Brexit, Today is the Vote!

People do respond emotionally to the situation, but whatever happens, people, and a lot of them, will be having to cope and improvise and navigate a way through the problems that arise.

TUC (Trades Union Congress - a federation of trade unions representing the majority of unions in the UK) and CBI ( Confederation of British Industry is a UK business organisation, which in total speaks for 190,000 businesses, made up of around 1,500 direct and 188,500 indirect members.) issue joint statement saying UK 'facing national emergency' and that May must embrace plan B
Frances O’Grady, the general secretary of the TUC, and Carolyn Fairbairn, the director general of the CBI, have written a joint open letter to Theresa May saying that the country is facing a “national emergency” over Brexit and that she should adopt a “plan B”.

It is very unusual for the countries main employers’ organisation and the body representing trade unions to unite in this way with such a strongly-worded message to government.

Here it is in full.

Together we represent millions of workers and tens of thousands of businesses. It is on their behalf that we are writing to you to ask you to change your Brexit approach.

Our country is facing a national emergency. Decisions of recent days have caused the risk of no deal to soar. Firms and communities across the UK are not ready for this outcome. The shock to our economy would be felt by generations to come.

We ask you to take three steps to protect the jobs, rights and livelihoods of ordinary working people.

First, avoiding no deal is paramount. Businesses and employees alike need to see their government clearly acknowledge the reckless damage no deal would cause and recommit itself to avoiding this outcome.

Second, securing an extension has become essential. 88% of CBI members and a majority in parliament agree this is better than no deal. But at the same time an extension must genuinely allow a way forwards, and be long enough for a deal to be agreed.

Third, ‘the current deal or no deal’ must not be the only choice. A Plan B must be found - one that protects workers, the economy and an open Irish border, commands a parliamentary majority, and is negotiable with the EU. A new approach is needed to secure this – whether through indicative votes or another mechanism for compromise.

We cannot overstate the gravity of this crisis for firms and working people. We request an urgent meeting with you to discuss our concerns and hear your response.

a reply to: ipsedixit

TUC = unrepresentative of UK workers, the majority who are not in a trade unions, and the numbers are reducing year-on-year and at lowest level since late 1930s. If Brexit voting patterns are true, then the TUC is out of step with their membership.
CBI = unrepresentative body of large companies who want the status quo and who chase profits at any expense, including off-shoring business to "cheap" countries.

originally posted by: paraphi
a reply to: ipsedixit

TUC = unrepresentative of UK workers, the majority who are not in a trade unions, and the numbers are reducing year-on-year and at lowest level since late 1930s. If Brexit voting patterns are true, then the TUC is out of step with their membership.

But the point is whether they are right in their analysis of what will happen with a no deal Brexit.

CBI = unrepresentative body of large companies who want the status quo and who chase profits at any expense, including off-shoring business to "cheap" countries.

I wish the overwhelming number of companies who limit the degree to which they chase profit would make their views known.

originally posted by: ipsedixit
But the point is whether they are right in their analysis of what will happen with a no deal Brexit.

Everyone seems to have an opinion, and are lining up to get the worst possible negatives piled on top of each other. Truth is no-one knows. I am sure there will be bad, just as I am sure there will be good. Come back in two years and see and we can discuss it then, eh?

Anyway, often complex predictions amplify the belief of the predictor. You would not have (for example) a Remainer predicting Brexit will be good. The more you want to remain, the worse your prediction gets!

However, as the Eurozone is sitting on the side of a recession and stagnant growth, one wonders whether the EUs intransigence and obstinacy will cause them significant harm if the UK leave without a deal.

a reply to: paraphi

Well, what really happens will only be known after the fact of Brexit, if it happens. Personally, I have more confidence in remainers (with one exception, see below) than I have in Jacob Rees-Mogg, Nigel Farage and Boris Johnson, all of whom seem either irresponsible or mendacious, to me.

Satire:

If brexit failed then we will be officially under foreign occupation.

Resist the EU !

originally posted by: paraphi
a reply to: ipsedixit

TUC = unrepresentative of UK workers, the majority who are not in a trade unions, and the numbers are reducing year-on-year and at lowest level since late 1930s. If Brexit voting patterns are true, then the TUC is out of step with their membership
.

TUC is representative of union members.

Too many British employers do not recognise any union, meaning workers cannot officially join a union. Some do anyway and can still get legal advice and support, even if the union cannot represent in any dispute between employer and individual worker. No access to collective bargaining in those organisations where a union is not recognised. Thatcher made her own wet dream come true.

Some unions have seen unprecedented growth since Brexit (maybe due to worker concerns about diminished worker rights after Brexit is complete)

In addition, McDonalds staff in Britain have demanded better treatment, equal to that enjoyed by McD staff in America, so encouraging to see (mainly) young workers standing up for the rights and refusing to be treated as chattels and morons.

Game Theory - non union workers still benefit from union negotiations re pay and conditions. They think they are the most rational players in the game, all the benefits without any contribution. Fools.

originally posted by: teapot
Too many British employers do not recognise any union, meaning workers cannot officially join a union.

Anyone can join a union and it is illegal to discriminate against union members. Similarly, there is no obligation to join a union. With companies of less than 21 employees there is no obligation to recognise trade unions as bodies for employee representation. Trade unions can request voluntary recognition if the company of over 21 staff, and if unsuccessful can push the point by applying for statutory recognition etc...

Hope this clarifies.

Trade Union membership is dropping because there are good legal provisions to protect workers rights. Plus many trade unions are politically stupid and associated with Labour. Regardless, there's no evidence that a post-Brexit UK will reduce workers rights - indeed there are areas where they could improve without the one-size-fits-all EU regulations, where rights can be better tailored to the UK. Saying worker's rights will get worse after Brexit is just more negativity without substance.

originally posted by: osoespacialpoco
If brexit failed then we will be officially under foreign occupation.

Resist the EU !

I could disagree slightly and say perhaps by proxy via parliamentary manipulation/request/hammerdown. a tad extreme perhaps in the eyes of others. are we beginning to see end ending of many a ruse (on both sides of the channel) for the betterment of our grandchildren?

steady as she goes

f.

May has agreed to the EU response to her request for a delay.

www.theguardian.com... -mps-accuse-her-of-stoking-hate-politics-live

Donald Tusk confirms that Theresa May has agreed to the plan to delay Brexit until 22 May if she can get her deal through the Commons, or 12 April if she cannot.