Did this girl cheat on her SAT's or are they picking on her because she is black?

originally posted by: Carcharadon

originally posted by: SlapMonkey
a reply to: JAGStorm

As quoted from the letter:

"We are writing to you because based on a preliminary review, there appears to be substantial evidence that your scores ... are invalid," it said. "Our preliminary concerns are based on substantial agreement between your answers on one or more scored sections of the test and those of other test takers. The anomalies noted above raise concerns about the validity of your scores."

So, the administrators who made this decision need to make all evidence available to back their claim and give her a chance to officially rebut/appeal the finding.

If the testing agency doesn't do that, then I call shenanigans. If they make it available and all that is done is the race card gets played, then I'm suspect of the girl.

I will say this: It's a bad thing to choose to get a "prominent civil rights attorney" to speak on your behalf and support you in this matter--the optics are terrible. But, if it's necessary, so be it. I do find it fishy that the attorney is demanding a response in two weeks when it usually takes 4-6 weeks to review score concerns...it's almost as if the attorney is asking for something relatively impossible on purpose.

Look, if the student worked hard and improved that much, then good on her and I applaud her efforts, but it this comes back as her having been involved in a cheating scandal during testing, then she will be doing much more damage to her reputation with colleges and dance schools than a lower test score could ever do.

Might be an interesting outcome either way, but now that the racial component is in the mix, the testing company will never win in the end, even if they turn out to be correct.

Ah and the plot thickens. So she want the only one caught apparantly.

That's not going to help her case much is it lol.

You obviously dont understand the English language much... that's not what that means... mentalist....

a reply to: dug88

After reading through this thread the thing that confuses me the most is....why do they have a box for your race on American standardized tests for high school children?

It is a weird American thing. We want to be able to track how races fare against each other.
It all comes down from the Department of Education and not necessarily the testing places.

originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: Edumakated

The problem is that school admissions has never been just "merit based"

Totally agree with that, and I think that needs to change too!

As far as defining merit, for the majority it would be all about grades.
If you are going to school for art or sports or such, of course it would be based on your score, or portfolio.
Many art schools are moving to a system where ACT and SAT scores are not used, just your portfolio.

Admission at the most prestigious schools has never been solely about grades and test scores. Yes, they are a big part of it, but the reality is that every student is a "portfolio". They look at anticipated major, where you are from geographically, sports, leadership, extracurricular, grades, test scores, courses taken, essays, etc. Yes, race matters too.

What people don't get is that the schools are trying to build a CLASS of people from different backgrounds and experiences in which they feel will benefit the ENTIRE CLASS. Admission is a very nuanced and holistic process at top schools.

For example, Havard University received 42,000 applications last year for undergrad admissions. The acceptance rate was 5.6%. So out of 42,000 people, they only accepted about 6% (really 5.5%). So call it 2500.

Harvard could accept only 4.0 GPAs and perfect SAT scores and they still would have to turn away a large number of people. About 1.7 million students took the SAT last year. Only 5% score above 1400. That is 85,000. In other words, simply scoring high on the SAT is not enough to gain admission because you aren't special....

Let me give you an example. Even though I am no fan of Obama, who benefitted Harvard more. Obama or just some random law student who scored high on their LSAT and goes to work for a "biglaw" firm doing corporate work?

Even if Obama was an affirmative action admit, he conveys more benefits to the school than just yet another upper middle class kid with a high LSAT who wants to be a corporate lawyer drone. Harvard can say Obama became President.

They look for these types of qualities on applications. Is this person likely to be successful? To be in a leadership position?

Another example, that little twerp David Hogg from the Parkland shooting. He didn't get into many colleges initially, but after a year and being so involved in politics he gained admission to Harvard.

a reply to: Edumakated

Oh I know exactly how it works, I just don't agree with it.
Maybe if Obama wasn't affirmative actioned into Harvard someone with more potential could have had a chance?
Have you ever thought of it that way?

I'm completely against racism. Anyone that is would be against affirmative action.
When I read the two sentences below, one sounds racist and another one doesn't.


"The Trump administration is moving against any use of race as a measurement of diversity in education"

"Obama administration policy that called on universities to consider race as a factor in diversifying their campuses"

www.ajc.com...

originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: Edumakated

Oh I know exactly how it works, I just don't agree with it.
Maybe if Obama wasn't affirmative actioned into Harvard someone with more potential could have had a chance?
Have you ever thought of it that way?

I'm completely against racism. Anyone that is would be against affirmative action.
When I read the two sentences below, one sounds racist and another one doesn't.


"The Trump administration is moving against any use of race as a measurement of diversity in education"

"Obama administration policy that called on universities to consider race as a factor in diversifying their campuses"

www.ajc.com...

Obama became the most powerful man in the world... Harvard Law obviously saw some potential or they would not have admitted him.

Race is a factor whether we like it or not. Society is not colorblind.

My issue is that people love to throw around "merit" but then make exceptions for athletes, legacy admits, donors, celebrities, and all the other categories.

It is perfectly ok for a school like Duke to admit borderline retards who are functionally illiterate who are black just because they are 7 footers and can play basketball, but if they admit a stellar black student who actually wants an education everyone wants to complain the test scores aren't high enough? Be consistent is all I am saying...

a reply to: Edumakated

Be consistent is all I am saying...

Yes, I totally agree. I think some colleges are way too sports focused and treat their athletes on a different level and everyone else has to pay the price for that (literally). That isn't right either.

This topic is much more than college, we could go on all day about how the American school system isn't fair. The fact that our public grade schools get funding from property taxes is jacked. That is really where we should start and maybe we wouldn't even need to talk about college merit!

a reply to: odzeandennz

SAT tests are administered a various locations throughout each city. A student has the option to chose the test site. Over the years my kids tested at 4 different sites.

a reply to: JAGStorm

No. We don't want to track how races are faring against one another. That would be racist because it would imply that races might have advantages.

No, what they really want is to try enforce that every place has a perfect percentage representation of the outside world?

You say blacks are 11% of the population? Then they ought to be 11% of every population. You say Hispanics are X% of the outside population? Then they ought to be X% of every population ... and so on and so forth. So many of the people in this group should be gay, so many should be women, so many should be men and some ought to be trans ... This percentage here is Christian, this group is Wiccan and this one over here is atheist. And all those numbers have to align perfectly with the overall population or else it's evidence of some kind of evil discrimination and not simple differences in culture and preference amongst peoples and groups.

a reply to: odzeandennz

I took the SAT twice, at a difficult school each time, and it was also not with ANY classmates.... so.... what’s your point?

originally posted by: odzeandennz

originally posted by: Carcharadon

originally posted by: SlapMonkey
a reply to: JAGStorm

As quoted from the letter:

"We are writing to you because based on a preliminary review, there appears to be substantial evidence that your scores ... are invalid," it said. "Our preliminary concerns are based on substantial agreement between your answers on one or more scored sections of the test and those of other test takers. The anomalies noted above raise concerns about the validity of your scores."

So, the administrators who made this decision need to make all evidence available to back their claim and give her a chance to officially rebut/appeal the finding.

If the testing agency doesn't do that, then I call shenanigans. If they make it available and all that is done is the race card gets played, then I'm suspect of the girl.

I will say this: It's a bad thing to choose to get a "prominent civil rights attorney" to speak on your behalf and support you in this matter--the optics are terrible. But, if it's necessary, so be it. I do find it fishy that the attorney is demanding a response in two weeks when it usually takes 4-6 weeks to review score concerns...it's almost as if the attorney is asking for something relatively impossible on purpose.

Look, if the student worked hard and improved that much, then good on her and I applaud her efforts, but it this comes back as her having been involved in a cheating scandal during testing, then she will be doing much more damage to her reputation with colleges and dance schools than a lower test score could ever do.

Might be an interesting outcome either way, but now that the racial component is in the mix, the testing company will never win in the end, even if they turn out to be correct.

Ah and the plot thickens. So she want the only one caught apparantly.

That's not going to help her case much is it lol.

You obviously dont understand the English language much... that's not what that means... mentalist....

In the Unis statement they said basically that her answers were the same as others in significant portions of the test.

They also stated that they don't do this unless there is proof.

My thoughts are that her and a couple of others got pinched, they admitted to it and she flew off the handle claiming racism.

It's a hoax. She done.

i know from personal experience, that if a teacher or someone from school doesnt like you they will do what they canto make you fail.
i kept failing on essays even though i did exactly hat they wanted so me and a friend did a test i wrote mine and her essays. i used the same techniques i always used,grammar, research, detailing, just not carbon copies so it was not obvious. guess what i failed again and my friend passed with A's.
I then questioned why i failed apparently i used words that dont exist, i had to get a dictionary to prove the words exist words like mythos, (which i used in the correct context), i was accused of using research that didnt exist from books that were made up i had t bring the books in, show them the books i used for research with the quotations in the books highlighted.
i had to fight for ages to get my scores sorted, as the teacher even said i was ''to dumb'' and eventually the teacher did get sacked but they refused to say why or if it was connected to score rigging.
messed me up for years i didnt believe i was good enough and didnt even bother going college until later when i realized i was good enough.
what im saying is everyones human and some people are just bad and discriminate those they dont like for what ever reason