Have you visited chapel perilous?

Chapel perilous is a term i first came across when reading Robert Anton Wilsons book Cosmic Trigger, in this book RAW explores consciousness with scientific proficiency, if a tad unethical! one of his "experiments" involves him getting into a trance state (or what Jung would call active imagination)
and he would be able to converse with Jesus Christ... so of course then being a true scientist he would then try and use similar methods to contact spiderman and whoa betide same effect a commune with the holy spiderman, when reading this i wondered how a shock to the system could give people a flash of that they believe in most, those that have had enlightening experiences do tend to have them at times of great stress, makes you think though..... exactly how powerful is this thing thats behind my eyes?

So what is chapel perilous.
wikipedia

"Chapel perilous" is also a term referring to a psychological state in which an individual cannot be certain whether they have been aided or hindered by some force outside the realm of the natural world, or whether what appeared to be supernatural interference was a product of their own imagination.

Jung would perhaps attribute these experiences with certain archetypes, for example in times of great need the teacher archetype may appear to guide you, perhaps when our unconscious gives us a glimpse of its contents we may have a supernatural experience.


however Jungs work was deplored by some that gleaned a deeper understanding of the faculties of the unconscious, and weren't afraid to share that understanding no matter how occult and taboo it may have been. and to the detriment of their "careers"
Austin Osman Spare not only dived into the depths of his unconscious but he looked to use its forces and gain tangible results from his studies, its likely that Spare didnt like Freud and Jung because they were afraid to reveal the truths of their dabbling, as their careers would have been non existent due to fall out from such truths... thats just my opinion.
AOS

It was a logical conclusion to view the subconscious mind as the source of all magical power, which Spare soon did. In his opinion, a magical desire cannot become truly effective until it has become an organic part of the subconscious mind. Despite his interest in the unconscious, Spare was deeply critical of the ideas put forward by the psychoanalysts Sigmund Freud and Carl Jung, referring to them as "Fraud and Junk.

so back to the matter at hand... Have you visited chapel perilous, have you had a mystical or paranormal experience that you cannot explain?
i have always felt the world is magical, mystical and mysterious, i have always felt like there has been an outside force watching, not God per say but maybe family of the soul or something, i have had no paranormal experiences myself but i have faith in there being more to this world than the grind of everyday life, belief and faith with a good imagination could be the key to us understanding our reason for being.
heres what Robert Anton Wilson has to say about Chapel Perilous

"Chapel Perilous is a stage in the magickal quest in which your maps turn out to be totally inadequate for the territory and you're completely lost. And at that point you get an ally who helps you find your way back to something you can understand. And then after that for the rest of your life you've got this question: Was that ally a supernatural helper, or was it just part of my own mind trying to save me from going totally bonkers with this stuff? And the people I know who've had that kind of experience, very few of them have come to an absolutely certain conclusion about this." Robert Anton Wilson

ive glimpsed it and it is terrifying, but apparently the other side of it is an "ego-less awakening"

Chapel Perilous can be also used as a metaphor for a psychological state where a person maybe exposed to information that does not fit into their own reality tunnel
and they therefore have to question everything or ignore it because it doesn't fit.

so have you been?, or do you even dare enter?

a reply to: ManyMasks

I'm not sure, I have only grazed the surface when it comes to magic.
But I believe in the model of consciousness with the aware state, subconsciousness and über, or superconsciousness.
The mind can make you see things in your aware state so surely the subconsciosness can so too.
But that would still be only level 2 of 3.

a reply to: Peeple

yes i read in one mystical philosophy there were 10 levels of consciousness.

thanks for entering the thread, it shows you are not afraid to contemplate such things
i wondered if anyone would enter this discussion, then i seen your name and thought
ha Peeple she has balls (you know what i mean) your confrontational and you speak your mind
great qualities in questioning reality, for me im at the point where i know the world and what we
know of it is built on lies, and misdirection.. there a psychological traps everywhere.

i would say all religions are man made to direct flocks and the monetary system is used
to chain people down. im certainly at the door of chapel perilous, i say i have glimpsed as i have
been in a "space Cake" state and been barraged with hurtful truths that started to really freak
me out and i had to quash them and bring me back into my reality tunnel.
hurtful truths like my worst fear that life has no meaning and it is all a reflection of something
far greater, life is the drudge of total existence.... thoughts a feeling like that.
but those words dont do the feelings and thoughts no justice as the experience is unexplainable
i have had a few of these experiences through my life, but always on the edge and not into the
depths, im always of controlling my intake of anything mind altering but a friend of mine,
freaked out big time because he thought he wouldn't be "derek" anymore, now that sounds
like a dissolution of the ego, and that is the first step on the road
to being adept... according to many esoteric teachings.

a reply to: ManyMasks

Truth always hurts because it's the death of our dear phantasies.

On topic I'd say even if it can take many visual appearances the important part is it's there to guide. I just recently tried to get into Michael Newton "The Journey of the Soul", he too thinks the realm of the superconscioussnes is populated by many entities.
It might be a city plus zoo.

a reply to: Peeple

i read some of that and it explained how he hypnotised 29 people into trance states where they can remember their previous carnations and it reminded me of the "space cake" experience and one of the thoughts of my life being just like a drop in the ocean of my true existence.
i have long had the feeling that our spirits are here on this plain to evolve species and experience life and its intricacies, possibly in a cycle back to the creator god before going back to the farm.
chapel perilous maybe the realising of this and how our Egos have developed through the conditioning
of others who are adept, and have had secret knowledge passed through their bloodlines.

the other side of chapel perilous is for me knowing your own path and being able to take that path wherever you want.

possibly

a reply to: ManyMasks

There is the thing in our mind that hears, and the thing in our mind that spawns the thought. It's like a mirror or an echo chamber. I believe firmly they are one and the same: the place where thoughts come from and the thing that ascertains the thoughts. I imagine the thoughts spawn according to the programming of our subconscious, and it is our conscious mind that receives them. If our mind is cluttered with all sorts of erroneous desires and plans, there is bound to be an abundance of interference between this feedback loop which make it tough to comprehend entirely.

From my experience, the subconscious can be thoroughly re-programmed through fasting from the world and food, along with prayer/meditation. But every time I have returned to what is familiar and eventually synchronize back with my old programming. It's hard to make the leap permanently, even though I see the liberation that it implies.

The language of the subconscious is tough to decipher sometimes, but it often speaks in symbolism and metaphor, and has a direct effect on the outward things that are drawn into your life. For example, all potential romantic lovers that come into my life clearly show me (unconsciously) the subtle deviant behaviors I exhibit. If I bite (engage romantically) I quickly learn that the situation is a dead end, and was only showing me how horrendous it would be if I didnt change the behaviors I was now witnessing in my quantum-entangled partner. They are like a cross-section in time, and, if I married that woman I would also marry that particular insufficient state of consciousness. For this reason I press forward to my archetypal psychology, not being distracted by the sirens along the way.

a reply to: cooperton

interesting thoughts, when you say the the thing that spawns the thought i get you, and they may be one i dont know, but different thoughts are coming from different places or archetypes, different impulses feelings and emotions in every second of awareness... when i am still and letting thoughts roll you can tell the ones that pop in some times are from a higher source.
the phenomenon of people reading about 11:11 then seeing it all the time because their subconscious draws them to it at that time, i get that with different variations of the numbers 369, but i have noticed that happens when you unconsciously check the time as apposed to thinking what time it is then wondering if its that special set of numbers you keep seeing,

its like there is different sets of awareness trying to control an organism who is constantly subdued and disconnected from their true self.... or something

*Chapel perilous could be the void where all imagined consciousness resides, from heaven to hell and everything in between.

a reply to: ManyMasks

Both RAW and Timothy Leary really helped me make sense of the world. As to the OP question, Chapel Perilous is pretty frightening!

It is mostly because nothing in your frame of reference can get you ready for the shock of the truly other. You can sit here and talk about it as much as you want but it doesn’t prepare you for the “water temperature” you jumped into!

That is the thing about experience... it is way different than standing and kneeling when the guy in the funny hat repeats the magic spell!!

The experience is a “doorway” of sorts. Kind of like a near death experience makes you not scared of death. But CP shakes you to the core! And as RAW says, walk in naked, leave everything behind, and come out the other side a different person.

Then the “woo” that intrudes in your life is a mere curiosity that you may, or may not, notice.

Read that chapter (and Prometheus Rising), and that should help answer some questions!

a reply to: TEOTWAWKIAIFF

just what i was hoping for someone who has experienced.... i have Prometheus rising what chapter do you mean?

chapter 19??

its one of them books that expects you to do exercises each chapter that can take weeks to do.... so ive not finished it, lol

Sounds like my kind of place- I'd rather try and stay there, rather than be guided back- much more fruitful that way. Seems similar in concept to the fabled "twilight zone"

Thoughts at the moment is that this chapel perilous lies not at the fringes of reality but at it's heart; that sanity as we know it is to exclude the fantastical and ineffable

a reply to: LucidWarrior

thought provoking stuff, and your line at the bottom of your page, the woman you are talking about could it be the woman from my Dream

a reply to: Peeple

Does Magic not just really amount to an interpretation of the law of attraction?

a reply to: andy06shake

from what i know yes.... but there are other forces at play.

maybe our concentrated imagination is the key to the super conscious
and through access and manipulation to that we can create anything with
unadulterated focused will.

we are talking sh!t that takes years to even get to the cusp of.... and you need the right formula (chants and breathing), focused thought!

a reply to: ManyMasks

The whole book! Takes years to finish... and is a continuous experiment. So, I guess, it never ends!!

At least for me!

I always tell people to start with the quarters!

Get your laundry done!

a reply to: ManyMasks

Buddy, we need to work out what where and when consciousness actually is and arises from before we start chucking around such terminology as "superconscious".

Where do you stand on the conundrum of predestination versus free will?

a reply to: TEOTWAWKIAIFF

right i will be your apprentice

i already have the yoga mat (not kidding) and read all the literature

had some part experiences, and have that feeling of being on the cusp of something
both terrifying and spiritually emancipating

a reply to: andy06shake

aye superconscious was just a name of many, i prefer higher self.

right now, and i must say my belief system if i can call it that is always changing, which is probably why chaos magick hit a nerve with me, but any way right now i am in the way of thinking that thoughts, actions, emotions, words, vibrations all have power that we are mostly unaware of, i think these energies can attract other energies of whatever frequencies pos or neg, i think it is possible through rituals and concentrated will, that its possible to attract energies of willed frequency, for example when you see those nomadic tribe people doing their rituals they are causing some desired effect. whether its a communion with their deity or for help on the next hunt... bottom line the Law of attraction is at work at all times.

a reply to: ManyMasks

Well, its all just frequency and vibration.

After all, we exist within the ever-expanding explosion that is the singularity, that is the big bang, that spawned the current iteration of space-time.

What I'm asking you, hence the query regarding freewill v predestination, is there any rhyme or reason to the reality we assume we experience or are all our ducks predestined to quack in the same row?

Kudos to getting an interesting discussion going about the only topic that means anything in the meta sense... meaning itself and are we humans(?) prepared to grasp it? That's my take on the topic, anyway.

It must be a good topic if the people replying so far are any indication.

Chapel perilous is too aptly named and there are places where one can tip over the edge into very real chittering madness. Some possibility is deeply terrifying. Following some "thought trees" lead to strange, freaky fruit.

But bring up RAW AND AO Spare in the same thread? Heh, I'll be reading.

Incidentally, Spare's sigil magick got me my first convincing evidence that magic was real... in the sense that anything is real, anyway. I put out a call and got the reply within 40 minutes.

Back to reading.

a reply to: andy06shake

I'm still stuck between the two although im sure that everything happens for a reason and we are not headed to an unknown future.... I also believe we can pave our own path with our will just as long as we don't get in the way of the master plan.
But figuring out my reason for being is an ongoing process.