Ungrateful,Poisonous,and unacceptable.

First of all I would like to explain that the entire text of the Chatroom is open to everyone.You don't need to be staff to view it.
I would like also to apologise to both Ycon and Cammo dude for pasting their words along with Abraham Virtue's and I'll probably get into a little trouble for posting this topic but I'm madder than I've been since I first came to this board.

As everyone is aware William has opened a topic where members can air their views and some have taken that opportunity and I respect them for it.

BUT there is someone who despite this has poisoned this place with bile.

Abraham Virtue has endeared himself by always apologising.Which he has done often.
BUT I ask you ,in all honesty,How many times does man have the right to be asked to except apologies when it is obvious that they means nothing.

In Ancient Greece they used a democratic way of expelling those that poisoned,They ostracised.

As a moderator I no longer have the option of Ignoring.
You all do!It's time to let your fingers do the talking.

I'll leave you with the chatroom conversation I happened on this morning which has led me to make this most which I think many will be surprised has come from me.

[Abraham_Virtue] What the hell is going on/??

[Abraham_Virtue] Why do you say things like that?

[Cammo_Dude] You felt I was holding back

[Cammo_Dude] I am

[Cammo_Dude] I'm not the only one

[Abraham_Virtue] No I am talking about the other thread

[Abraham_Virtue] www.abovetopsecret.com... This one

[Abraham_Virtue] Read you last post

[Abraham_Virtue] That is what I am talking about

[Cammo_Dude] Yes I know

[Abraham_Virtue] I have done more about this censorship than you can possibly imagine

[Abraham_Virtue] So please get off my case pal

[Abraham_Virtue] Why the @#$*! do you think I called William a Nazi???

[Abraham_Virtue] Cause I wanted to get attention

[Cammo_Dude] I am working too

[Abraham_Virtue] I wanted people to stop ignoring the issues

[AgentMulder320] alo

[Cammo_Dude] I know, but you were going the wrong way with this

[Abraham_Virtue] No I am not

[Cammo_Dude] I see the issues

[Cammo_Dude] Then you will begin to see the freedom we hold here at ATS.

[Abraham_Virtue] Maybe I did with the Nazi comments but not now

[Cammo_Dude] Remember that

[Abraham_Virtue] So you think that censoring someones name is okay????????

[Cammo_Dude] ?

[Abraham_Virtue] Brian!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Abraham_Virtue] WE CAN'T SAY @#$*! BRIAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Abraham_Virtue] WHY?????????????????????????????????????????????????

[Abraham_Virtue] Cause William is a @#$*! NAZI

[Abraham_Virtue] Get it?

[Cammo_Dude] If you were truely trying to help this place, you wouldn't be forcing all of this so quickly

[Abraham_Virtue] We can't say Jessup or Nuh, which aren't even WORDS mind you

[Abraham_Virtue] Oh give me a break

[Cammo_Dude] Look at what you are doing

[Abraham_Virtue] What am I doing:????

[Abraham_Virtue] I am being real

[Abraham_Virtue] I am not sucking someone ass

[Cammo_Dude] You are calling William a nazi and trying to use profanity

[Cammo_Dude] This is what we are trying to stop!

[Abraham_Virtue] I called him a Nazi cause he is one. I won't do that anymore but I will see to it that the censorship stops

[Cammo_Dude] Back when this place started up, we didn't have people with your wants

[Abraham_Virtue] MY WANTS?

[Abraham_Virtue] Tell me what are my wants.

[Cammo_Dude] People just wanted to talk about conspiracies

[Abraham_Virtue] and...............................

[Abraham_Virtue] your point is?

[Cammo_Dude] You want to just find another place where you can shoot your mouth off

[Cammo_Dude] As you said: No wonder the good have left.

[Abraham_Virtue] Dude you don't know a damn thing about me

[Cammo_Dude] You are trying to force a forum into war

[Cammo_Dude] basically

[Abraham_Virtue] I really don't have to listen to this junk

[Cammo_Dude] You invited me

[Cammo_Dude] You wanted it

[Cammo_Dude] ...and you know it's the truth

[Abraham_Virtue] NO I am trying to gather a collective awareness of people who can face the facts

[Abraham_Virtue] Dude I invited you in here because you upset me

[Cammo_Dude] I'm doing the same thing, just at a pace that won't harm prgress

[Abraham_Virtue] You do nothing but alter my words and perception on matters pertaining the censorship

[Cammo_Dude] Well, I guess it isn't going any farther

[Abraham_Virtue] Well that is a matter of opinion

[Cammo_Dude] Why do you think I have been making my posts?

[Abraham_Virtue] I think my pace is just fine

[Cammo_Dude] *sigh*

[Abraham_Virtue] I don;t think your posts have an point

[Cammo_Dude] You will just ruin this place

[Cammo_Dude] then open your eyes

[Abraham_Virtue] Most people here won't understand what you are getting at and will get bored and move on. Trust me I have seen it happen before

[Cammo_Dude] I'm getting people into the thought of this without causing the "unseen difference"

[Cammo_Dude] I'm tired of this

[Cammo_Dude] I'm leaving now

[Abraham_Virtue] Look pal, I have all the evidence I need to prove our points flat out. The only reason I haven't revealed it to this day is because I care about the boards.

[Cammo_Dude] Think about what I'm getting at.

[Cammo_Dude] then show it

[Abraham_Virtue] Why don't you stay and show me that you can handle the truth

[Abraham_Virtue] Quit being a baby and make a damn sacrifice for once

[Abraham_Virtue] You are just scared

[Abraham_Virtue] Why are you so scared?

[Abraham_Virtue] What do you have to fear?

[Abraham_Virtue] Dude if I show what I have this place will be ruined

[Abraham_Virtue] You can't understand that cause you don't know what went on here while you were gone

[Abraham_Virtue] Trust me I am not the enemy

[Abraham_Virtue] Quit treating me like one

[Abraham_Virtue] This is more then just censorship. It is REAL HARD ON CRIMINAL CONSPIRACY

[Abraham_Virtue] You think I am joking???

[Abraham_Virtue] HEEEEEEELLLLLLLLLLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[Abraham_Virtue] Damn I am talking to fu*king walls AGAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!AGHASG

All seems a bit silly to me....... Why cant people just be happy????

It is poison.

And that is only an excerpt.There is plenty more of it.

Out of control.

This is just one reason why ATS will fall down the gutter. You are starting even more problems sir. I don't know what you beef with me is. This is a personal matter between Cammo and I. It should have nothing to do with anyone. The only other person that should be concerned is William. You are simply trying to show others that I am the bad guy. Well if it is so bad for me to think that William is acting like a Nazi then burn me now. I don't truly think he is a SS officer who hates and seeks to destroy the so-called unsavory, but I do think he is over board with is control tactics and his power trips. I am not the only one you know.

This topic was meant to incite even more discontent and confusion. Thank you for taking it this far. I really think you are doing a great job in destroying the peace we once had. That just ruins all the work I have accomplished thus far. Why do you seek to burn me???

Is it because of my comments about William??? Is that what it is??? If that is so then you should realize that I have my opinions. People here call me a crazy alarmist, and a B*tch but that doesn't seem to get anyone's panties in a bunch. Why are my views deemed any different??? Am I that bad that one must do all that they can to discredit me???

Please John speak up. Tell me your concerns. Tell me why you think I am wrong.

Love,
Abraham

I think when someone makes an effort to understand the boards concerns they do not have someone like you stirring sh!t against them.

I had no problem with you but you have gone too far.

You didn't know where to stop.

And I don't know how I can cause even more problems while you're bitching like this and poisoning the atmosphere here.

You called us all Nazis and apologized. You then turn round and do it to William.

Problem, whats the problem with you? You can`t see it boy, thats the problem.

Stop calling people names. Behave like an adult.

*sigh*

Abe, dude, I have mentioned this to you before... you need to relax and not get wound up over stuff that isnt there.

There is NO conspiracy, NONE whatsoever. As far as censorship? You do realize that this is a privately owned board, that you are NOT paying for, and is NOT governed by the 1st amendment except as far as the OWNER cares for it to be?

The MODERATION of the board (not censorship) is simply to keep things from degenerating into utter chaos and loose any semblance of credibility.

If this is something you are unable or unwilling to deal with, perhaps its time for you to seek out another board.

Keep in mind, I am one of the more open minded mods on this board (when I am logged in as DR), and I will agree, there have been some occassions of overzealous warnings from some mods. I have even gone to bat for a user I thought was unfairly warned. BUT, I am NOT going to defend someone who has a penchant for calling us Nazis... I can look past one occassion, since there was an apology, and I think most of the mods are able to do so as well. However, when you apologize and are forgiven, and then take off on the same path as if your apology meant nothing, you are loosing many of your defenders here my friend.

I think one of the main issues here is that you are creating this delusion of persecution. You are under the inpression that everyone is "out to get you" and that William is the ringleader. I do not think it fair to allow you to stir up a storm just so you can be the center of attention and at the same time damage this site.
Grow up and if you don't want to, leave. No one is out to get you.

[Edited on 10-7-2003 by observer]

half the time AV, you're ok and i respect your opinion.
the other half...

I think you woke up without your medication.

Originally posted by John bull 1
I think when someone makes an effort to understand the boards concerns they do not have someone like you stirring sh!t against them.

I had no problem with you but you have gone too far.

You didn't know where to stop.

And I don't know how I can cause even more problems while you're bitching like this and poisoning the atmosphere here.

It wouldn't have been poisoned if you hadn't of started this topic. Please don't try and spit your poison on me. You are the one who insisted on spooping and inciting this conflict thus far. Really no one but those who were there should have seen that conversation. NO ONE. It is only spooks and corruptors such as yourself that insist on taking it this far. Can't you see how this is wrong???

Can't you see that I am intitled to my opinion and shouldn't be in fear of persecution. This is nothing but that. You are intitled to your opinion but at a certain degree. As am I. I made the mistake in the past of inciting my opinion publicly when it should have been private. Now I know better and I have done what I could to keep these opinions private. But it is obvious that you insist that my words are exposed to the public like so unscrupulous and devious reporter. It is not your place to make words I wanted to be private between two or three individuals and purposely make them public. That my friend is wrong. Please try and understand that. I suggest that if you have any more problems such as this with me, you quit making them public and talk to me in private. Don't worry, I won't call you any names and I won't expose your wrong doings in the process. I am not that inconsiderate.


Love,
Abraham

If you wanted your convo to be private, you should have used U2U or the private chat option in the chat room. You had it in public, which is where all this came about.

AV, I thought we put this behind us already:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by IronDragon
If you wanted your convo to be private, you should have used U2U or the private chat option in the chat room. You had it in public, which is where all this came about.

I tend to think that it was a private conversation. You know why??? Cause I knew that only Mulder and Ycon were there in chat. I know that they don't usually speak to others and they just observe the conversations. So I chose to go there and talk with him. I knew that they would most likely join us anyway and I didn't care about that. I knew that they would respect my calls for a man to man conversation. It needed to be a conversation and not just message sending. We needed to talk and sort things out, which is what we did.

However it has become a quagmire because of someone's desires to make it more than that. Someone who sought some dirty talk and saw to it that it was exposed for the demise of another and the demise of this board in general. None of this would have happened if he would have kept to his own business and wasn't snooping on other peoples conversations. This is such a crusade I can't even begin to tell you. I think it is quite clear that you already know anyway. For it seems most of you have jumped on board. This is a bandwagon movement to see me burned.

Oh look there come the pitchforks and torches now. Better run for cover. Once again. Don't blame me for covering my a** and protecting myself when people insist on attacking me. Please don't make this my fault for we know it has nothing to do with my actions. I did nothing to harm anyone. I merely stated my opinion. An opinion that should have been between me and another. If I am going to have to have man to man to talks with others here I should be able to do so without being driven out of here by spooks and corruptables. I feel like a big shot mob boss who just got ratted out by the big media tycoons. What a shame.


Love,
Abe

Originally posted by Bob88
AV, I thought we put this behind us already:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

We did put this behind. Someone else threw it back on board. Do you think I am the only one who has two faces on this place??? Trust me I catch people saying junk such as what I said in chat all the time. I have the decency to keep it to myself though. Cause I have the respect that others can't seem to grasp for another person's right to state an opinion of theirs. Why can't everyone else???

am I the only person who's getting really tired of this whole melodrama? as much as well all love ATS, it is just a message board. the 'censoring' of the name b-ri-a-n isn't so much censorship as spam control. this situation keeps blowing out of control, and for the life of me, I can't seem to figure out what the problem is. I'm seriously starting to wonder whether you have a persecution complex, Abe. to worry so extensively about what, at its core, is nothing but pixels on a computer screen isn't healthy. good God. can't we just bury this once and for all?

edit: and John Bull, I really don't understand why this needed to be taken to the whole board again. this could have been easily discussed amongst the mods and Abe without involving the whole board in what amounts to a pissing match. I don't get the logic here. it just serves to create more drama where there shouldn't be any. I don't mean to sound harsh, but I don't understand why this is being dredged up publicly.

[Edited on 7/10/2003 by MorningtonCrescent]

Does this not seem a bit contradictory though?

Once again I regret what was said and done and I open my arms and heart to you in any way which may be accepted by your being. I praise your actions in this matter and I thank you for giving me the punishment I deserved.

then

[Cammo_Dude] You are calling William a nazi and trying to use profanity

[Cammo_Dude] This is what we are trying to stop!

[Abraham_Virtue] I called him a Nazi cause he is one.

Maybe it's just me, but, normally I don't call those I respect Nazis nor do I show respect to those I concider to be such.

The reason JB1 brought this up again, is because obviously AV is still saying those HORRIBLE things in the chatroom.
This has to stop. His appology was nice, and accepted.
Stop talking about william being a nazi and a facist.

I'll tell you Abraham Virtue I'm one of the most liberal posters here on this board.I'm continually sticking my neck out and tweaking the tail of authority.

It takes a lot for me to lose it.

To quote you directly from above.

"[Abraham_Virtue] Cause I wanted to get attention"

Well you've got the attention you wanted Abraham Virtue.

You say that I am poisoning the board.

I can't see how I can make that much difference when you've been pissing in the well so copiously.

I've tried to befriend you.I've tried to understand you now I've had enough and I'm disowning you.

You see Abraham Virtue I've stuck my neck out for you in the past.And I see this latest vendetta against the staff as a personal betrayal.

Atleast Cold Anger,Cammo Dude,LevitationJunkie and others had the balls to speak out honestly.I may not agree with everything that has been said but I respect them for their integrety.You just blurt out vague notions of freedom you can see how it can be achieved.

If you're not part of any solution you're part of the problem.