yahoo.com...

So 3700 death certificate have to be revised, grieving relatives contacted and told they need to order a new death certificate from the state.. probably at a cost.

originally posted by: ChaoticOrder

originally posted by: daskakik
a reply to: ChaoticOrder

Like I said, if it is a contributing factor then shouldn't they form part of the fatality rate?

Yes it's probably a good idea to be recording it as a contributing factor, but we shouldn't be counting people who had serious pre-existing conditions in the death statistics because it's very misleading and causing a lot of fear.

Anyone who is on deaths door before contracting the illness shouldn't be counted. If their death was not imminent, then they should be counted. Heart attack is caused Cov-19 in some cases, so all those should be tested and added if they had COV-19. For the record the flu deaths contain a ton of folks on deaths door.

a reply to: carewemust

It says it right there in the article.

On Tuesday, the city's health department released a revised COVID-19 death count that included those who were not tested but were presumed to have died from the disease.

I don't think anyone would need a new death certificate. They just added them to the toll. It is exactly what the CDC does to get their estimates for flu.

i found this in another thread about the new death total in one of their links. i also found the same story in the New York times. this is where and why they added at least 3000 of the deaths.

Three thousand more people died in New York City between March 11 and April 13 than would have been expected during the same time period in an ordinary year, Dr. Oxiris Barbot, the commissioner of the city Health Department, said in an interview. While these so-called excess deaths were not explicitly linked to the virus, they might not have happened had the outbreak not occurred, in part because it overwhelmed the normal health care system.

“This is yet another part of the impact of Covid,” she said, adding that more study was needed. Similar analysis is commonly done after heat waves and was performed in the wake of Hurricane Maria in Puerto Rico.

N.Y.C. Death Toll Soars Past 10,000 in Revised Virus Count

as i said in the other thread, it seems that if you fell and cut your arm then bled to death, fell and broke your neck, had a heart attack because you had coronary disease, got run over by a car, had a asthma attack, had a epileptic seizure, and whole host of other things that could happen that could cause death. but for some reason a ambulance couldn't reach you, or you couldn't get in to a hospital to be treated and possibly been saved but instead you died. NYC says it's the covids fault.

not because you had it, but because you couldn't be treated due to the system being overwhelmed from the impact of Covid19.


ETA: turns out that the new york times article that i link was the same from the other thread, my bad.

a reply to: hounddoghowlie

Took a look at that article and that part is not in quotes or actually attributed to her. The previous paragraph ends with "said in an interview." and then there is the part about the "overwhelmed the normal health care system".

It looks, to me at least, like it is the opinion of the authors and not what she actually said. I did a little digging and can't find where she actually said anything like that. Maybe the times has it somewhere.

a reply to: daskakik

the way i took,

“This is yet another part of the impact of Covid,” she said

is that any death that happened because of the system being overwhelmed is being called Covid 19 related. in other words these death might not have happened if the system was running normally.

then they say,

Similar analysis is commonly done after heat waves and was performed in the wake of Hurricane Maria in Puerto Rico.

and provide a link for that.

in that article it says,

An analysis of vital statistics by The New York Times last December found that 1,052 more people than usual died across the island in the 42 days after the storm. Other news organizations, including Puerto Rico’s Center for Investigative Journalism, CNN, Buzzfeed and Alexis Raúl Santos, a demographer at Penn State, have also challenged the government’s figure, finding evidence for hundreds of excess deaths in the weeks after the hurricane.

Researchers for this latest study visited more than 3,000 residences across the island and interviewed their occupants, who reported that 38 people living in their households had died between Sept. 20, when Hurricane Maria struck, and the end of 2017. That toll, converted into a mortality rate, was extrapolated to the larger population and compared with official statistics from the same period in 2016.
Puerto Rico’s Hurricane Maria Death Toll Could Exceed 4,000, New Study Estimates

so their saying the people that died after the hurricane for what ever reason should be counted towards the death toll on the day of the hurricane.

a reply to: hounddoghowlie

But it seems they are taking the liberty of making that connection, although she never actually said that these deaths were a result of the system being overwhelmed.

In the Transcript of the Bill de Blasio NYC COVID-19 Briefing April 15 she says:

And are there potentially cases where someone registered a death as a heart attack because the person hadn’t yet developed symptoms of COVID-19, and truly should have been categorized as a COVID probable. I don’t know that we will ever be able to answer that question fully, but I think it’s something that still needs to be looked into further.

She is talking about potential cases that were missed because they were not tested and not just any death that took place during that time and certainly not because they were not able to get medical attention because the system was overwhelmed.

Like I said, unless the times can show where she actually said that, it seems like it is just the opinions of the authors.

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: daskakik

I have yet to see anyone give a plausible reason for the state of New York adding 3,700 people to their coronavirus death toll today, simply because they think the people might have had coronavirus when they died.

Source: news.yahoo.com...

So 3700 death certificate have to be revised, grieving relatives contacted and told they need to order a new death certificate from the state.. probably at a cost.

It's just paper work. Bureaucrats get paid to fill out forms. The bigger the numbers, the bigger next year's budget.

originally posted by: Salander

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: daskakik

I have yet to see anyone give a plausible reason for the state of New York adding 3,700 people to their coronavirus death toll today, simply because they think the people might have had coronavirus when they died.

Source: news.yahoo.com...

So 3700 death certificate have to be revised, grieving relatives contacted and told they need to order a new death certificate from the state.. probably at a cost.

It's just paper work. Bureaucrats get paid to fill out forms. The bigger the numbers, the bigger next year's budget.

I guess Coroners have their own forums for networking with each other too. Stories like the one below are becoming so common, its disgusting!

Because they had a family member in the hospital suffering from COVID-19, Spitz had a postmortem test done and found that the individual who died at home was positive for COVID-19. The virus wasn’t their cause of death, but the individual is counted as a COVID-19 death.

From Michigan: www.mlive.com...

a reply to: carewemust

That's it--if the data is poor, decisions are made in the dark so to speak.

originally posted by: Salander
a reply to: carewemust

That's it--if the data is poor, decisions are made in the dark so to speak.

It's now looking like New York screwed up by adding thousands of Non-Covid19 deaths to their Covid19 death count. Big lawsuits will be coming on behalf of relatives whose loved one(s) died from Covid19 in NYC especially. DeBlasio Admin told NYC residents to ignore Covid-19 warnings from Trump Admin Health and Human Services.

New York has just inadvertently added many many thousands of people to the coming class action lawsuits from surviving relatives. I'm sure attorney's in New York are putting together their cases as we speak.

May 20, 2020 UPDATE

After comparing the current CDC with the CDC before Covid-19, It appears that the Center for Disease Control has intentionally made itself "incompetent", specifically for the Covid-19 Pandemic.

Samples of What Investigative Reporters are Finding:

Want to know how many tuberculosis cases there were in the U.S. last year? Ask the CDC. Want to know about health-care-associated infections? Ask the CDC. It knows.

But ask how many Covid-19 tests have been done, and the CDC’s doesn’t have an answer. Want a daily update on how many people are getting hospitalized for Covid-19? The CDC isn’t tracking it. Want to know if social distancing is making a difference? The CDC doesn’t know.

During this pandemic, when accurate, timely, nationwide information is the lifeblood of our response, the CDC has largely disappeared.

Source: www.statnews.com...

-AND-

"EXCLUSIVE: Former HHS official claims CDC leaders "lied" to Trump over coronavirus testing."

The Exclusive: abc3340.com...

-AND-

CDC Scandal and Incompetence during the Covid-19 Pandemic.

www.forbes.com...

There are similar assessments appearing online every week.

I posted this about a month ago HERE on ATS, and I was called out as basically a liar My coroner friend

Nice to see it actually coming out, and im glad people are coming forward.


So what say you , the people who were critical.

Were going to see more and more of this as people get more bold and start standing up.

a reply to: SailorJerry

So what say you , the people who were critical.

I say that the CDC directive does not say what the OP thinks it says.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Pretty old thread, btw.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: SailorJerry

So what say you , the people who were critical.

I say that the CDC directive does not say what the OP thinks it says.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Pretty old thread, btw.

That may be , but the simple truth is if you call any hospital and ask, or any of your coroners and ask about the skewed numbers most will be truthful

Its been reported many many times in dif media outlets if you care to look.

My friend was the coroner in Colorado, funnily enough colorado was one of the first to "modify" their numbers

President Trump needs to call out the criminals and Corruption at the CDC right now.

It's being revealed today that the CDC told Governor Cuomo to put 4700 covid-19 patients into nursing homes... making those places death traps for all the residents.

August 31, 2020

The latest guidance from the CDC says a doctor can merely GUESS if a deceased person had Covid-19 at the time of death.

NO Covid-19 TEST REQUIRED.

In cases where a definite diagnosis of COVID–19 cannot
be made, but it is suspected or likely, it
is acceptable to report COVID–19 on a death certificate as
“probable” or “presumed.”

In these instances, certifiers should
use their best clinical judgement in determining if a COVID–19
infection was likely. However, please note that testing for
COVID–19 should be conducted whenever possible.

Source- Page 2; Fifth Paragraph Down on Left, at: www.cdc.gov...

Based on such "loose" guidelines from the CDC, is there any wonder why America "officially" has 170,000 Covid-19 deaths?

MONEY from Uncle Sam for Covid-19 diagnosis, and Political Desire to Damage President Trump, are driving the artificially high death toll.

Democrats, the Mainstream Media, and their Anti-America "Experts", are hoping that Americans stay blinded to the truth and stupid enough to believe what they're feeding us.

I predict (and hope) they will all SUFFER, as a result of Americans WAKING UP!