Beyond Bigelow & BAASS, After AATIP and on To the Stars...

originally posted by: celltypespecific
a reply to: celltypespecific

Very refreshing that main stream academics like myself are taking this subject seriously:

Again... SMH. But is he psychic? Does he drool over Sexy Lue?

Physics professor shares importance of Navy confirming UFO videos

Can't access that site in the UK, but reading comments about the article, I probably had a lucky escape...

"ozarksfirst needs an editor. that was brutal to read."

"Gotta enter the 4th dimension to read it."

"Yeah. I stopped reading when I realized the author apparently didn't really read it, either."

This prof sounds as reliable as Boris Johnson's personal adviser.

A couple of points.
One, have we all forgotten TFT

Two, on this Gimbal video, I’m like Vallee. I will study it closely after all the riffraff (nobody in this thread am I’m referring to) who have polluted the research air. Then I’ll come back to it and take an objective and closer look at it. Right now too much TTSA pollution is in the intellectual air.

So just like the great researcher, when he stays away from public hysteria over UFO incidents, I’ll stay away from this Gimbal hoopla until the smoke clears.

originally posted by: Arbitrageur

originally posted by: celltypespecific

He's probably talking about this, it's from one of the papers on advanced tech that AATIP money paid for:

The Pentagon compiled research into fringe science

Despite it’s constant use in science fiction, wormhole travel is still very much hypothetical.

The DIA report determined that the government wouldn’t be seeing the use of wormholes anytime soon, but despite the bleak outlook, still made a plea for sustained research support.

They might as well ask for money to see if pigs can fly, even though we won't "be seeing pigs fly anytime soon", please send money to throw them off roofs and research whether any can really fly, we won't know if it's possible until we do the research.

I think the chances of that are approximately the same as the chances of a nuke showing up at the white house from the other side of the world in 10 seconds.

I'm not really inclined to think either area is a viable research topic, though wormholes might be one of those defense propaganda stories where they released the paper and got some useful idiot to repeat the idea, hoping China and Russia would waste their time and limited research budget pursuing some pie in the sky idea like wormholes that will probably never work, instead of researching something more practical that may actually give them an advantage.

Here's some perspective on the feasibility of wormhole travel or sending a nuke to the white house through a wormhole:

Will we ever… travel in wormholes?

A wormhole useful for travelling would have to be big enough and last long enough to send someone or something through. The problem is that for such a wormhole, you would need more negative energy than the rules allow. And even if you could break the rules, you would need an enormous amount. As a very rough approximation, you would need the energy the sun produces over 100 million years to make a wormhole about the size of a grapefruit. No one knows how even an advanced civilisation could access that much negative energy.

If people like you were in charge humans would never fly or go to space because it's impossible

a reply to: Willtell

The Navy DID investigate the leaked FLIR footage from the nimitz "encounter".

They decided to drop their investigation due to the footage being seen by most of the crew and with a crew of 5,000 people... was deemed too much work where the likelihood would be that the investigation would turn up nothing.

John Greenwald confirms this in a response to these very question's from a DoD spokesperson.

originally posted by: celltypespecific
a reply to: celltypespecific

Very refreshing that main stream academics like myself are taking this subject seriously:

Physics professor shares importance of Navy confirming UFO videos

His Occam's razor postulate is mainstream thinking:

"“Which says the most likely explanation is the simplest one. The simplest explanation is no, it’s not beings from insanely distant places. There’s probably a simpler explanation.”

And mainstream thinking is also that aliens probably exist, so yes two of his three points are mainstream thinking.

But where he possibly departs somewhat from mainstream thinking is his possible lack of training in all the ways humans are known to misperceive what they observe, when he calls the eyewitness accounts credible. For example, take the eyewitness accounts of the Nimitz encounter, where Fravor says he saw the object hovering, and the other pilot said the object was moving at 500 knots. Since two different eyewitness accounts tell us two different things, which account is credible? The account that it was hovering, or the account that it was moving at 500 knots?

And it's not just discrepancies between pilots. I'm not sure Fravor is re-telling his account consistently, in what happened to the UFO he saw. In the Wick West and TheoryQED debate, they discussed that Fravor at one point said he thought the UFO flew off at incredibly high speed, but Mick West said that radar did not confirm that it flew off, and TheoryQED said he wasn't sure but had sent a question to Kevin Day for clarification and Day hadn't responded yet. Then I heard Fravor on the youtube video from the McMinnville UFO conference say that the UFO "just disappeared". He didn't say it flew off that time, so did he change his story to be more consistent with the radar not showing the object flying off?

So I think more mainstream scientists would tend to not rely too heavily on eyewitness accounts except as a starting point, to go looking for some actual data which is not as unreliable as human perception. I have no doubt Fravor and the other pilots saw something interesting, but I think nobody's eyewitness account should be assumed to be 100% accurate, especially when eyewitnesses to the same event commonly disagree about exactly what they saw, and if you have been paying any attention at all, you know there are discrepancies in eyewitness accounts of the Nimitz incident and other UFO cases, sometimes large discrepancies, despite lies being told that everybody is telling exactly the same story.

originally posted by: KiwiNite
If people like you were in charge humans would never fly or go to space because it's impossible

It's entirely possible to travel between stars without exceeding the speed of light, it's just very difficult but if we don't destroy ourselves or have civilization destroyed by the next ice age, we'll probably get there. If you want some interesting ideas from engineers on how we might accomplish that, here's an article from a site called interesting engineering, which shows some real and theoretical possibilities (including warp drive) but wormholes are not listed, since even theoretically they don't seem to be feasible for practical use. NASA is already researching warp drive, or baby steps in that direction.

How Do We Achieve Interstellar Flight?

Here's NASA researcher "Sonny" White discussing warp drive research:

a reply to: Arbitrageur

Eagleworks is part of the same space drive scene as a bunch of our other charecters. They were doing work on the Em Drive but got shuttered for lack of results iirc.

It makes me genuinely curious how much of this stuff is the same scheme as the teleportation study. At least Alan Bond got Reaction Engines bending tin. Jim Oberg might know more - I recall him mentioning JBIS getting more woo over the years.

a reply to: pigsy2400


All of this indicates the US IC knows nothing about UFOs. Has no secrets to reveal.

So the great secret may be that there are no secrets. And if there were we would know them.

Surprisingly well-done article by popular mechanics for the history buffs among us juice quotes from our friend Leslie Kean
Angels, Airships, and Aliens: The 3,500-Year History of UFO Sightings

originally posted by: Arbitrageur

originally posted by: celltypespecific
a reply to: celltypespecific

Very refreshing that main stream academics like myself are taking this subject seriously:

Physics professor shares importance of Navy confirming UFO videos

His Occam's razor postulate is mainstream thinking:

"“Which says the most likely explanation is the simplest one. The simplest explanation is no, it’s not beings from insanely distant places. There’s probably a simpler explanation.”

And mainstream thinking is also that aliens probably exist, so yes two of his three points are mainstream thinking.

But where he possibly departs somewhat from mainstream thinking is his possible lack of training in all the ways humans are known to misperceive what they observe, when he calls the eyewitness accounts credible. For example, take the eyewitness accounts of the Nimitz encounter, where Fravor says he saw the object hovering, and the other pilot said the object was moving at 500 knots. Since two different eyewitness accounts tell us two different things, which account is credible? The account that it was hovering, or the account that it was moving at 500 knots?

And it's not just discrepancies between pilots. I'm not sure Fravor is re-telling his account consistently, in what happened to the UFO he saw. In the Wick West and TheoryQED debate, they discussed that Fravor at one point said he thought the UFO flew off at incredibly high speed, but Mick West said that radar did not confirm that it flew off, and TheoryQED said he wasn't sure but had sent a question to Kevin Day for clarification and Day hadn't responded yet. Then I heard Fravor on the youtube video from the McMinnville UFO conference say that the UFO "just disappeared". He didn't say it flew off that time, so did he change his story to be more consistent with the radar not showing the object flying off?

So I think more mainstream scientists would tend to not rely too heavily on eyewitness accounts except as a starting point, to go looking for some actual data which is not as unreliable as human perception. I have no doubt Fravor and the other pilots saw something interesting, but I think nobody's eyewitness account should be assumed to be 100% accurate, especially when eyewitnesses to the same event commonly disagree about exactly what they saw, and if you have been paying any attention at all, you know there are discrepancies in eyewitness accounts of the Nimitz incident and other UFO cases, sometimes large discrepancies, despite lies being told that everybody is telling exactly the same story.

originally posted by: KiwiNite
If people like you were in charge humans would never fly or go to space because it's impossible

It's entirely possible to travel between stars without exceeding the speed of light, it's just very difficult but if we don't destroy ourselves or have civilization destroyed by the next ice age, we'll probably get there. If you want some interesting ideas from engineers on how we might accomplish that, here's an article from a site called interesting engineering, which shows some real and theoretical possibilities (including warp drive) but wormholes are not listed, since even theoretically they don't seem to be feasible for practical use. NASA is already researching warp drive, or baby steps in that direction.

How Do We Achieve Interstellar Flight?

Here's NASA researcher "Sonny" White discussing warp drive research:

The Mick West and Arbit's of the past:

Even Thomas Edison weighed in by saying “you can take it from me that it is a pure fake...I have no doubt that airships will be successfully constructed in the near future but...it is absolutely impossible to imagine that a man could construct a successful airship and keep the matter a secret.”

www.popularmechanics.com...

originally posted by: celltypespecific

The Mick West and Arbit's of the past:

Even Thomas Edison weighed in by saying “you can take it from me that it is a pure fake...I have no doubt that airships will be successfully constructed in the near future but...it is absolutely impossible to imagine that a man could construct a successful airship and keep the matter a secret.”

www.popularmechanics.com...

That was actually a useful article.

Not sure that Edison's scepticism about undisclosed airship building is a viable parallel to interstellar craft, but what caught my attention was the Iate-19th century sighting of...

... phenomena in Dubuque, Iowa, in 1879. It’s a “large, unexplained airship” that was visible for an hour across the city before it “disappeared on the horizon.”

Mainly because it reminded me of UFO 'DJ' Jimmy Church's account of seeing an airship 'out of time'. Not sure why this was described as a Mandela Effect, as it's more a case of the past interweaving with the present rather than alternate realities, but he seemed certain of what he'd seen.

Alternatively... a ghost...? Start at 1:11... until 5:26:



Reminds me of the grand old tales of haunted airfields - a fascinating topic in itself, albeit not UFO-related.

Sorry, back on topic...

a reply to: ConfusedBrit

Mainly because it reminded me of UFO 'DJ' Jimmy Church's account of seeing an airship 'out of time'.

Fritz Leiber.
en.wikipedia.org...!



Re: the 19th century "sightings":

Jacobs believes that many airship tales originated with "enterprising reporters perpetrating journalistic hoaxes."[8] He notes that many of these accounts "are easy to identify because of their tongue-in-cheek tone, and accent on the sensational."[8] Furthermore, in many such newspaper hoaxes, the author makes his intent obvious "by saying – in the last line – that he was writing from an insane asylum (or something to that effect)."[30]

en.wikipedia.org...

Lets get back...again...to the reality of the situation again...as the wombles have called for backup clearly..
Some interesting posts on Twitter from Patrick Hughes who was on board one of the Hawkeyes during the Nimitz Incident.

What a Hawkeye looks like;


Patrick Hughes

So I have just realized a pretty decent connection between Nimitz in 04 and Roosevelt in 2015. In 04, the Nimitz Strike Group was the top of the line in the fleet. All the best toys so to say. Latest and greatest of what the Navy has. In 2015, Roosevelt was the first NIFC-CA battlegroup. Also had the E-2D. It was the top of the line Strike Group in 2015.

To my knowledge, there wasn’t a major change to the Strike Group capability’s until 2014 when they fully equipped the Roosevelt and company for NIFC-CA. I am guessing that whoever is behind the Tic Tac Tech, be it aliens or someone on earth... they keep testing it against the best the Navy had to offer.

Which is very interesting but what is NIFC-CA;
This is the "Naval Integrated Fire Control-Counter Air" capability; essentially and without killing you with the technical aspects of what this means, its essentially;

NIFC-CA relies on the use of data-links to provide every aircraft and ship with a picture of the entire battle space, including the deployment of weapons and essentially. The central tenets behind NIFC-CA are situational awareness and extended-range cooperative targeting. Every unit within the carrier strike group—in the air, on the surface, or under water—would be networked through a series of existing and planned data links so the carrier strike group commander has as clear a picture as possible of the battle-space.



More Info

Other interesting comments by Patrick Hughes;

Knowing what the E-2D Advanced Hawkeye, the f-35 and some of the other tech in play today versus 2004, I would loved to see tic-tacs appear near a modern day battle group. I’m positive it would be an entirely different outcome. In the radar alone, there is a multi generation leap in capability. The way the assets are designed to work together. I can’t really say specifics.

In regards to the data from the Hawkeye he was on station on and where it went after the incident;

Once handed to my CO, I have no idea where it went. But someone has it. Somewhere. At a minimum, it’s still classified “secret.”

Link:
Patrick Hughes Twitter

So in both instances in 2004 and 2015 - we have a battle group that has only just been kitted out with the cutting edge technology in terms of radar and other integrated systems across the whole battle group, that encountered "UAPs". I will add, that on this thread and others we have discussed reoccurring patterns in relation to sightings of UAP/UFOs and New/Experimental radar arrays and equipment, this is something that appears over and over again in multiple cases and should not be ignored.

a reply to: pigsy2400

Very interesting. Similar events occurred way back. From the hundreds of radar blips picked up by the allies before the Pacific assault in spring of 1945, possibly the 1952 UFO flap over Washington and the advent of Project Palladium. An early version of electronic counter measures.

That was all long, long ago. So imagine what they can do now? Any sufficient advanced technology would be indistinguishable from UAPs!!

Which is exactly what the Navy is saying isn't it?

Greetings Everybody!

Long time lurker, first time posting.

First off congratulations, you guys seem to have cultivated the most credible place on the internet to talk about these topics. You’ve been around for decades and even attracted celebrities such as Robbie Williams and Mr Thomas DeLonge himself.
This place even seems privy to get a tease of things happening in UFOlogy before they’ve broken into the mainstream. I’m talking of course about “Thefinaltheory” and his post years ago regarding the Nimitz encounter.
Hell one of the founders of this website even got to be part of one of Mr Corbell’s “Documentaries”.
Impressive credentials indeed.

There’s something that gets to me about this place though. For all the incredibly well researched threads such as the Jacques Valle Rosicrucian Theard or the infamous Stargates are Real thread there is such skepticism regarding recent events in ufology.
Now I understand the need to be sceptical, it’s scepticism that keeps this place from being a haven for '___' trippers that claim to have watched the pyramids being built although I have seen a little bit of that stuff round here but generally the main characters on this board keep a level head.
Kelly, Miragemen, Celtic, Willtell, Pigsy and many others on here have gained my respect purely due to their fair consideration of the evidence present and their obvious years studying this topic.
I get the feeling you guys are a little older than me and have been burnt a few more times by this topic by myself.
Maybe that’s why this reluctance to support To The Stars Academy comes from?


Look I understand some of your criticisms:

“They said they were going to build a Spaceship”

This is their most outlandish claim IMO maybe it’s just like a long term goal, based on the way the books are rolling out the time scale on this project seems to be grander than we can comprehend right now maybe 50 Years pass and we’ll see the ship as DeLonge is on his deathbed.


“Steve Justin showed a Mylar balloon at their presentation and claimed it was a UFO”

Look I know this a funny cock up on TTSA’s part but is it really anymore than that? It makes them look very silly but it doesn’t affect my opinion of their credibility.


“They have wackjobs like Hal Puthoff on their team, he was a Scientologist”

Yes. Puthoff was a Scientologist. But it seems you guys haven’t been doing your history work.

What is Scientology?
It’s a movement based on a book called Dianetics written by a ex navy office called L R Hubbard.

What was happening in Hubbard’s life when he wrote Dianetics?
Oh yeah. He’d just stolen thousands of pounds from famed occultist Jack Parsons after spending months practising Thelemic magic with him I the Pasadena desert apparently ushering in a new age for humanity. A quest Aleister Crowley had attempting decades before with no luck. Hubbard took Thelema stripped it of its religious over tones and medieval language and but it into a consumable book for the general public.

Why is this important?
Scientology is based on Thelma, Thelema is based on The Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn,
The Golden Dawn is based on the work of John Dee and Edward Kelly and their work comes directly from “angels” and the prophet Enoch.
Parsons work goes on to inspire the Bohemia of the 1960’s and NASA along with Scientology becoming the “religion” of the entertainment industry.
In this tale you also have Werner Von Braun being in contact with Parsons at some point which just blows my head off that so many suspect individuals can be tied together using this phenomenon.

At any rate Scientology, is 100% a seedy corrupt company that prays on weak people but imagine the content you pay all that money for is just watered down Golden Dawn material. Look at the amount of people that # with the Thelema/Golden Dawn Stuff:

Jay Z
Genesis P Orridge
Tyler the Creator
Tom Cruise
Ab-Soul
Elvis Presley
The Beatles
Madonna
Morgan Freeman
Tool
Kanye West
Peaches Geldof
David Bowie
Bob Dylan
Jason Lee
Bob Ross
David Lynch

Anyone who’s anyone really has a connection with this stuff. Take it back to what John Dee was studying and you hit the wall of ancient mysticism.

Hermeticism
Kabbalah
Merkabbah
Gematria
Meditation
Trance States

Basically ancient techniques of talking to god. Dash in a pinch of Gnosticism (Archons) and change God into a pantheon or group of gods and were over with Zach Stichin and the ancient aliens. If you actually read TTSA’s books (especially the ones with Peter Levenda GODS) you will see that all TTSA are saying is that over the years there has been a overload of information regarding this topic. Some of it true, some of it false. They are here to tell you which is which based upon the government connections DeLonge has made.
This is where I think you guys are getting angry. They are taking control of the narrative and you guys are understandably worried about this.
When I first started looking into “woo” topics it was a minefield of horse# and gold.

Majestic 12
SERPO
Bigfoot
Loch Ness Monster
Moth man
Roswell
And
Human Hybrids

Didn’t the whole thing need some structuring of the general public were ever going to swallow this pill?
Which leads me to my point finally... what’s happening in ufology right now is not for us?

We read ourselves into this topic whilst everyone else carried on being “normal” if we are ever going to get this topic into the zeitgeist there needs to be a coherent narrative. One that could be told in a book... or a film.

I get your frustrations and sometimes I look at what is going on with the Navy and the Government and the Nimitz videos etc and think what the # is happening here but who am I to understand the inner workings of the government?
I’m just a barista haha I just figure sometimes it’s going to look odd from the outside. I get the impression there’s factions within the government also that are probably making TTSA’s life difficult right now. This would explain why DeLonge always sounds like he’s just won a massive battle anytime he posts to social media and we are just stood here like”what is this guy so proud of”

Anyway I’ll wrap it up by saying I’ve been a watcher of Mr DeLonge for over 15 years now and I’ll say one thing, he generally gets done what he says he will get done his timing is just always incredibly optimistic. He said he’d release a film in 2007 which sounded like crazy talk to the music business back then but nevertheless skip forward to 2010 and there it is “LOVE” an angels and airwaves film. So just keep an open mind guys as far as I can see Tom has done everything he said he was going to and for god sakes please read the books before slaying the company.
They are the best thing (including the videos) to come out of To The Stars Academy. I’ll say it one more time READ THE BOOKS.

peace 💫

a reply to: deanbaker

You’ve been around for decades and even attracted celebrities such as Robbie Williams and Me Thomas DeLonge himself.

Welcome Thomas DeLonge....

So just keep an open mind guys as far as I can see Tom has done everything he said he was going to

What exactly has he said he was going to do?

I’ll say it one more time READ THE BOOKS....

Norfolk Enchants my friend....

a reply to: mirageman
For god sakes when I saw I’d put me Thomas DeLonge I realised that’s going to zap my credibility down to zilch haha

It’s my understanding he said he was going to to separate the wheat from the chaff regarding Ufology, set up a platform for people to talk about it and set up a relationship between the defence community and the general public allowing the free flow of information as it becomes declassified?

And You must be British telling that joke haha I mean the books are decent amalgamations of the lore of ufology but can I ask why you won’t read them?
Isn’t that like slandering a drink you’ve never drank?
I’m genuinely curious or angry or trying to be negative by the way I respect you guys over here

ølund

a reply to: deanbaker

I've read every word of those #ing books.

Except the new one because i refuse to pay a silly amount of money for a special edition. I will read that when it comes out next month.

I have even posted summaries of the books in this thread and its predecessor.

If you can discern a cohesive narrative from the two fiction books and the non-fiction Gods then please lay it out for us. For myself, those books are just a giant garbage bag in which someone has tossed an unsavory mix of occult lore, religion, UFO mythology and paranoia.

a reply to: coursecatalog

I think I can outline the narrative, I was frustrated after reading the first non fiction book but it turned out I just wasn’t versed well in ancient religious practices I went and did independent research for a few months came back and gave it a second read through and I now think it’s one of the best resources ufology has. I’m midway through the special edition of the new one also.

I’m at work at the moment but when I get home I’ll post a run through of what these books are getting at.

a reply to: deanbaker

That would be great.

By the way, everything you mentioned in your post above - from Scientology to John Dee - has been covered at one time or another in this very thread or threads linked to along the way.

a reply to: deanbaker

WELCOME DEANBAKER!!!!

Good morning everyone!

You are a refreshing voice.

And please don't be intimidated by the folks on this thread. It took me awhile but I have finally being admitted to their very exclusive inner circle