Federal Tipped Minimum Wage of $2.13 is Indentured Servitude?

She's right but....

1. The actual minimum wage still isn't a living wage so it's kind of a moot point to start the debate at people who pay below minimum wage.

2. She's really just using it to sell a solution that isn't really a solution. Which there actually isn't one without going to places nobody is really willing to go (population control and so forth).

a reply to: DanDanDat

I guarantee she made more in tips than $15 an hour as a bartender.

I also guarantee she didnt report all those cash tips to the IRS.

originally posted by: JustJohnny
a reply to: DanDanDat

Since 1995

“CEO Pay Up 298%, Average Worker's? 4.3% (1995-2005)”

consumerist.com...


I doubt the consumerist is a liberal organization lol..

Do you suppose tom cruise or labron james making $20 million a movie or shoe endorsement are in line with the peanut vendor or janitors in the studios?

I bet there are more professional athletes making $10 million a year that CEOs.
That would be an interesting number to see.

originally posted by: JustJohnny
a reply to: Edumakated

lol me put the Kools Aid down?!?!


A) my next post was a link that showed science 1995 CEO pay has gone up 300% while worker pay rose 4.3...


Those are percents.. and in a perfect world would stay the same..

B) the chart handles over years..

No, those percents would not stay the same because we don't live in a perfect world. All workers are NOT equal. My wife's income and mine have gone up 800% since 1995...

The CEO of Wal-Mart is going to have a different ratio than the CEO of Goldman Sachs. Wal-Mart has a bunch of low paid retail cashiers.... Even admins at Goldman are making around $100k. The ratio is MEANINGLESS without context.

Get off the evil CEO meme and replace it with actors or athletes.

Will Smith makes $20 million a film. How much do you think the production assistant on his films is making? the grip? Should LeBron James income be capped because the guy flinging hotdogs in the stands is making minimum wage?

a reply to: JustJohnny

Take a look.

You can see why CEO pay is up.

americansfortaxfairness.org...

Most American taxpayers would be shocked to learn that they subsidize CEO bonuses. A tax loophole allows corporations to deduct from their taxable income any amount paid to CEOs and their executives, as long as the pay is “performance-based.” This means that the more they pay their executives, the less they pay in federal taxes.

Local watering hole a good looking bar tender that's been there 15 years clears $1500 a week in cash. Small town bar 4 days a week first shift 10-5:30. No responsibilities other than handing out food and drink from the bar. Contractors in town her cas doubles.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus
The good servers in a good spot make that...

Basically no one at waffle house, ihop or fidays does..

Not consistently

originally posted by: Bluntone22

originally posted by: JustJohnny
a reply to: DanDanDat

Since 1995

“CEO Pay Up 298%, Average Worker's? 4.3% (1995-2005)”

consumerist.com...


I doubt the consumerist is a liberal organization lol..

Do you suppose tom cruise or labron james making $20 million a movie or shoe endorsement are in line with the peanut vendor or janitors in the studios?

I bet there are more professional athletes making $10 million a year that CEOs.
That would be an interesting number to see.

Wall Street Journal had an article on this a few weeks ago. I was trying to find it but can't seem to locate it. Sure if you Google enough, it will come up. Basically, they compared the F500 CEOS to the highest paid athletes and entertainers. Athletes and entertainers made a lot of more in most cases. They had a lot of nice charts, etc.

It is funny to me to see all these leftist go on and on about CEO pay while ignoring all the other highly paid people. I guess CEOs don't virtue signal enough.

The post regarding Americans for Tax fairness is a joke too... They don't seem to care that entertainers use all kinds of loop holes to reduce their tax burden... starting LLCs, production companies, etc. Does anyone think A list actors get a paystub for $10 million? No, they set up a corporation that gets paid to shelter themselves from taxes as much as possible.

Most waitresses I have known, if they are decent waitresses, are the best paid workers in the restaurants because of their tips. AOC is nuts. She hasn't a clue. If she ever did waitress, I doubt if anyone would tip her because her attitude sucks with negativity. Waitresses with a friendly positive attitude do well with tips.

I think that AOC is disconnected from society, she seems to be one of those stuck up bitches with a negative attitude against anyone who did not agree with her.

Some new waitresses may not make much in tips till they learn how to deal with people properly. Waitressing is servitude, they serve food. That is the job.

originally posted by: JustJohnny

The good servers in a good spot make that...

Basically no one at waffle house, ihop or fidays does..

Not consistently

Yeah? You been surveying them or maybe you're preparing their taxes?

the way that we give labor dignity is by paying people the respect and the value that they are worth

Raise your hand if you tip based on this principle? I know I do. Give me crap service, and you get crap tip. Give me wonderful service, and you get a wonderful tip.

Jack up the minimum wage to the point where the food at your place of business is so expensive that I no longer feel it's worth eating there, and you get no tip from me because I'm cooking my own at home.

I just started serving at a little family owned Italian restaurant and during lunch I make $4.50/hr because it is slower than dinner. Today I worked 4 hours and cleared $60. Added to my hourly I am close to $20/hr.

The other night I worked 3 hours and made $75. Added to the $2.50/hr hourly and I'm close to $30/hr.

Keep that $15/hr minimum the fluck away from me. I'd much rather use my charm and social skills to schmooze the tables for better tips than work a dead restaurant because menu prices would have to increase dramatically to take the increased hourly rate into account.

Btw, I do in fact claim all my cash tips because if I go to apply for a loan or when I accrue vacation hours, those cash tips increase my hourly vacation rate and also help with the loan approval process.

It would create stable income and certainly help some waiters who work in slow restaurants. However, tipping would go away for the most part as food costs increased and that would hurt waiters who do well for themselves. I believe it's done in some other countries, as my waiter friend said some foreigners are oblivious that 15-20% tip is expected.

Then you would have to increase minimum wage to all jobs to $15 an hour to be fair. Wouldn't make sense to single out one job. Not sure if that's a good move or not. However, federal minimum wage is unlivable and sometimes people are stuck with a minimum wage job for awhile before they find a better job.

originally posted by: jadedANDcynical
I just started serving at a little family owned Italian restaurant and during lunch I make $4.50/hr because it is slower than dinner. Today I worked 4 hours and cleared $60. Added to my hourly I am close to $20/hr.

The other night I worked 3 hours and made $75. Added to the $2.50/hr hourly and I'm close to $30/hr.

Keep that $15/hr minimum the fluck away from me. I'd much rather use my charm and social skills to schmooze the tables for better tips than work a dead restaurant because menu prices would have to increase dramatically to take the increased hourly rate into account.

Btw, I do in fact claim all my cash tips because if I go to apply for a loan or when I accrue vacation hours, those cash tips increase my hourly vacation rate and also help with the loan approval process.

I agree with you.

I've waited tables many a time to make ends meet and it was a rare day that I didn't make over $20 an hour.

Dinner shifts pay better than breakfast ones do, in my experience.

All paying a waitress a base of $15 and hour is going to do is raise the price of the food and starve the wait staff.

So no... no thank you.

originally posted by: grey580
a reply to: JustJohnny

Take a look.

You can see why CEO pay is up.

americansfortaxfairness.org...

Most American taxpayers would be shocked to learn that they subsidize CEO bonuses. A tax loophole allows corporations to deduct from their taxable income any amount paid to CEOs and their executives, as long as the pay is “performance-based.” This means that the more they pay their executives, the less they pay in federal taxes.

Very interesting. The rich lobby for tax loopholes then defend their actions with "trickledown". It's a shame that it's either someone like AOC trying to destroy the rich; or a politician who is making laws to make the rich richer.

originally posted by: JustJohnny
a reply to: Wide-Eyes

All industries are underpaid below upper management...

Look at any graph that charts entry level employ pay to ceo pay , or that compares both of those things to inflation..

CEO pay has climbed 1,000s of percents whole entry level pay has barely doubled..


I forget the actual numbers but will try and find it..

People who think as you do always forget upward mobility of workers.

An entry level job pays lower because it is exactly that.

I know the oilfield is a skewed number to use (we don't have enough workers so demand is high enough to REALLY inflate entry level pay) but here a non-skilled entry level worker will usually start at 70k, be receiving 90k within 3 months, 100k easily within a year.

After the first year you are no longer entry level, so even sideways mobility (same job, different company) can net you an additional 20k or so a year your first few years.

That doesn't include your benefits package, which usually includes employee-paid BCBS gold health care, either free housing or a $1100 a month housing allowance, a company truck, free gas, free cellphone, free TV, internet, etc, etc, etc...

So you can't really use an entry level pay and compare it to a CEO's pay, much less a skilled workers.

You also have to remember that when there are less workers than actual jobs, demand raises average pay.

As it is doing right now under Trump and was pretty much stagnant under Obama.

Jobs here pay about 50% more than they did 5 years ago, for instance.

a reply to: BrianFlanders

How is this going to work if the Federal min goes up to $15 ? I mean here in LA $15 a hour isn't squat But move to the back woods of Kentucky get a job at $15 a hour that's OK money which would mean all the prices that where cheap because of the area would rise ... Am I missing the point ?

originally posted by: Gargoyle91
a reply to: BrianFlanders

How is this going to work if the Federal min goes up to $15 ? I mean here in LA $15 a hour isn't squat But move to the back woods of Kentucky get a job at $15 a hour that's OK money which would mean all the prices that where cheap because of the area would rise ... Am I missing the point ?

Well, that and state and local governments will pretty much always want a higher minimum wage because then property values go up, property taxes increase and then said governments have more money to waste.

Doesn't help the entry-level worker at all (who now has higher rents, higher bills and less purchasing power), but it DOES help keep all those state and country retirement plans solvent...

a reply to: DanDanDat

How can it be indentured servitude if you can leave that job and find a different one? Not all restaurants are worth working at. And not everyone can be a good server.

If you can’t earn $15 an hour in tips serving, you probably shouldn’t be a server. That comes out to 3-5 customers an hour. Assuming they spend at least $10 each.

The tip system is there to weed out poor wait staff.

a reply to: DanDanDat

I could see cities like New York, or Los Angeles implementing a $15 per hr minimum, but that should be by choice. It would not work as a federal minimum wage.

I heard recently that cities like LA and Malibu are having trouble finding police and firefighters because those jobs don’t pay enough and nobody can afford to live close enough and fill those jobs for the salaries that are being offered.

Raising the minimum to $15 will raise property taxes and property values, as well as food prices, gas prices, plumbers, electricians, carpenters, computer techs, and everything else which will only end up making it harder to find affordable houses and services everywhere, especially in very rural areas. Democrats need to stop electing bartenders and skateboarders and start looking for educated individuals to lead them.