Debunkers: You've lost credibility and will continue to lose

a reply to: Visiting ESB

This is refreshing to hear. Thank you. We finally have some semblance of official disclosure from the US Navy of all entities and even still people want to try and debunk that.

I guess their new slogan will be

In the Navy, you can spot a spaceship off land

In the Navy, you re bewildered like your fellow man

Disclosure of what exactly? Oh, it's unknown? Is it Jesus? Superman? Maybe some new drone they have and are using this to let other militaries see how wildly superior it is to their own tech? None of you can answer honestly and jump to proof of your own bias...

I'd enjoy to see aliens exist in my lifetime, but I prefer to see facts. This concept that something is now PROVED is a falsehood and based on a want for a specific reality. UFO being synonymous as a cultural term with aliens muddies this conversation.

All that exists is an unknown, see what you want I suppose, but you have no ground to claim beyond "I don't know"

a reply to: Cleric0fChaos

a reply to: Rob808

Damn. First post on here in years and already getting flamed.

What I'm conveying is that it is a lot more comforting knowing that there is some semblance of disclosure, as sokenof the direct video even illustrates people being bewildered. Military trained people visibly wavering and actually admitting instead of just saying nothing happened is a step in the right direction.

Didn't mean to piss you off.

originally posted by: Rob808
Disclosure of what exactly? Oh, it's unknown? Is it Jesus? Superman? Maybe some new drone they have and are using this to let other militaries see how wildly superior it is to their own tech? None of you can answer honestly and jump to proof of your own bias...

I'd enjoy to see aliens exist in my lifetime, but I prefer to see facts. This concept that something is now PROVED is a falsehood and based on a want for a specific reality. UFO being synonymous as a cultural term with aliens muddies this conversation.

All that exists is an unknown, see what you want I suppose, but you have no ground to claim beyond "I don't know"

a reply to: Cleric0fChaos

It could be military technology, it could be alien. No one knows! But the importance if this is the fact that they have turned around and said the footage is genuine, and they do not know what the objects were.

Now, that is very important!

originally posted by: Jay-morris

originally posted by: Rob808
Disclosure of what exactly? Oh, it's unknown? Is it Jesus? Superman? Maybe some new drone they have and are using this to let other militaries see how wildly superior it is to their own tech? None of you can answer honestly and jump to proof of your own bias...

I'd enjoy to see aliens exist in my lifetime, but I prefer to see facts. This concept that something is now PROVED is a falsehood and based on a want for a specific reality. UFO being synonymous as a cultural term with aliens muddies this conversation.

All that exists is an unknown, see what you want I suppose, but you have no ground to claim beyond "I don't know"

a reply to: Cleric0fChaos

It could be military technology, it could be alien. No one knows! But the importance if this is the fact that they have turned around and said the footage is genuine, and they do not know what the objects were.

Now, that is very important!

^^^^ my point exactly.

Im not upset, just pointing out the failings in this OP. That's good you're reassured, but of what? I enjoy the mystery here too, speculation is great fun. answering that mystery as "disclosure" of aliens by the navy is no more than a hope. Give more than "we don't know what it is" to claim you know what it is...

a reply to: Cleric0fChaos

originally posted by: Rob808
Your basis for your opinion is founded on what exactly? So far a speck of 5 pixels moving differently than things you're accustom to seeing from the perspective shown means... intelligent aliens controlling craft??????

Please don't persue a career as a lawyer....

a reply to: Rick26

hahahahahaha! Based on the very credible EYEWITNESS testimony of Navy pilots. They're the court-equivalent of an expert. They witnessed this themselves, not on video. And BTW, I AM a lawyer, quite successful I should add and am in court presenting evidence almost every day of the week, often from experts.

originally posted by: Rob808
There claim is they don't know what it is... you jump to aliens. That is the distinction you are failing to see.


a reply to: Visiting ESB

It's the MOST logical answer. Like it or not. And we don't need "scientific" evidence for this conclusion, just logical connections to be made. When those are made, it leads to ONE answer...

originally posted by: MarioOnTheFly
a reply to: DJMSN

if you accept the "unidentified" designation, and take into account all that "weird" stuff they do (if you believe eye witnesses), it is far more rational to state "it's aliens"..then to say..."it's earthly secret black budget tech".

As the OP stated, there is absolutely no reason why a holder of such "unseen" tech would try to keep it a secret from the rest of the world, and then flaunt it in front of hundreds of witnesses, practically admitting what you try to hide all this time. Also, if you accept the stated performances of these things, it's laughable to suggest we could potentially have such tech. Physics is at least 100 years from where we are now, and I'm not even talking about the public sector.

And please..no crap about psyops. Creating a psyop of that magnitude, for at least 50 years, all over the world, would have to include thousands and thousands of people, spanning all continents. Talk about unrealistic.

If these latest Navy videos are truly unidentified, equally to joe public and the navy alike, then by all means...aliens all the way...certainly not something of this civilization we created today.

I'm also open to the idea it's a hidden Earthly civ. Non-human, or non Earth human.

This, worth reposting. Especially the first sentence.

originally posted by: turbonium1

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: turbonium1

and the military says aliens exist,

They do?

They've shown photos, or they've said photos have alien craft in them, no?

You are talking about alien craft which no one in their right mind denies exist, but you made it sound as if you said "the military says aliens exist", two different things. The military, nor anyone, have any concept about actual aliens or the preferred romantic, ETs.

originally posted by: 1point92AU
a reply to: Hunkadinka

I find it ironic a debunker would even use the word "irrefutable" in any of their discourse considering the very fact debunkers never provide irrefutable evidence contravening verified UAP reports. That is truly the definition of irony.

As an aside why are you repeating what I already wrote regarding governments? Are you new to the topic of Ufology? You seem to be behind in your knowledge of the topic.

You should try to sound as if you know what you're talking about as you don't. A debunker uses the term "irrefutable" when asking for evidence. That is the only kind of evidence that counts, especially in a court of law.

Me repeating you? I have forgotten more about UFOlogy than you'll ever learn. You are a tyro and nothing you say is worthy of being repeated, son.

originally posted by: Rick26

originally posted by: odzeandennz
There's no UFOs .

Because we don't know what they are, doesn't make aliens.
The last people you should trust are the navy or government..


Where are thise ufo? It seems as video technologies advance we mysteriously see less ufos

Ok so lets say they arent aliens, then who are they?
And with they, i mean the what/whoever flies these craft. Cause they sure as hell are craft, they sure as hell are operates by intelligent beings and they sure as hell aint piloted by humans. Cause no normal Human body can deal with this kinds of movement at such speeds. We would be crushed like flies on a windshield.

So, of it aint is, if it aint aliens, who is piloting these things then? Cause one thing is for sure, they are technologically engineered vehicles piloted by intelligent creatures. There’s no denying that, if you’d seen those videos

You sound as if you missed the train! What do you think we've been discussing here all of these years? You have the believers of ETs and you have the opposite who because of the lack of evidence can't make the jump and, like me, simply say we don't know if, first, UFOs/UAP are craft or something else maybe a living organism. As far as the human conception of piloting, again we don't know. You can't be definite about something you don't know. Keep an open mind until you know better.

originally posted by: Cleric0fChaos
a reply to: Rob808

Damn. First post on here in years and already getting flamed.

What I'm conveying is that it is a lot more comforting knowing that there is some semblance of disclosure, as sokenof the direct video even illustrates people being bewildered. Military trained people visibly wavering and actually admitting instead of just saying nothing happened is a step in the right direction.

Didn't mean to piss you off.

With the announcement of the Navy over the publicity that videos have received, that's nowhere near disclosure as believed by ATS members. We've had tons of better military videos that the awful, zero detail, "gun" cameras in the Navy videos. What ATS members are demanding is to hear from governments the secrets that are suspected that they know about aliens and the secret info about aliens or that there are alien bodies either alive or dead in some Hangar 18. THAT'S what they call disclosure, not that the governments admit that there are UFOs/UAP, that's old.

a reply to: network dude

Just because a video has been picked up by a questionable outfit doesn't discount it automatically.

Anyway, if you've been here on ats long enough you'd be aware this ufo phenomenon is happening worldwide.

There are even more spectacular displays in other countries like the Philippines where I'm at.

What the Navy posted of UFO/uso is actually old hat but it does give it more legitimacy.

Guys, it's been happening for at least a century and even embedded into folktales

This is not just another country.

There's something else entirely that's with us on this planet.

Let's pull our heads out of the sand.

originally posted by: Visiting ESB

originally posted by: Rob808
There claim is they don't know what it is... you jump to aliens. That is the distinction you are failing to see.


a reply to: Visiting ESB

It's the MOST logical answer. Like it or not. And we don't need "scientific" evidence for this conclusion, just logical connections to be made. When those are made, it leads to ONE answer...

Please don't pursue a career as a lawyer! Oh, you are one, excuse me. Glad I'll never need you to represent me. I bet you get a lot of "overruled", IF you are a court lawyer which you couldn't be.

originally posted by: Hunkadinka

originally posted by: Visiting ESB

originally posted by: Rob808
There claim is they don't know what it is... you jump to aliens. That is the distinction you are failing to see.


a reply to: Visiting ESB

It's the MOST logical answer. Like it or not. And we don't need "scientific" evidence for this conclusion, just logical connections to be made. When those are made, it leads to ONE answer...

Please don't pursue a career as a lawyer! Oh, you are one, excuse me. Glad I'll never need you to represent me. I bet you get a lot of "overruled", IF you are a court lawyer which you couldn't be.

LOL I wouldn't want you as a client, I pick and choose who I represent. My Martindale Hubble and avvo ratings are ALL excellent. You're one of the more intellectually dishonest ones here and that's ok, there's room for everyone,especially those who so readily expose themselves...

originally posted by: Visiting ESB

originally posted by: Hunkadinka

originally posted by: Visiting ESB

originally posted by: Rob808
There claim is they don't know what it is... you jump to aliens. That is the distinction you are failing to see.


a reply to: Visiting ESB

It's the MOST logical answer. Like it or not. And we don't need "scientific" evidence for this conclusion, just logical connections to be made. When those are made, it leads to ONE answer...

Please don't pursue a career as a lawyer! Oh, you are one, excuse me. Glad I'll never need you to represent me. I bet you get a lot of "overruled", IF you are a court lawyer which you couldn't be.

LOL I wouldn't want you as a client, I pick and choose who I represent. My Martindale Hubble and avvo ratings are ALL excellent. You're one of the more intellectually dishonest ones here and that's ok, there's room for everyone,especially those who so readily expose themselves...

You said: " ... those who so readily expose themselves... You mean like transparency, esquire? Thank you!

To my knowledge there have been no official documents released by the US Navy, CIA, NSA, etc. that authenticates any UFO sightings.

All I have seen is media hype and claims. I wonder why there are so many television programs coming out trying to profit from the UFO craze. Maybe its because Ancient Aliens has become so lucrative.

originally posted by: eManym
To my knowledge there have been no official documents released by the US Navy, CIA, NSA, etc. that authenticates any UFO sightings.

All I have seen is media hype and claims. I wonder why there are so many television programs coming out trying to profit from the UFO craze. Maybe its because Ancient Aliens has become so lucrative.

No documents but public statements by the U.S. Navy acknowledging that the videos are genuine and show “unexplained aerial phenomena,” or UAP, the term that I use exclusively as one can't really give a name to the unknown.

Television programs dealing with UAP and associated events have always been in vogue. There have been many similar shows to Ancient Aliens with a slightly different bent but Erich von Daniken has always been in the news. AA is an over-the-top show but it is popular because the gullible believers make it a success. Surely, a certain percentage of the viewing audience doesn't accept as fact all of what the guests constantly say it's true. They have my attention because I want to visit all of the locales the lucky (not really, I don't accept luck as being part of our creation) hosts go to and I'm never going to see the Mayan, Aztecs, etc., ruins. So I'll put up with the silliness especially from house-residents such as the Ph.D.s.

So, let the producers profit, I'm benefiting with them and I still laugh at the "Hair Guy".

originally posted by: Hunkadinka

originally posted by: 1point92AU
a reply to: Hunkadinka

I find it ironic a debunker would even use the word "irrefutable" in any of their discourse considering the very fact debunkers never provide irrefutable evidence contravening verified UAP reports. That is truly the definition of irony.

As an aside why are you repeating what I already wrote regarding governments? Are you new to the topic of Ufology? You seem to be behind in your knowledge of the topic.

A debunker uses the term "irrefutable" when asking for evidence.

Uh...ok. That's not what a debunker does. You are definitely new to the topic of Ufology. It's ok though...we all started out somewhere at one point.