Whistleblower: 1.5 Million Coronavirus Cases In China, 50,000 Coronavirus Deaths In Wuhan

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: NorthOfStuff
That works both ways. The official data reflects only the number of cases that enter the health system and the unofficial data is hearsay and word of mouth.

I'm not basing my opinion off figures, I'm basing it based off all the other failed apocalypse scenarios.

Nothing happens until it does.

That doesn’t mean it will happen this time but being prepared and informed requires compiling data along with historical precedent.

originally posted by: Riffrafter
According to ATS - the above is your first post.

So what exactly are you talking about?!

LOL. When socks speak.

originally posted by: NorthOfStuff
Nothing happens until it does.

And when it doesn't it doesn't.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: NorthOfStuff
Nothing happens until it does.

And when it doesn't it doesn't.

20/20 hindsight

originally posted by: Riffrafter
a reply to: Alien Abduct

A billionaire whistleblower alleges Wuhan has crematoriums working 24/7. He claims they’ve cremated some 50,000 coronavirus victims.

Guo Wengui is a Chinese billionaire living in exile in the United States.

A billionaire whistleblower?

What?

I don't think I've ever seen those 2 terms in the same sentence before.

Has anyone?

I thought you have one in charge

originally posted by: Jay-morris

How can you dispute something that is not based on facts and evidence?

I'm sorry but this a very stupid statement.

Look since you refuse to actually read the thread I'll spoon feed you a bit of it okay? Here is a post I made earlier in the thread that is full of facts. You can do a little homework on this and fact-check me if you think what I'm saying is untrue. If anything I say isnt fact then you can easily dispute it. You can read, right?

This disease is only three weeks old and has already killed over 1,200 people. WHO has declared a national emergency in China, all schools in China are closed indefinitely, 60 million people under quarantine, the People's Bank of China (PBOC) pumped in 1.7 trillion yuan ($242.74 billion) through open market operations in an attempt to save their rapidly collapsing economy, despite very strenuous preventative measures taken the number of cases are soaring, Russia has closed its entire boarder with China, nearly all flights and travel aside from trade routs is at a complete halt. 

Continuing this path China will assuredly collapse. They are begging countries to restore ties for fear that the global economy will collapse. This may not turn out to be as bad as it seems then again it may turn out even worse. It doesnt hurt to be a little prepared.

Sad fact is some people get a kick out of the fear mongering. Happens every time something like this happens. Was not long ago that Ebola was going to kill us all!

I'm sure some people do get a kick out of fearmongering. But presenting an interesting story that hasn't even been shown to be false and attempting to have a civil discussion on the topic isn't fearmongering. Also stating facts about how China is responding to the situation isn't fearmongering. Also urging people to "be a little prepared" isnt fearmongering.

Presenting facts and attempting civil discourse isnt fearmongering. And just to clarify once again, I have not presented the story in the OP as fact.

a reply to: Alien Abduct

Look NO, if it were that fricking lethal, you would have more foreign deaths, including the two cruise ships. Its not that lethal. While its probably worse than what is seen in official counts, its not going to be that bad. If it were 50 to 100K, we would be talking Spanish Flu of 1918 levels of lethality.

Common sense says, its not as bad as these sources (which are dodgy as hell and or anecdotal) say.

I will add however it is possible I am wrong about this. I am basing my assumptions on the data we have, which is clearly being blocked with the great firewall to sanitize it.

originally posted by: AcerM

originally posted by: Riffrafter
a reply to: Alien Abduct

A billionaire whistleblower alleges Wuhan has crematoriums working 24/7. He claims they’ve cremated some 50,000 coronavirus victims.

Guo Wengui is a Chinese billionaire living in exile in the United States.

A billionaire whistleblower?

What?

I don't think I've ever seen those 2 terms in the same sentence before.

Has anyone?

I thought you have one in charge

Touché

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: Alien Abduct

Look NO, if it were that fricking lethal, you would have more foreign deaths, including the two cruise ships. Its not that lethal. While its probably worse than what is seen in official counts, its not going to be that bad. If it were 50 to 100K, we would be talking Spanish Flu of 1918 levels of lethality.

Common sense says, its not as bad as these sources (which are dodgy as hell and or anecdotal) say.

I will add however it is possible I am wrong about this. I am basing my assumptions on the data we have, which is clearly being blocked with the great firewall to sanitize it.

I'm not sure exactly which figure you are actually disputing. Not saying you are wrong or I am right, I just need to understand what exactly you are referring to.

a reply to: Alien Abduct

I am disputing 50 K to 100K dead.

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: Alien Abduct

I am disputing 50 K to 100K dead.

Good thing that wasn't presented as fact. However I do like where you say " if it were that lethal then we would have more foriegn deaths." This statement by you is very interesting. Could you please provide more details as to why this is true?

originally posted by: Alien Abduct

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: Alien Abduct

I am disputing 50 K to 100K dead.

Good thing that wasn't presented as fact. However I do like where you say " if it were that lethal then we would have more foriegn deaths." This statement by you is very interesting. Could you please provide more details as to why this is true?

Simple math, if that many people were in fact dying from kungflu there would be more than 2 deaths by now outside of China.

originally posted by: Alien Abduct

originally posted by: Jay-morris

How can you dispute something that is not based on facts and evidence?

I'm sorry but this a very stupid statement.

Look since you refuse to actually read the thread I'll spoon feed you a bit of it okay? Here is a post I made earlier in the thread that is full of facts. You can do a little homework on this and fact-check me if you think what I'm saying is untrue. If anything I say isnt fact then you can easily dispute it. You can read, right?

This disease is only three weeks old and has already killed over 1,200 people. WHO has declared a national emergency in China, all schools in China are closed indefinitely, 60 million people under quarantine, the People's Bank of China (PBOC) pumped in 1.7 trillion yuan ($242.74 billion) through open market operations in an attempt to save their rapidly collapsing economy, despite very strenuous preventative measures taken the number of cases are soaring, Russia has closed its entire boarder with China, nearly all flights and travel aside from trade routs is at a complete halt. 

Continuing this path China will assuredly collapse. They are begging countries to restore ties for fear that the global economy will collapse. This may not turn out to be as bad as it seems then again it may turn out even worse. It doesnt hurt to be a little prepared.

Sad fact is some people get a kick out of the fear mongering. Happens every time something like this happens. Was not long ago that Ebola was going to kill us all!

I'm sure some people do get a kick out of fearmongering. But presenting an interesting story that hasn't even been shown to be false and attempting to have a civil discussion on the topic isn't fearmongering. Also stating facts about how China is responding to the situation isn't fearmongering. Also urging people to "be a little prepared" isnt fearmongering.

Presenting facts and attempting civil discourse isnt fearmongering. And just to clarify once again, I have not presented the story in the OP as fact.

And the evidence that ,50.000 chinese people have died due to the virus? I bet you were one of the first people on here saying BS about Ebola too?

What you posted is not evidence! Do you know how much BS is online regarding this virus!?

originally posted by: Jay-morris

originally posted by: Alien Abduct

originally posted by: Jay-morris

How can you dispute something that is not based on facts and evidence?

I'm sorry but this a very stupid statement.

Look since you refuse to actually read the thread I'll spoon feed you a bit of it okay? Here is a post I made earlier in the thread that is full of facts. You can do a little homework on this and fact-check me if you think what I'm saying is untrue. If anything I say isnt fact then you can easily dispute it. You can read, right?

This disease is only three weeks old and has already killed over 1,200 people. WHO has declared a national emergency in China, all schools in China are closed indefinitely, 60 million people under quarantine, the People's Bank of China (PBOC) pumped in 1.7 trillion yuan ($242.74 billion) through open market operations in an attempt to save their rapidly collapsing economy, despite very strenuous preventative measures taken the number of cases are soaring, Russia has closed its entire boarder with China, nearly all flights and travel aside from trade routs is at a complete halt. 

Continuing this path China will assuredly collapse. They are begging countries to restore ties for fear that the global economy will collapse. This may not turn out to be as bad as it seems then again it may turn out even worse. It doesnt hurt to be a little prepared.

Sad fact is some people get a kick out of the fear mongering. Happens every time something like this happens. Was not long ago that Ebola was going to kill us all!

I'm sure some people do get a kick out of fearmongering. But presenting an interesting story that hasn't even been shown to be false and attempting to have a civil discussion on the topic isn't fearmongering. Also stating facts about how China is responding to the situation isn't fearmongering. Also urging people to "be a little prepared" isnt fearmongering.

Presenting facts and attempting civil discourse isnt fearmongering. And just to clarify once again, I have not presented the story in the OP as fact.

And the evidence that ,50.000 chinese people have died due to the virus? I bet you were one of the first people on here saying BS about Ebola too?

What you posted is not evidence! Do you know how much BS is online regarding this virus!?

I find it intriguing how some of you find it necessary to post things that I didnt actually say.

Please quote me where I stated I have evidence?

Again as I have said, please bring forth anything I have presented as a fact that you dispute. Please include my quote and the details of your dispute.

originally posted by: SorrowSong1

originally posted by: Jay-morris

originally posted by: Alien Abduct

originally posted by: Jay-morris

How can you dispute something that is not based on facts and evidence?

I'm sorry but this a very stupid statement.

Look since you refuse to actually read the thread I'll spoon feed you a bit of it okay? Here is a post I made earlier in the thread that is full of facts. You can do a little homework on this and fact-check me if you think what I'm saying is untrue. If anything I say isnt fact then you can easily dispute it. You can read, right?

This disease is only three weeks old and has already killed over 1,200 people. WHO has declared a national emergency in China, all schools in China are closed indefinitely, 60 million people under quarantine, the People's Bank of China (PBOC) pumped in 1.7 trillion yuan ($242.74 billion) through open market operations in an attempt to save their rapidly collapsing economy, despite very strenuous preventative measures taken the number of cases are soaring, Russia has closed its entire boarder with China, nearly all flights and travel aside from trade routs is at a complete halt. 

Continuing this path China will assuredly collapse. They are begging countries to restore ties for fear that the global economy will collapse. This may not turn out to be as bad as it seems then again it may turn out even worse. It doesnt hurt to be a little prepared.

Sad fact is some people get a kick out of the fear mongering. Happens every time something like this happens. Was not long ago that Ebola was going to kill us all!

I'm sure some people do get a kick out of fearmongering. But presenting an interesting story that hasn't even been shown to be false and attempting to have a civil discussion on the topic isn't fearmongering. Also stating facts about how China is responding to the situation isn't fearmongering. Also urging people to "be a little prepared" isnt fearmongering.

Presenting facts and attempting civil discourse isnt fearmongering. And just to clarify once again, I have not presented the story in the OP as fact.

And the evidence that ,50.000 chinese people have died due to the virus? I bet you were one of the first people on here saying BS about Ebola too?

What you posted is not evidence! Do you know how much BS is online regarding this virus!?

I find it intriguing how some of you find it necessary to post things that I didnt actually say.

Please quote me where I stated I have evidence?

Again as I have said, please bring forth anything I have presented as a fact that you dispute. Please include my quote and the details of your dispute.

I find it interesting this is your first post.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: NorthOfStuff
That works both ways. The official data reflects only the number of cases that enter the health system and the unofficial data is hearsay and word of mouth.

I'm not basing my opinion off figures, I'm basing it based off all the other failed apocalypse scenarios.

Oh that's genius. Let's see, many of the viruses that have apocalyptic potential have failed yet some of them have killed off large sections of the population (albeit a small fraction) but based on the low chances I just assume to make fun of this one and troll this thread.

Dude all that I ask of people is that they prepare themselves for a disaster any disaster . This coronavirus is a good excuse (and scenario) to ponder and think "okay its possible, just as an earthquake or hurricane or tornado or drought or flood or any other disaster natural or otherwise" is possible. So I think we should probably go ahead and prepare if only on a small scale.

Oops this is my wife's account

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: SorrowSong1

originally posted by: Jay-morris

originally posted by: Alien Abduct

originally posted by: Jay-morris

How can you dispute something that is not based on facts and evidence?

I'm sorry but this a very stupid statement.

Look since you refuse to actually read the thread I'll spoon feed you a bit of it okay? Here is a post I made earlier in the thread that is full of facts. You can do a little homework on this and fact-check me if you think what I'm saying is untrue. If anything I say isnt fact then you can easily dispute it. You can read, right?

This disease is only three weeks old and has already killed over 1,200 people. WHO has declared a national emergency in China, all schools in China are closed indefinitely, 60 million people under quarantine, the People's Bank of China (PBOC) pumped in 1.7 trillion yuan ($242.74 billion) through open market operations in an attempt to save their rapidly collapsing economy, despite very strenuous preventative measures taken the number of cases are soaring, Russia has closed its entire boarder with China, nearly all flights and travel aside from trade routs is at a complete halt. 

Continuing this path China will assuredly collapse. They are begging countries to restore ties for fear that the global economy will collapse. This may not turn out to be as bad as it seems then again it may turn out even worse. It doesnt hurt to be a little prepared.

Sad fact is some people get a kick out of the fear mongering. Happens every time something like this happens. Was not long ago that Ebola was going to kill us all!

I'm sure some people do get a kick out of fearmongering. But presenting an interesting story that hasn't even been shown to be false and attempting to have a civil discussion on the topic isn't fearmongering. Also stating facts about how China is responding to the situation isn't fearmongering. Also urging people to "be a little prepared" isnt fearmongering.

Presenting facts and attempting civil discourse isnt fearmongering. And just to clarify once again, I have not presented the story in the OP as fact.

And the evidence that ,50.000 chinese people have died due to the virus? I bet you were one of the first people on here saying BS about Ebola too?

What you posted is not evidence! Do you know how much BS is online regarding this virus!?

I find it intriguing how some of you find it necessary to post things that I didnt actually say.

Please quote me where I stated I have evidence?

Again as I have said, please bring forth anything I have presented as a fact that you dispute. Please include my quote and the details of your dispute.

I find it interesting this is your first post.

Yeah my wife and I use the same computer. Oops! Lmao

originally posted by: SorrowSong1

originally posted by: Jay-morris

originally posted by: Alien Abduct

originally posted by: Jay-morris

How can you dispute something that is not based on facts and evidence?

I'm sorry but this a very stupid statement.

Look since you refuse to actually read the thread I'll spoon feed you a bit of it okay? Here is a post I made earlier in the thread that is full of facts. You can do a little homework on this and fact-check me if you think what I'm saying is untrue. If anything I say isnt fact then you can easily dispute it. You can read, right?

This disease is only three weeks old and has already killed over 1,200 people. WHO has declared a national emergency in China, all schools in China are closed indefinitely, 60 million people under quarantine, the People's Bank of China (PBOC) pumped in 1.7 trillion yuan ($242.74 billion) through open market operations in an attempt to save their rapidly collapsing economy, despite very strenuous preventative measures taken the number of cases are soaring, Russia has closed its entire boarder with China, nearly all flights and travel aside from trade routs is at a complete halt. 

Continuing this path China will assuredly collapse. They are begging countries to restore ties for fear that the global economy will collapse. This may not turn out to be as bad as it seems then again it may turn out even worse. It doesnt hurt to be a little prepared.

Sad fact is some people get a kick out of the fear mongering. Happens every time something like this happens. Was not long ago that Ebola was going to kill us all!

I'm sure some people do get a kick out of fearmongering. But presenting an interesting story that hasn't even been shown to be false and attempting to have a civil discussion on the topic isn't fearmongering. Also stating facts about how China is responding to the situation isn't fearmongering. Also urging people to "be a little prepared" isnt fearmongering.

Presenting facts and attempting civil discourse isnt fearmongering. And just to clarify once again, I have not presented the story in the OP as fact.

And the evidence that ,50.000 chinese people have died due to the virus? I bet you were one of the first people on here saying BS about Ebola too?

What you posted is not evidence! Do you know how much BS is online regarding this virus!?

I find it intriguing how some of you find it necessary to post things that I didnt actually say.

Please quote me where I stated I have evidence?

Again as I have said, please bring forth anything I have presented as a fact that you dispute. Please include my quote and the details of your dispute.

What are you talking about? I have not even replied to you.

a reply to: Alien Abduct

I'm still disputing it for the very reasons I said. In the spirit of openness, I work in the Pharma industry, with a background mainly in Pharmaceutical scale up to manufacture, which yes does not give me much in the way of extra knowledge here, but I also work (my own side business) in Bioinfirmatics (which is if you don't know isa field that develops methods and software tools for understanding biological data. I specialize mostly in Genomics (the genetics side, and that I specialize in ancestral DNA analysis, but my training was also in diseases first). I am very good at seeing patterns in data. The data tells me a few things. Sadly the data is incomplete its why I admit I could be wrong.

On top of all this, we had a BIG jump in cases (and deaths) today. SO I dispute China saying "its under control". However if they were hiding something they would not let a jump like today get out.

There has been according to the Johns Hopkins Site a couple of deaths outside of China (and most of the deaths are in Hubei itself). On top of this there are significant numbers recovered internationally (though its a little odd that the total recovered is so low, but it really depends on how this is measured, and its likely "free of virus due to test" as opposed to "not deathly ill"). On top of this there are a number of nations that have yet to have an official case. I live in one of those (New Zealand).

While its early days with COVID-19, what is clear is its got a fairly low transmission rate (~2%) and low mortality (also about2%). Where it hit is not ideal. I've been to Wuhan (due to work). Its a densely populated place, and if this had been say ebola or the 1918 Spanish flu, we'd have a big problem.

So, take the relative overall lack of deaths (so far) with COVID-19 outside of China (and really outside of Wuhan) mix that with it not having taken off like a wildfire. I don't see that there are 50K to 100K deaths in China. They are also letting the WHO in. You can't hide that many bodies (even burning them) that fast. I suspect whats made Wuhan bad, is the air quality, and the state run health system being over taxed.