Secret Door in Great Sphinx leading to the Hall of Records (Cover up!)

originally posted by: peacefulpete

originally posted by: Byrd

originally posted by: purplemer
a reply to: Harte
Boom! You are so so wrong. I thought you new your stuff. You are demonstrating you know next to nothing now.

Here is a List of Egyptian hieroglyphs on Wikipepida. Please note less than ten percent have been deciphered.

en.wikipedia.org...


You come onto my thread and make stuff up. I will call you out. thats all you have been doing for a while now.

Hop on over to the Yahoo Groups Glyph study - you have to join to see the lessons but you can eyeball it and see how active it is with translation.

Here's the link to a whole list of vocabulary videos

Somewhat outdated list of major translations (does not count coffins, offering stele, and minor papyri, ostrika, and so forth)

Translated papyri are here (papers are in German but German-to-English translation isn't impossible)

And then there's all the (not completely reliable) translations by Budge which seem to be everywhere (including his dictionaries.

...etcetera.

So, as you see, Harte is correct.

Your post does not validate that Harte is correct... lol.

Unless you're talking about the same 100% of 10% has been translated... which is basically putting a spin on the fact of 90% being untranslated...

Give it up. You're embarrassing yourself. ALL Egyptian glyphs ever found have been translated.

Harte

originally posted by: bluesfreak
Wondering if Harte’s going to respond to my last Lathe posts on the previous page regarding centring and tooling methods and forensics...

Maybe you missed my response. The AEs didn't have lathes.

Harte

originally posted by: purplemer
a reply to: bluesfreak

Here’s a little present for Harte, done by yours truly. I have given Harte 20 minutes of my time free, and made Harte a tiny, tiny Egyptian bowl, out of a piece of black stuff lying around. The 20 free minutes included grinding a small tool for turning , turning the piece, and chopping it off the lathe ( parting off in lathe terms)

Well done but that dont cut the mustard. Why do peeps keep trying to circumnavigate.

How about you try doing the same thing with a granite and cooper tools and how about you you replicate something like this that as the experts state above was done with pounding..

I'll do that if you'll replicate this mysterious and invisible previous culture that you think actually was responsible for everything the mainstream attributes to the Ancient Egyptians.

How about you do that? I'll wait.

Harte

originally posted by: Byrd

originally posted by: purplemer
a reply to: Byrd

If you know your stuff why dont you give me a suitable explanation as to how this was made. Your last link you sent you debunked yourself with.

I see a picture....but no indication of where the object lives or what the museum identifies it as. Can you provide a link to the museum (since I only know how to date coffins by era and not pottery/vessels/votives (which is a whole different branch than what I've studied and is fairly complex.

And I don' t think I "debunked myself." You didn't accept the material I provided (with sources) -- and you didn't counter with different material and good sources. You just said "ha! debunked!"

So if you have some sources that back up your previous claim (I didn't see any in this thread but I haven't given it minute attention) I would appreciate a link.

Cairo Museum, and it's not granite.

Early Dynastic period narrow-necked vase of anorthosite gneiss possibly from Saqqara in the Cairo museum. (height: 40 cm)

From Archae Solenhofen's old website (now archived) www.oocities.org...

Harte

originally posted by: bluesfreak
Do we think that the AE knew the hardness properties of precious stones such as diamond? Striations in granite (not just bowls) show that they were cut (literally sliced into) with something harder than granite- so what’s harder than granite?

Sand is harder than all the constituents of granite besides the quarts crystals.
Corundum is harder than the quartz crystals. Corundum is the main constituent of emery (also harder than the quartz in granite,) which the AEs were known to have mined.

Harte

a reply to: Harte

Haha Harte your funny.

You cannot show me or provide my any proof on how these vessel I showed was made. You are no longer correct with your statement that anything from the past can be made today.

I dont need to pursue you further but I will think of you again in morning because you remind my of my sunday coffee beans. I like them well roasted.

Take care for now my old bean.

:-)

originally posted by: purplemer
a reply to: Harte

Haha Harte your funny.

You cannot show me or provide my any proof on how these vessel I showed was made. You are no longer correct with your statement that anything from the past can be made today.

I dont need to pursue you further but I will think of you again in morning because you remind my of my sunday coffee beans. I like them well roasted.

Take care for now my old bean.

:-)

You're a fool if you think that vase cannot be made with CNC machinery.

Harte

a reply to: Harte

You're a fool if you think that vase cannot be made with CNC machinery

Now here is the finish him move..

A fool is one that believes there own imagination over objective fact. Something you have masterly demonstrated yourself in this thread.

You know maybe you are correct. Maybe a state of the art mechanical robot could pull this off. Would you be suggesting that the AE had access to such equipment since you are all out of others options you will have to admit that its ad least a possibility.

I love the smell of roasted coffee in the morning

originally posted by: Byrd
Actually, now that I do a little googling about the topic, it turns out that they did indeed have lathes. Flinders Petrie (famous Egyptologist, 1853-1942) was the first to show evidence that the ancient Egyptians used lathes. So no need to defend to the death; we've known this since 1900 or so.

IIRC, Petrie backed of that claim after consulting with some engineers.
The earliest Egyptian lathe we have any evidence for is the painting the sketch in this thread comes from, which dates to the 3rd century BC.
The "astonishing" ewers, vases and jugs start from pre Dynastic times.

Harte

a reply to: purplemer

Not sure if this has already been posted, but I just came across this video where Joe Rogan and Robert Schoch discuss Egyptian bowls and vases:

They of course also don't know how they were manufactured but strongly suggest that lathes were used and that the more ancient vessels are often less crude.

originally posted by: Harte

originally posted by: Byrd

originally posted by: purplemer
a reply to: Byrd

If you know your stuff why dont you give me a suitable explanation as to how this was made. Your last link you sent you debunked yourself with.

I see a picture....but no indication of where the object lives or what the museum identifies it as. Can you provide a link to the museum (since I only know how to date coffins by era and not pottery/vessels/votives (which is a whole different branch than what I've studied and is fairly complex.

And I don' t think I "debunked myself." You didn't accept the material I provided (with sources) -- and you didn't counter with different material and good sources. You just said "ha! debunked!"

So if you have some sources that back up your previous claim (I didn't see any in this thread but I haven't given it minute attention) I would appreciate a link.

Cairo Museum, and it's not granite.

Early Dynastic period narrow-necked vase of anorthosite gneiss possibly from Saqqara in the Cairo museum. (height: 40 cm)

From Archae Solenhofen's old website (now archived) www.oocities.org...

Harte

Aha! That's amusing. I probably walked right past it when we visited (I was on the hunt for magical knives and we didn't have much time there)

So the material is about a 5 on the MOHS scale and could easily be carved with glass ... so any flint tool will cut and shape it just fine (likewise obsidian, sand (quartz), granite, etc.

Thanks for looking that up.

originally posted by: jeep3r
Looks like the vase is showcased at the Cairo Museum, at the 03m38s mark in this video Anthony West explains that the vase is made of one piece and that the handles have not been added at a later stage.

Similar to this shouldered jar from the 18th dynasty, 1550–1295 B.C.:

Source

That's a beautiful piece. I believe it's made of alabaster or a similar material, which is fairly soft. I love the delicate decoration.

a reply to: Byrd

I can get you one.
Cheap.

originally posted by: Xabi87
a reply to: Harte

Apparently all those translations where done by a guy named Mark Vygus, who is he and what are his credentials? I can't find nothing about the man himself.

www.pyramidtextsonline.com/MarkVygusDictionary.pdf

No, they weren't translated by Vygus. As I recall, he was a student and as part of his coursework put the words from lessons he was translating into a brief dictionary for Middle Egyptian to make it quicker to hunt up the word and it grew from there. I was told that the definitions are actually from Worterbuch.

The words he presents are from a standard software that's used to write hieroglyphs (and is only known to Egyptologists... outside that small circle, NOBODY knows about the program.)

Vygus' word list was a useful method of looking things up quickly (rather than slogging through the standard reference -- Worterbuch ( which you can download here... but it's really difficult to search ) - not to mention the difficulty of slogging through cursive German text. I've tried. It'll give you eyestrain and requires a LOT of patience.

Popping the words into a computer generated dictionary made it quicker to do translations (and it's actually a "word list" and not a true dictionary). It's cheap (free) and updated but the word list is relatively small.
If you REALLY like (yike!) you can go to the Worterbuch and look up something there. I would say that you could also use Budge, but you need to be aware that some of his material is incorrect and some of it's outdated (the dictionary is over 100 years old.)

A criticism of Vygus' work (which I feel is a bit testy but good points are made) is at this web page, which also gives other dictionaries ... standard ones that are used in Egyptology courses. HOWEVER... none of them are available online for free (that I know of) and they tend to be expensive, so I don't see people here hopping off to buy one or two for the sake of a discussion on hieroglyphs. And IMHO, it's kind of tacky to say "I disagree. See Faulkner pp 48 for a discussion of..." -- that kind of dialogue is fine in Egyptology forums but is kind of tacky and useless in a regular discussion forum.

Giving folks something they can look up easily as a reference is a better strategy, IMHO. Casual readers will, however, look at Vygus and at Budge since they are free and quickly accessed via computer. They're also searchable, which is not true of the other true dictionaries that I've bought and encountered.

a reply to: Byrd

Fair enough, thanks for the detailed reply.

Maybe you missed my response. The AEs didn't have lathes

a reply to: Harte

a reply to: bluesfreak

A pottery wheel is a form of lathe!

Pottery wheels where everywhere!

We have lost much knowledge and gained much different knowledge.

Saying ancient people did not have this or that is just silly.

No one can prove they didn't.

Remember this people ... much of what has been found was found in the midden ... the toilet was where a lot of broken things were thrown away for us to find.

P

a reply to: pheonix358

Pottery wheel is a form of lathe! Pottery wheels where everywhere!

What on earth are you on about. How it a pottery wheel is a lathe?

a reply to: Byrd

Aha! That's amusing. I probably walked right past it when we visited (I was on the hunt for magical knives and we didn't have much time there) So the material is about a 5 on the MOHS scale and could easily be carved with glass ... so any flint tool will cut and shape it just fine (likewise obsidian, sand (quartz), granite, etc. Thanks for looking that up.

SO just to clarify. The vessel I mentioned was made in very early Egyptian times. Was made to an incredibly amazing specification and you have no idea how they did it.

So good infact that its only in the last couple of decades that we could reproduce such vessel. Funny how there cultures seemed to diminish from earlier times. Its as if they had some kind of fall from grace.

a reply to: bluesfreak

I missed that. I didnt realise that the AE didnt have lathes. Puts a whole different perceptive on this issue. How on earth did that make these vessels then. It seem nigh on impossible to me if this is the case!