Republic of Korea's KF-X Fighter META Thread

Continuing with our success with the Su-57 and 6th Generation fighter threads, I'm introducing a KF-X fighter meta thread. We're creating these threads to make it easier to hunt down the information on a particular program. Previously, we had threads all over the place and, unfortunately, they were not always easy to hunt down again later.

For those who are not aware, South Korea is developing a next generation fighter. It is unclear whether the fighter will be a true 5th gen or a 4.5 gen fighter, but the RoKAF has been collaborating with Lockheed for its development. Some of the technologies South Korea wanted were not given export licenses by US State Department so the RoK has sought them from Europe instead.

Part of the issue is Indonesia is collaborating on the KF-X as well and will pay for 20% of the costs. Indonesia has been too broke to pay, but just recently restarted its payments. This has, naturally, made South Korea happy.

www.flightglobal.com...

originally posted by: anzha

Continuing with our success with the Su-57 and 6th Generation fighter threads, I'm introducing a KF-X fighter meta thread. We're creating these threads to make it easier to hunt down the information on a particular program. Previously, we had threads all over the place and, unfortunately, they were not always easy to hunt down again later.

For those who are not aware, South Korea is developing a next generation fighter. It is unclear whether the fighter will be a true 5th gen or a 4.5 gen fighter, but the RoKAF has been collaborating with Lockheed for its development. Some of the technologies South Korea wanted were not given export licenses by US State Department so the RoK has sought them from Europe instead.

Part of the issue is Indonesia is collaborating on the KF-X as well and will pay for 20% of the costs. Indonesia has been too broke to pay, but just recently restarted its payments. This has, naturally, made South Korea happy.

www.flightglobal.com...

I have to say, this subforum is really enjoyable for laymen like me.

a reply to: anzha

Lol isn’t that the F-22A with SU-27 engines

a reply to: TritonTaranis

No.

a reply to: Zaphod58
It actually does look like an F-22 with F100s but should be GE F414 based on the name on the pic

Edit
apparently they decided to go with the F414 some time ago
www.geaviation.com...

a reply to: mightmight

It's a stealth fighter, of course it's going to have some remarkable similarities.

It was one of the designs drawn up as a baseline for the potential aircraft, but the final version of the design hasn't been, afaik, has not been released.

Many details have, but not the complete, final version of the design. That's not surprising though.

en.wikipedia.org...

This is the model from the 2018 Singapore airshow.

It has elements that look more like the F-35 and others that loom more F-22.

a reply to: anzha

See, to me, this thing screams Boeing inspired to me. I see a cross of an x-32 and an f-15k. Are there evolution plans for the f414? More power to be going in the pipeline or no?

a reply to: Caughtlurking

GE has tested the EDE engine, which has an improved HPT and HPC. It reduces the HPC to six stages, SFC is reduced by 2%, and individual parts life extended 3x.

They also tested the EPE, which has a new core and compressor, and increases thrust from 22,000 pounds to 26,400 pounds, and an almost 11:1 thrust to weight.

They cut metal recently... We might actually see one fly.

a reply to: RadioRobert

Have a link, RR?

m.aviationweek.com...

Might be some political maneuvering as well.
KAI

a reply to: Zaphod58
And to think the F414-EPE produces almost exactly the same thrust as a P&W F-100-200 did in the 80's. Imagine what an F-16A or F-15A/C could do with that smaller, lighter less fuel thirsty engine?

www.defensenews.com...

originally posted by: thebozeian
a reply to: Zaphod58
And to think the F414-EPE produces almost exactly the same thrust as a P&W F-100-200 did in the 80's. Imagine what an F-16A or F-15A/C could do with that smaller, lighter less fuel thirsty engine?

Well, you'd probably need a clean sheet design to take advantage of "smaller and lighter". More to the point is you can now get a remarkably similar sized and weight engine in the form of the F110 that gives you 32,000lbs thrust! Which is good, because the Eagles (and especially the Vipers!) are gaining weight and drag.



Really wish the US would have stepped into a fast and dirty low-end 5 gen, or even 4.5, design like the KFX is shaping up to be. I understand they didn't want to undercut the JSF program, but it's a missed opportunity.

a reply to: RadioRobert
Oh agreed, you couldn't just drop an F414 class into a Viper or Eagle, but it does illustrate just how far we have come in the last 35-40 years with engines. And to think, that the early F-100 was a quantum leap over the TF-30. It might be an interesting exercise to see how much internal volume an F414-EPE could free up in an F-16 or F-15. You could probably increase your fuel fraction a decent amount before reaching max weight. Intake redesign would be interesting too. All hypothetical though.

A fast and dirty 5th Gen is what the F-35 SHOULD have been. Had they done that we would be seeing a successor or at least a very evolved F-22 by about now, or possibly something else like a long range fighter/bomber along the lines of the FB-22. Like you said, wasted opportunities.

a reply to: thebozeian

Not only intake geometry and airflow requirements (important!) or just the weight gain, but they'd have to (re-)gain the weight in the right places. It'd be very hard to take advantage of without a clean sheet. But like you said, it's impressive. Look back even further and look how many designs from the 50-60's that were/are viewed as failures or flops simply due to promised engine performance never materializing and not due to actual design.


Re:JSF, the goldplating it has really curtailed it's success as a program. Ultimately, the F-35 has turned into a fine combat aircraft at an unmatchable price point. But imagine if they had foregone the temptation for all the bells and whistles and had done a quick and dirty LO design which would have slashed costs further. We'd probably be replacing the entire legacy fleet 1:1 having started almost 20 years ago. And without the bleeding edge components (and lower price point), it probably opens up the export market even further. And the more you commit to production, the lower the costs fall...
All the bells and whistles that are essentially mature finally would be only a touch behind the current schedule and available for a new higher-end F-22 complement (or F-22 replacement since we've since killed the F-22 line), to supplement a healthy JSF program.

a reply to: thebozeian

A fast and dirty 5th Gen is what the F-35 SHOULD have been.

That was, iirc, what the MRF (multi role fighter) the USAF planned before it was killed for the JAST.