Is China creating a "pre-emptive" doctrine?

Seems like china is trying to make it law to attack tawian and it looks like the U.S is going to get dragged into to this mess.

China Steps Up Pressure on Taiwan

BEIJING - China unveiled a law Tuesday authorizing an attack if Taiwan moves toward formal independence, increasing pressure on the self-ruled island while warning other countries not to interfere. Taiwan denounced the legislation as a "blank check to invade" and announced war games aimed at repelling an attack.

The United States has appealed to both sides to settle Taiwan's status peacefully, with no unilateral changes by either side. Washington is Taiwan's main arms supplier and could be drawn into any conflict.

Monkey see, monkey doo..

911 has been and will continue to be a boon for the defense industry.

You know what I think?

Im sure it wont be popular, but I think the US should use this as a leverage piece with China. Make a deal with China: The US "lets" China keep Taiwan for some sort of stronger financial relationship or political partnership. When I say "let", I mean dont interfere or obstruct China in regards to Taiwans independance movement.

I think this for two reasons:
#1 Taiwan isnt worth a war with China
#2 The "Deal" that could result would be huge for the US/China relationship. That relationship needs to be strong in the political future me thinks.

A Chinese/USA partnership is crucial. China WILL BE a dominant power in the future. The USA better pour that foundation now.

So how long will China grandstand , I think if they keep it up they are going to see somethings come down they dont like.


Here is a scenario

China attacks Taiwan , US and Austrailia comes in against china, then feeling spunky and seeing a tied up china North Korea grows some ***** and sneaks up china's tail pipe and then china invades north korea , then south Korea starts grand standing saying not to get us involved china and china gets mad at them, and so on and so on .......This really isnt the time for China to start this crap Bush isnt in the mood to be diplomatic.....

And he really dont want asia to become another middle east type problem, he is finally able to say he is the first president to bring down some of the major players that have kept the middle east in termoil , he isnt going to have a problem doing the same in asia











[edit on 8/3/2005 by drbryankkruta]

First of all our forces are spread way to thin for us to try and go against china. You all for get that this country had a billion people. NK has a million man army. We have almost 300 million citizens. You do that math. China is a force to be reckoned with and I thin this stab at Taiwan is just china saying " the U.S has it's own problems and they can't protect you anymore" They timed this perfectly. Just watch # is going to hit the fan by the end of the year. World War is coming weather you like it or not.

Originally posted by DaTruth
First of all our forces are spread way to thin for us to try and go against china. You all for get that this country had a billion people. NK has a million man army. We have almost 300 million citizens. You do that math. China is a force to be reckoned with and I thin this stab at Taiwan is just china saying " the U.S has it's own problems and they can't protect you anymore" They timed this perfectly. Just watch # is going to hit the fan by the end of the year. World War is coming weather you like it or not.

No one wants war with China but dont underestimate the US military. Just because Nort korea has a million idiots ready to die for their horrible government doesnt mean much at all. We could literally level that country in a few hours if we wanted to with very limited loss of life on our end. The downside is man many civilians would die and I sure as hell dont want to see that but we must defend ourselves first and foremost. Secondly China has no real technology fo war. They are so far behind the US in this area. They may have so many more men then us but they would never succeed in getting them to our shores. Our airforce and navy and very secret arsenals would wipe out their armies. The only way for them to inflict damage on us is to resort to nuclear missiles in which case the whole world is fu**ed. That is if they have the capability to reaching us. Also we would win any war with them but the war would be much unlike any we have seen. The loss of civilian lfe in these countries would be astrnomical. I wish it does never happen but as I said before ultimately we must defend our own first.

Your right China has recognized that the U.S is commited to the Middle East and that are forces are spread to thin. They also understand how weary U.S citizens are about the whole Iraq situation. They are probably betting that we will give up Tawain without a fight but dont underestimate Bush .As we all know him and his cronies love a good fight. Also we have to look and see that China has made considerable strides in the formation of their navy. They have huge billion dollar contracts with the Russians. Hopefully this can be solved peacfully. But it looks like this situation is only going to get worse and it seems inevitable that war is comming

Don't hype the article for too much.

The law only does what China has said all along.

If Taiwan declares independence, China will attack.

If anything, China has gone moderate, dropping the deadline call for reunification lately. China now seems content with the status quo for a long time.

I don't think the law is to justify Mainland's attack on Taiwan.

The Mainland has been playing the annoying and fruitless game of "independence or reunfication" with the Taiwan authority for more than half a century.,in the law,the Mainland for the first time clearly set out its bottom line.as long as the Taiwan authority doesn't cross it,everything is OK.the law doesn't set out a time schedule for the reunification,nor does it mentioned any possible punishment for those against the mainland.so obviously,the purpose of the law is to retain the current conditon of taiwan.

For the Chinesemainland,the Taiwan issue is not so important as its journalistic coverage represents.in this years conference,it only took 1/100 of the contents of the government report.as a third world country,china should first pay attention to the welfare of the poeple rather than seeking solution for a problem impossibe to be solved recently.

So,like a website in singapore reported,after the law passed,"the rule of the game is set"

suihx is right, the Taiwan issue is useful for the CPC to help create a useful unifying issue on the mainland. If they invade all that goes away.

The mainland leadership is worried and should be; the instability they fear is rising every day, and thier ability to control it is slipping.

Yes this is just a chess move on China's part, a way to save face without taking an action that would set them back years in terms of economic growth. It's all about patience - at some stage they will flex their muscles and that which is reffered to by Napoleon as "the sleeping dragon" will awake; and the world will tremble...

But for now? Sleep easy; China is not going to attack anyone (but dissidents) for at lease 20 odd years or so, after that we better watch out. If Bush is smart and fast he will deal with the arabs and straight after will go about dismantling China as they will be the real threat - remember it is easier to pull out the weed while it is young...

China has a different chess set. I don't understand them at all. They are one very big country with many many people. I think some day they will just do what they want.

Originally posted by NetSpy
China has a different chess set. I don't understand them at all. They are one very big country with many many people. I think some day they will just do what they want.

You are right "someday" they will cause trouble, but not today or the next few decades anyway. They will continue to pump money into their military, with this money being fueled by an economy that must boom. If they start fighting the west now this money will soon dry up and they will be back to square one again, and without trading partners this time.

Their game must be one played with patience and that is how they will do it. If they are allowed to continue with this quiet, yet hostile build up we are all going to suffer the consequences, thats why I say we should take them out of the picture now as they may become unassailable in the future. I am not sure how they can be suppressed, but I am sure that Bush and co could soon cook up some BS to justify "going in". And I think they (or maybe one of the next administrations) surely will

I think the respective govt.'s should have taken care of this touchy matter decades ago. China is a " Sleeping Giant " and one day when it wakes up, it is going to be pissed off. Actually there is little we can do other than install sanctions through the U.N.(which is a joke). China really does not have to take actual possesion. They can run blockades all day long and achive their objective without firing a shot for a while. Sooner or later though, there would be a great loss of life all the way around. One must also bear in mind we would be in China's backyard from a bullies stand point.

China could invade and take over Taiwan tommorow and the U.S. would do nothing about it. Why? two reasons
1. The U.S. has not engaged in direct military action in over 50 years with an adversary that was not clearly inferior in every way. Vietnam, Granada, Panama, Iraq, Somalia, Serbia, Afghanistan, Iraq (again!) Did I forget someone!
2. A war between China and the U.S. would mean Walmart would only have about 50 products to sell, and Americans could not live without their Walmart!

China is simply sick of the issue dragging on. I understand why. This was an issue before I was born now I'm old enough to have kids. I would have been took Taiwan over.

Any of you Americans heard of Five-star General Douglas B. MacArthur? He, a very experienced WWII/Cold War general and being on of the few to hold the highest US military honor, advised to never fight a war in Asia on his deathbed. Even now, during war time, we have no living five-star generals so his advice should certainly be considered.

Whoever brought up the scenario of North Korea attacking China is going overboard. First of all, you must realize that at least 90% of North Korean troops are stationed along the border of the DMZ. To remove troops from that area would not only aid the resistance of South Korea (whom has priority, mind you), but would spread the North Korean forces thin. I'm also under the impression that the DPRK is somewhat on a good level with the Chinese communist government.

After listening to all the ignorant patriots stating that they can take on anyone , I would just like to quickly remind you that the Chinese are not only dangerous by themselves, but have a military alliance with Russia. Both forsee a multipolar world in which US dominance is weakened. Also, Russia does recognize Chinese sovereignty over Taiwan, and I doubt they'd hesitate to meet their old time enemy, the United States, on the battlefield. So what you should be considering is to not only handle China, but Russia as well (oh, let's not forget to tag on Iraq, Afghanistan, possibly Korea, and other countries which need the US to maintain stability). I don't know about you, but last time I checked Russia/China made up half the world's land mass :\. That'll take quite a while to capture let alone hold.

[edit on 10-3-2005 by Blackout]

In light of recent events, I've had a revelation. That revelation is, if America should be concentrating on anything, if America should be "meddling" and extending itself on anything, it's China. Unfortunately, America has been looking the other way the whole time.

One of the problems with the Middle East is that it's far too influential. One thing that has happened over the last 20 years or so is that the U.S. has literally been obsessed with the Middle East that they pretty much left the other side of the world to grow, prosper, and now are threatening the U.S. in it's standing as lone superpower. On top of that, America and the rest of the world has shown that it cannot handle the Middle East situation, for the following reasons:

1. Middle East situation is multi-dimensional, multi-faceted. It's about more than just politics, it's also about economics, culture, society, religion, history and philosophy. Just about everything that makes up human civilization is in the Middle East, at least in principle.

2. The Middle East is THE cradle of modern human civilization. This means that the Middle East is not something that is at all easy to handle or see immediete results. Whatever changes may have positive short-term results, but it's the long-run that's more important. The Middle East is so volatile that the long-term results will be absolutely potentially terrifying for all parties involved. And what happens in the Middle East reverberates to the rest of the world.

3. That very influence of the Middle East is what makes it so dangerous and undesirable, because the more influential something is, the harder it is to change it or conquer it.

So, why China? Because China is such a simple situation, like the Cold War. Conquer them or be conquered by them. China isn't a matter of terrorism, it isn't a matter of religion, it's not a matter of "good vs. evil," it's not a matter of modern society, politics, culture vs. the traditional religious theocracies, it's not liberalism vs. conservatism. It's none of that complicated stuff. It's all very simple. The United States of America, world's lone superpower, political/economic powerhouse, the nexus of modern civilization. The nation that defines this planet Earth we live on. Then there is China. Fast-rising superpower. World's largest population and culture. Tremendous principle and legacy. Obviously, there is a showdown in sight somewhere in the future. Eventually, the U.S. is going to have to decide whether to let China become it's rival, or if they're going to solidify it's place as greatest country on Earth. A very simple situation.

Not to mention that the whole situation with China is a very outward-looking one, while the the Middle East situation is a very inward-looking one. With China, there will be more emphasis on things like knowledge, science, etc., because those are what drives China, so America will be challenged to look at those fields as well. U.S. vs. China is a very progressive situation, so to speak. In current America, which is Middle East-enfused, we are seeing major conservatism and backwardness in politics, wisdom, and decay in all parts of life.

As for the Middle East, I consider it's a cross between Pandora's Box and the Garden of Eden. Some things are better left alone.

I haven't really written this as well as I wanted to, but I hope I got my point across. Thoughts?

with our tech that taiwan has, we cant afford to not get involved, if china defeats them, they will have alot of new toys to play with, if they invade i bet we will be involved in a naval and air battles and some ground support like the soviets and chinese in korea and vietnam and what we did in afghanistan against the soviets.

Originally posted by NetSpy
China has a different chess set. I don't understand them at all. They are one very big country with many many people. I think some day they will just do what they want.

Yeah, it's called Chinese Chess

It plays like the one, but with substantial differences in Pieces and Moves.