The Absolute Power of Christianity!

Originally posted by Clearskies
Also how much has evaporated in all these millenium?

99% of it at some point or another. as has been suggested, look up the water cycle. water doesn't just disappear from the earth.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
The only problem saying that a person can have faith and still be intelligent and use reason, is the parts of The Bible that defy logic and reason.

On this point we agree. There are parts that go well beyond logic and reason.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
Things like Noah's Ark for example, there's not enough water on earth to flood all the continents, even if you melt all the ice, there's still only a certain amount of water on the planet, and it's not sufficient enough for a world-wide flood. Right there, we've just disproven Noah's Ark, as it physically cannot happen. A person with intelligence and reason can see that. However, a person with faith can say 'God can do anything'. But in order for a person of faith to say that, they have to disregard any reason or intelligence.

I think it's a lazy dismissal to not seek the answers (but I think that come from not caring to find the answers).

We know from the history of science that we're learning new things everyday and it is unreasonable to believe we can answer all questions in our lifetime. A scientific mind is one that can honestly say "I don't know" when logic and reason fail to answer the question, on the other hand that same mind should continually be seeking the answer.

For me, I can say I've seen some weird shtuff go down in my lifetime that made absolutely no sense from a physics standpoint. I consider myself reasonably educated. When I let go of a quarter, it should fall straight down to the ground, shouldn't it? What happens when it doesn't? Still scratching my head from that one. It did however make me take a step back and go "okay, what just happened here?" and am still searching for that answer. Nono, no one simply try to 'explain it away', it's not that easy and is scientifically blind by doing so. Let's take an objective approach. Was it God? Doesn't make sense that it would be, why would God want to translocate a quarter? Chemical imbalance/drugs/biologics/etc? Nope, I had a witness. Mass-hallucinogenic mind-controlled governmental aliens? Can't rule it out eh? Scientifically we know the laws of physics (or any law) is about consistency, not a promise of delivery. We can "bet" on it, but it does not make it absolute. I see it as one of those "holes" in physics we haven't an explanation for yet. Perhaps someday we will, but in the meantime, we've gotta keep looking for the answers. Sometimes those answers may lead to God, sometimes to these physical laws (which is often considered a piece of structure created by God).

Here is my hope for you shauny, that sometime soon, some weird shtuff will go down in your life. Then, when you approach others and they chuckle while explaining away things that are impossible, a notion may come to mind that indeed science does not explain everything. When faith in science falls, there's gotta be something there to pick it back up.

[edit on 20-8-2007 by saint4God]

Originally posted by saint4God
I think it's a lazy dismissal to not seek the answers

I was just showing that Noah's Ark defies any sort of logic or reason. And it's in cases like this when people of faith throw logic and reason out of the window and go with faith, trust God, and trust that God can make anything happen.

Originally posted by saint4God
Here is my hope for you shauny, that sometime soon, some weird shtuff will go down in your life. Then, when you approach others and they chuckle while explaining away things that are impossible, a notion may come to mind that indeed science does not explain everything. When faith in science falls, there's gotta be something there to pick it back up.

Well until that coin floats when we drop it, shall we stick to reason?

There's a perfectly reasonable explanation for everything that happens, people often don't want to believe the logical explanation though, they prefer to believe the wacky 'what if' explanation because it's more exciting.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
Well until that coin floats when we drop it, shall we stick to reason?

If someone close to you told them that it was true, would you believe them? Or assume they're lying?

Originally posted by shaunybaby
There's a perfectly reasonable explanation for everything that happens, people often don't want to believe the logical explanation though, they prefer to believe the wacky 'what if' explanation because it's more exciting.

I tend to like the logical explanation, it's a warm fuzzy blanket of reliability. When something wacky does occur, what do you suggest we do? I think you and I would say the same thing, "seek the answer" which includes not discounting any possibilities. Yes?

Originally posted by shaunybaby

Things like Noah's Ark for example, there's not enough water on earth to flood all the continents, even if you melt all the ice, there's still only a certain amount of water on the planet, and it's not sufficient enough for a world-wide flood. Right there, we've just disproven Noah's Ark, as it physically cannot happen. A person with intelligence and reason can see that. However, a person with faith can say 'God can do anything'. But in order for a person of faith to say that, they have to disregard any reason or intelligence.

Melt the polar ice cap and then take the tallest mountains and stick them in the deepest parts of the oceans...........Now what do you see?

[edit on 21-8-2007 by Sun Matrix]

Originally posted by saint4God
If someone close to you told them that it was true, would you believe them? Or assume they're lying?

Nice false dilema.

Originally posted by saint4God
I tend to like the logical explanation, it's a warm fuzzy blanket of reliability. When something wacky does occur, what do you suggest we do? I think you and I would say the same thing, "seek the answer" which includes not discounting any possibilities. Yes?

So you're saying I shouldn't discount the possibility of Noah's Ark? Even though if we follow simple reasoning, we can show it's not supposed to be a literal event.

Originally posted by Sun Matrix
Melt the polar ice cap and then take the tallest mountains and stick them in the deepest parts of the oceans...........Now what do you see?

The polar ice caps are already in the water, hence they're already displacing the water, there would be little increase if both the north and south pole melted. The supposed resting place of the Ark is Mt Ararat, which is a little over 5000 metres. The polar ice caps may take us up a few metres, we may even get in to double figures if we're lucky.

I took the liberty to look up some figures about the oceans. The oceans take up 72% of the earth's surface, they cover 141,600,000 square miles. The vast majority of the oceans are deep, the deepest parts being about 10,000 metres.

The largest mountain range in the world is the Himalayas, which is 1500 metres long. The highest peaks range from 3000 to 8500 metres. The total area of the Himalayas is 40 square miles.

Now considering the oceans cover 141,600,000 square miles, something that isn't even as tall as the deepest ocean, that covers only 40 square miles, isn't going to displace much water. And this is the biggest mountain range in the world.

Certainly a more imaginative way to get the water levels up, but still no where near enough for a world-wide flood.

Originally posted by shaunybaby

Originally posted by saint4God
If someone close to you told them that it was true, would you believe them? Or assume they're lying?

Nice false dilema.

I presume by saying this you mean to say "neither". That's a fair enough answer so long as you can explain why or what that means specificially. Revamp question then (and I apologize for not being objective enough the first time, but thought your answer would've been one of the two): If someone close to you told you that it was true, what would you believe/think/feel about it?

Originally posted by saint4God
So you're saying I shouldn't discount the possibility of Noah's Ark?

I think it would be open-minded to not discount it, yes.

Originally posted by saint4God
Even though if we follow simple reasoning, we can show it's not supposed to be a literal event.

Many things occur without simple reasoning, doesn't mean they did not occur.

Originally posted by saint4God
I presume by saying this you mean to say "neither". That's a fair enough answer so long as you can explain why or what that means specificially.

Well I may not believe them, but this doesn't mean I think they're lying. Like when you talk about God in your life, I don't believe he exists, but this doesn't mean I think you're lying about him.

Originally posted by saint4God
I think it would be open-minded to not discount it, yes.

Actually heard a phrase the other day that would suit here:

''We should be open-minded, but not so open-minded our brains fall out''.

Originally posted by shaunybaby
Well I may not believe them, but this doesn't mean I think they're lying. Like when you talk about God in your life, I don't believe he exists, but this doesn't mean I think you're lying about him.

I see what you mean now and appreciate the clarification. I for one totally dislike it when I'm told, "I believe that YOU believe you saw what you THINK you saw but..." but I guess is what can be expected from a person who is as firsthand-proof driven as I was.

These days, if a friend were to tell me "I saw a ghost!", I'd be more likely to believe it than accuse them of doing drugs.

Originally posted by saint4God
Actually heard a phrase the other day that would suit here:

''We should be open-minded, but not so open-minded our brains fall out''.

That's pretty funny. No, I wouldn't advise doing that. If I may phrase in something I can use, "leave not the benefit of the doubt open to foolish consequences". But I have to ask what the consequence is of considering the possibility in this case?



[edit on 21-8-2007 by saint4God]

reply to post by junglejake


Oh it sucks to be on the other end of this stick - ah?
Christianity seems to spent it's reign on punishing everyone else for the injustices of the Romans and Jews to jesus (a man). They have practiced that which they claim to be only a true power of god. They determine who's immortal soul is lost or found by their mere human standards. If sodomy's a sin- then let god handle it. If some one kills, then we should step in to assure that sin does not effect another human. Homosexuality, abortion ( not more than really a parasite in non emotional terms) are personal choices, which if there is a god i'd feel better that judgement be left to him/her, having a more comprehensive understanding of the big picture and all.
Considering the way these religious leaders hand down judgement upon other humans tells me god must have died and left them in charge.
Stop and take a look back at your history and your leaders, then tell me whose been more judgemental in regards to others personal choices. Us 'heretics' or your heretics.
We just are calling it the way we've seen it- Hypocrits

A donor had given a staggering $100 million to the Erie Community Foundation, and the charities would get to share the windfall.

"The fact that a gift was given without any wish for glory for the friend has got to be a response to Jesus teaching about loving our neighbors," she said.

Most recipients are human services agencies, including a food bank, a women's center and blindness resource group

"What a godsend for some of these agencies because I know a lot of them struggle," she said.

www.foxnews.com...

Although no one knows the donor's thoughts on it, the example many had looked to for such giving and generosity is Christ. Interesting.

reply to post by saint4God


you don't have to be a christian to be generous...

examples:
bill gates and warren buffet.

hell, gates hires people to tell him exactly how to give away his money.

Originally posted by junglejake

Stop forcing your beliefs on us

We've all heard it on here and in our day to day lives. Christianity, by being in the public square, is forcing its views on people. I find the use of the word "force" very interesting.

When people are saying that Christians having the Ten Commandments in the public square or sharing their faith is forcing their beliefs upon them, they're pretty much admitting Christianity is the Truth.

Thats nonsense. When people say forcing their beliefs on people it means that they are forcing people to be constantly bombarded with them. It didn't say forcing them to practice their beliefs

Originally posted by junglejake
When people are saying that Christians having the Ten Commandments in the public square or sharing their faith is forcing their beliefs upon them, they're pretty much admitting Christianity is the Truth. If being exposed to it forces you to become a Christian, it must be the most powerful message ever to have been created (in my opinion, it is).

Created. Exactly. Constantine worshipper. You heart marketing.

I haven't seen this thread before. Another spin off eh? oh well, I guess it's ok.

here are the facts.


You arm 100 christians with golden swords.
You arm 200 Anti-Christians with silver swords.


The Christians will win the battle. no contest.

Point being, God is behind us..and yes we have UNLIMITED power!

reply to post by jedimiller

pretty sure silver is the stronger metal of the two. swords made of gold would make pretty crappy weapons.

besides which the whole killing/fighting this isn't christian so no that god wouldn't have your back.

Originally posted by jedimiller
I haven't seen this thread before. Another spin off eh? oh well, I guess it's ok.

here are the facts.


You arm 100 christians with golden swords.
You arm 200 Anti-Christians with silver swords.


The Christians will win the battle. no contest.

...no, the 200 anti-christians have stronger weapons....

i don't see any facts here... i just say postulating and pondering and self-inflating.

Point being, God is behind us..and yes we have UNLIMITED power!

sounds familiar...


had to draw the comparison
seems like you should change the name to sithmiller

god is behind you?
which one?
cause i've got both the FSM and the ICU

Originally posted by riley
reply to post by jedimiller

 

pretty sure silver is the stronger metal of the two. swords made of gold would make pretty crappy weapons.

Golden swords.

Still laughing. Like pasta bullets. Or an intercontinental ballistic Nerf missle. That's an ICBN for you civilians.

"Put your sword back in its place," Jesus said to him, "for all who draw the sword will die by the sword." - Matthew 26:52

The power of God isn't giving us a strong sword arm.

"For the kingdom of God is not a matter of talk but of power. What do you prefer? Shall I come to you with a whip, or in love and with a gentle spirit?" - 1 Corinthians 20-21

I'll take love and gentle spirit please

What is this power then?

"By his power God raised the Lord from the dead, and he will raise us also." - 1 Corinthians 6:14

Why would he do something like that? Everyone say it with me:

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. " - John 3:16

Powerful stuff...wouldn't you say?


[edit on 27-11-2007 by saint4God]

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul


sounds familiar...


had to draw the comparison
seems like you should change the name to sithmiller

Yes, I like darth sidious lines in rots when he says the sith have unlimited power. And christians have that same unlimited power, but use it for good, much like Yoda takes the dark energy and turns it positive. in star wars the sith are the anti-christians.

obivously you guys didn't get the idea about the swords, that even with golden, wooder or stick swords..the christians will always win!