Venezuelas Maduro Given Ultimatum By European Leaders

a reply to: paraphi


If you knew anything true and accurate about Venezuela under Chavez, you would know that he did distribute some measure of wealth to the people of the country. He was, after all, a bloody socialist, right? That's what socialists do you know.

Your claim that the heating oil sent to the US being a publicity stunt is unconvincing to say the least. Indeed, it is much more US propaganda, something I just laugh at. Yours is a desperate specious claim.

a reply to: Salander

Unfortunately for Chavez and his policies set the blueprint for one of the world's most dramatic economic failures, which has resulted in so much poverty in Venezuela that a million people have fled the country. To his credit he did do some good at the time, but that was fleeting because the country is a basket case now.

But hey, that's OK because he once tried to give the US a whole range of things (heating oil included) after Katrina. Whether it was a publicity stunt or not, the offer was refused. It's not propaganda. It's fact. Or are you saying the offer was not made? I think that dictator from Cuba also offered aid after Katrina, which was also predictably refused. That too is a fact.

As I said. We accepted his offer for cheap oil in the northeast. Fact. And if you want to know where the blueprint for their failure came from, it was the cia, not Chavez. But whatever.

originally posted by: pexx421
And if you want to know where the blueprint for their failure came from, it was the cia, not Chavez. But whatever.

Oh the pesky CIA, eh? No mismanagement of the economy, lack of investment in industry and increasing in corruption. No nepotism and human rights failings. All that did not happen. Instead, somehow the CIA did it all. There is a real world out there.

originally posted by: paraphi

originally posted by: pexx421
And if you want to know where the blueprint for their failure came from, it was the cia, not Chavez. But whatever.

Oh the pesky CIA, eh? No mismanagement of the economy, lack of investment in industry and increasing in corruption. No nepotism and human rights failings. All that did not happen. Instead, somehow the CIA did it all. There is a real world out there.

Coming from a guy who's criticising a country he probably hasn't even visited and who talks like he sees the world through the lens of NBC/CNN and Fox News, I seriously doubt you've seen this "real world"

a reply to: Zcustosmorum

That's right. Never been to Venezuela, but am surprisingly well travelled. Why would I want to go to such a crap hole. I don't tend to visit countries with such poor human rights. But of course you've been there no doubt?

Amnesty
HRW and source of snip below

Under the leadership of President Hugo Chávez and President Nicolás Maduro, the accumulation of power in the executive branch and erosion of human rights guarantees have enabled the government to intimidate, censor, and punish its critics. Severe shortages of medicines, medical supplies, and food have intensified since 2014, and weak government responses have undermined Venezuelans’ rights to health and food. Security forces have arbitrarily detained and tortured protesters, and raids in low-income communities have led to widespread allegations of abuse. Other persistent concerns include poor prison conditions and impunity for human rights abuses.

a reply to: paraphi

Amnesty and HRW are funded by the West, and I know for a fact that Amnesty aren't an objective organisation, your sources mean nothing when they're all cogs in the same machine

Why would I want to go to such a crap hole.

That basically sums up your ignorance

a reply to: paraphi

No, none of those things. We have all those things here, and we’re still chugging along. So do plenty places. But look at every single place where the neoliberals, cia, NGOs and corporations have practiced US style regime change. Strangely they all look destroyed. Weird coincidence, that. Guess it’s fallujahs mismanagement that leveled it to the ground. Guess it was north Korea’s nepotism that caused every single building standing to be completely bombed to the ground. Ah, and those Vietnamese were SO bad at managing their nation circa the 1960’s.

originally posted by: Zcustosmorum
That basically sums up your ignorance

Try to keep it civil, chuck. Why not give some evidence that Venezuela is a nice place and that there is no abuse, corruption or suffering. Go on. If you won't accept that the country has collapsed, then persuade me.

originally posted by: paraphi

originally posted by: Zcustosmorum
That basically sums up your ignorance

Try to keep it civil, chuck. Why not give some evidence that Venezuela is a nice place and that there is no abuse, corruption or suffering. Go on. If you won't accept that the country has collapsed, then persuade me.

See my previous civil comment

originally posted by: Zcustosmorum
See my previous civil comment

Well done. Now have you got any source that shows Venezuela is a nice place to travel to, and where human rights organisations and other sources are mistaken, and there are no poor starving people being oppressed by an intolerant and corrupt regime. Fire away.

a reply to: paraphi can say the same about the US. 25% of the worlds prison population with 5% of the worlds people.

originally posted by: pexx421
can say the same about the US. 25% of the worlds prison population with 5% of the worlds people.

Could not care about the US, plus it's not on topic. If you cannot show evidence to contradict what I said that Venezuela has serious human rights problems and is corrupt (etc) then I think that my position is vindicated.

It looks like Turkey is helping Maduro to sell Venezuela's gold reserves.

originally posted by: paraphi

originally posted by: pexx421
And if you want to know where the blueprint for their failure came from, it was the cia, not Chavez. But whatever.

Oh the pesky CIA, eh? No mismanagement of the economy, lack of investment in industry and increasing in corruption. No nepotism and human rights failings. All that did not happen. Instead, somehow the CIA did it all. There is a real world out there.

What's going on today inside Venezuela, and along its borders, is very much the result of CIA manipulation. Spooks running around, doing what they do.