U.S. CDC tells Coroners Hospitals - All Who Die With Covid-19 Should have COD Listed as Covid-19.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: Snarl

My point (edited) was that an increase in deaths is an increase in deaths. If someone who had a underlying condition dies because coronavirus exacerbated it, so what? Perhaps coronavirus didn't kill them, but they died because of coronavirus.

So if a person has terminal cancer and dies after contracting CV19, it's logical to list CV19 as the cause of death? That's simply deceptive, yet it's how everyone has been recording CV19 fatality numbers since day one. My guess is some hospitals stopped doing that so the CDC is now forcing them to do it. I've posted this excerpt from the CDC website multiple times now but I'm going to share it again because it's highly relevant to this thread.

Does CDC know the exact number of people who die from seasonal flu each year?

CDC does not know exactly how many people die from seasonal flu each year. There are several reasons for this. First, states are not required to report individual flu illnesses or deaths among people older than 18 years of age to CDC. Second, influenza is infrequently listed on death certificates of people who die from flu-related complications. Third, many flu-related deaths occur one or two weeks after a person’s initial infection, either because the person may develop a secondary bacterial co-infection (such as bacterial pneumonia) or because influenza can aggravate an existing chronic illness (such as congestive heart failure or chronic obstructive pulmonary disease). Also, most people who die from flu-related complications are not tested for flu, or they seek medical care later in their illness when influenza can no longer be detected from respiratory samples. Sensitive influenza tests are only likely to detect influenza if performed within a week after onset of illness. In addition, some commonly used tests to diagnose influenza in clinical settings are not highly sensitive and can provide false negative results (i.e. they misdiagnose flu illness as not being flu.) For these reasons, many flu-related deaths may not be recorded on death certificates. These are some of the reasons that CDC and other public health agencies in the United States and other countries use statistical and mathematical models to estimate the annual number of flu-related deaths.

www.cdc.gov...

This directive by the CDC is nothing but a disinformation tactic, nearly every young person who has died of CV19 so far had a serious pre-existing condition. This does nothing but reinforce my belief CV19 is definitely a conspiracy.

More than 99% of Italy’s coronavirus fatalities were people who suffered from previous medical conditions, according to a study by the country’s national health authority.
...
The Rome-based institute has examined medical records of about 18% of the country’s coronavirus fatalities, finding that just three victims, or 0.8% of the total, had no previous pathology. Almost half of the victims suffered from at least three prior illnesses and about a fourth had either one or two previous conditions.
...
The average age of those who’ve died from the virus in Italy is 79.5. As of March 17, 17 people under 50 had died from the disease. All of Italy’s victims under 40 have been males with serious existing medical conditions.

www.bloomberg.com...

What's even more astonishing, is that even with this stupid rule and a lack of testing, the number of CV19 deaths is still comparable to the flu, actually the flu still appears to kill more people based on current statistics.

The U.S. saw just over 59,000 flu deaths in 2018, which is significantly higher than the 36,000 that would occur if March's COVID-19 numbers were repeated all year. However, the coronavirus has not fully hit the majority of states and is more concentrated in a group of metropolitan hot spots across the country. Most experts believe it is only a matter of time before the virus hits more suburban and rural areas, leading numbers to continue to climb.

On the world scale, it is tougher to compare COVID-19 and influenza, as the latter's death toll isn't always so clear. However, the WHO says that between 300,000 and 650,000 die each year from the flu or flu-related illnesses. That would put the projected global total for coronavirus (360,000) toward the lower end of that estimate, but they two would likely be comprable.

www.nbcnewyork.com...

originally posted by: ChaoticOrder
So if a person has terminal cancer and dies after contracting CV19, it's logical to list CV19 as the cause of death?

No, but since that isn't what the directive is saying, your point is moot.

a reply to: ChaoticOrder

Yep. Apparently Covid-19 overrides all other conditions...even decapitation in a car wreck.

originally posted by: xuenchen
guide from March 4th 🧐

Here's an UPDATE that was just published today: www.cdc.gov...

From: www.cdc.gov...

a reply to: daskakik

originally posted by: daskakik
No, but since that isn't what the directive is saying, your point is moot.

That's exactly what it's saying and that's exactly what has been happening all along. Every single person who died in Italy while testing positive for CV19 is recorded as part of the CV19 death statistics regardless of pre-existing conditions, and everyone else is doing the same thing. I doubt it would apply to things like car crashes, but it certainly applies to most medical conditions including cancer. This article from businessinsider states one-third of COVID-19 patients who died in Italy had heart disease and 20.3% had active cancer in the past five years, but every single one of them contribute to the death statistics despite the fact it doesn't work that for any other virus.

In the UK, for example, the Department of Health and Social Care releases daily updates on how many people who tested positive for Covid-19 died that day. This includes any patient who tested positive for Covid-19 but who might have died from another condition (for example, terminal cancer). But the UK’s Office for National Statistics counts all deaths as Covid-19 where Covid-19 was mentioned on the death certificate, regardless of whether they were tested or if it was merely a suspected case of Covid-19.

www.bbc.com...

a reply to: ChaoticOrder
No, that is not what the directive in the OP is saying.

What may have happened in Italy or the UK really has nothing to do with the specific directive in this thread.

originally posted by: Stupidsecrets
a reply to: carewemust

No. This wasn't done for any other virus of bacteria. Totally stupid. By and large those that are dying already had serious health issues. The virus wasn't the thing that got them to the final thing. It was a piss poor lifestyle. Smoking, obesity, drinking. I noticed for many of the deaths they won't show their whole body but anyone could tell from their face their were morbidly obese. Total BS. Almost nobody who takes care of themselves is dying. And don't be a moron and say well so and so...blah blah. I said MOST were garbage bins. Not everyone.

The biggest problem we have is not the virus. It's being fat trash bags that don't take care of themselves and have weak immune system. In China, many of the death were hardcore smokers from what I read. Well go figure. No wonder they had trouble breathing. They already had trouble breathing.

Ffs. Your post reeks of ignorance. I wish I could bleach my eyes after reading this pile of #
So blah blah you say. No evidence what so ever that those in China were hardcore smokers. No evidence what so ever that its only obese people who are dying. No evidence that most of those dying of CoVid are "trash cans"

originally posted by: daskakik
a reply to: ChaoticOrder
No, that is not what the directive in the OP is saying.

What may have happened in Italy or the UK really has nothing to do with the specific directive in this thread.

We can argue about what the directive is saying all day long, but the fact is that's how the death statistics have been recorded by all nations including the US. So whether they are being told to or not, that is what they are doing, yet they don't do that for other viruses like the flu, they typically record the underlying illness as the cause of death.

a reply to: ChaoticOrder

Local News: 1st Chicago police officer dies from conditions related to the Covid-19 virus he contracted last week. Mayor holding a press conference now.

a reply to: ChaoticOrder

Well, if someone had a few years left but died in a few weeks because of covid then that would be a contributing factor.

Maybe now they will start doing it for other viruses as well.

Seems to me they are noting that it was a contributing factor and not the COD. Not really seeing why that is getting peoples knickers in a bunch.

originally posted by: daskakik
a reply to: ChaoticOrder

Seems to me they are noting that it was a contributing factor and not the COD. Not really seeing why that is getting peoples knickers in a bunch.

The core problem is all of these deaths are counted as part of the fatality rate for CV19, there's also a massive lack of testing. These things combined mean we're vastly overestimating the fatality rate of CV19, yet those highly questionable figures are being used by fearmongers as proof that CV19 is a lot deadlier than the flu, despite the majority of young people experiencing symptoms on par with the flu or even less severe than a common flu. It does seem deadlier than the flu for people over 60 and that's why I think they should definitely self-isolate. However, forcing all young people to stay at home and stop working, forcing all these businesses to close, printing endless amounts of new bailout money, having the government pay peoples wages, etc, is seriously risking a global economic collapse... and if that happens a hell of a lot more old people will die.

a reply to: ChaoticOrder

Like I said, if it is a contributing factor then shouldn't they form part of the fatality rate?

Is it any better to have some government dept look over the numbers after the fact and draw up estimates?

The situation in China was met with lockdowns and their numbers are low (if they can be trusted). Italy, UK and Spain carried on like it was no problem and their numbers are high. I guess the choice is front hand or back hand.

originally posted by: daskakik
a reply to: ChaoticOrder

Like I said, if it is a contributing factor then shouldn't they form part of the fatality rate?

Yes it's probably a good idea to be recording it as a contributing factor, but we shouldn't be counting people who had serious pre-existing conditions in the death statistics because it's very misleading and causing a lot of fear.

a reply to: ChaoticOrder
Why not? Isn't it crucial to identifying who the at risk demographic is?

originally posted by: Snarl

originally posted by: Phage
So what?

100,000 more reasons to start a war and throw more plebes into the flames I'm afraid.

Am so glad I moved off the islands. Are you good?

Pacific Pivot, anyone?

Clark was right. No actual war with Iran. The virus is taking them out. On to China?

People are still posting this like it was real?

He said all of that would happen within 5 years. That was like 15 years ago.

On topic, cwm, it looks like this was #fakenews. Like Phage said, if you read the actual document, it does not say what your headline says.

a reply to: face23785

Look at this most recent guidance from the CDC, describing how to fill out death certificates, complete with examples.

Here: www.cdc.gov...

Example #3 is "assuming" the deceased had Covid-19 at the time of death.

a reply to: carewemust

They all say Covid-19. #3 just puts a question mark on it because it isn't certain.

That actually works against your claim in the OP.

originally posted by: daskakik
a reply to: carewemust

They all say Covid-19. #3 just puts a question mark on it because it isn't certain.

That actually works against your claim in the OP.

Guess it depends on one's interpretation...and the motivation of the person labeling the death.

BTW...

ALERT: "PEARL HARBOR-II" is coming to the United States this coming week!

www.foxnews.com...

ALSO New Guidance from the CDC will help pump up the death toll.

Just in time for Pearl Harbor week: www.cdc.gov...