What is Behind the Dramatic Rise in Violent Crime in the UK?

a reply to: CornishCeltGuy
It sounds like you guys need guns to learn how to be civil again. And you guys call America violent? Wow

a reply to: worldstarcountry
Britain is violent as #, guns would make it worse!

Not just boys and not only London.

Girl, 16 arrested for stabbing two men in Norwich.

www.bbc.co.uk...

Of course on a one to one basis guns are more lethal. But knives can and do kill a lot of people. And London mayor Sadiq Khan did call for tougher laws on the possession and carrying of knives because of it.

a reply to: FatherLukeDuke

What are you talking about? We heavily restricted firearms in 1689 and pretty much banned handguns in 1920. There have been numerous restrictions since. Which ban are you talking about? The UK murder rate is still a fraction of the USA's.

Heavily restricted in 1689 then banned in 1920. And "numerous" restrictions since. Guess they weren't banned after all, huh?

Where are you getting this rubbish from? For a start New York has one of the lowest homicide rates in the US, and London one of the highest in the UK. More importantly, New York had twice the number of murders in 2017, and will have more this year. The London murder rate was higher for one month.

USA Today

After murder rate passes NYC, London Mayor Sadiq Khan calls for sharper knife control

Rubbish? You leave me with a touch decision - who to believe. You or USA Today and London Mayor Sadiq Khan. I think you know where you fall on that list...



As of the writing of this article this information was absolute and correct. If you want to argue it please direct your comments to USA Today and Mayor Sadiq Khan.

originally posted by: ignorant_ape
a reply to: Vroomfondel

oh FFS - not this shiite again

which " gun ban " exactly are you talking about ???????????

one assumes either 1987 or 1998 - but hey - lets hear what you think

now - the killer question :

how did the ownership of any firearm [ held legally under the firearms act 1968 ] make the country safer - and or reduce crime

YES - certain crime stats did rise in 1988 and 1999 -

but the reduction in legally held firearms - had nothing top do with the rise

when will merkins get this into thier heads ???????????????

First, see above for part of your answer.

Second, please state your source for the statement

but the reduction in legally held firearms - had nothing top do with the rise

According to the article:

Guns are strictly regulated in the United Kingdom and the rising homicide rate in London is directly attributable to a rise in knife-related crimes, with stabbings claiming at least 31 lives to date in 2018.

It sure looks as if the difficulty getting guns has caused criminals to switch to more easily acquired knives. Which leads me back to my original point - banning the tool does not stop the crime from happening.

Lastly, thank you for resorting to name calling. It is a sure fire way to let me know I won and that you know it too.

Us stoopid merkins....we don't know anything...

But I can read, and I site my references. It would be nice if both sides did that.

I didn't resort to name calling. It would be nice if you civilized brits felt that way too.

I did one search and found a great article stating my point on USA Today. There are many more from a variety of sites and they all seem to largely disagree with the three of you rebuking me. Please don't be insulted if I stick to more reliable sources than you lot.

a reply to: Vroomfondel
I'm not calling people merkings , I think such a style of debate is childish as #..
Only one member has gone down that road.

originally posted by: Vroomfondel

originally posted by: ignorant_ape
a reply to: Vroomfondel

oh FFS - not this shiite again

which " gun ban " exactly are you talking about ???????????

one assumes either 1987 or 1998 - but hey - lets hear what you think

now - the killer question :

how did the ownership of any firearm [ held legally under the firearms act 1968 ] make the country safer - and or reduce crime

YES - certain crime stats did rise in 1988 and 1999 -

but the reduction in legally held firearms - had nothing top do with the rise

when will merkins get this into thier heads ???????????????

First, see above for part of your answer.

Second, please state your source for the statement

but the reduction in legally held firearms - had nothing top do with the rise

According to the article:

Guns are strictly regulated in the United Kingdom and the rising homicide rate in London is directly attributable to a rise in knife-related crimes, with stabbings claiming at least 31 lives to date in 2018.

It sure looks as if the difficulty getting guns has caused criminals to switch to more easily acquired knives. Which leads me back to my original point - banning the tool does not stop the crime from happening.

Lastly, thank you for resorting to name calling. It is a sure fire way to let me know I won and that you know it too.

The homicide rate in the US is about 4 times that of the UK. Reason so much was made of London having a comparable rate to New York ( for a 3 month period) is because it was so exceptional.

a reply to: Vroomfondel

I'm curious to know why you think the media articles are more accurate than anecdotal stories from people who actually live there and experience it first hand ?

a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

Because the people that live there experience only part of it. I live near Chicago. I have a very good idea what is going on in Chicago even though I don't see it, but I can't argue when someone says I saw on the news that this that or the other happened. All I can say is "I" didn't see it.

The flip side of that goes all the way back to my thread "Germany in a state of Siege". Even though I had family there telling me what they saw it was dismissed by other people there who didn't see it. I had government officials saying this is whats happening and here I had all kinds of people saying not to believe it. Well, look at Germany now. The same thing is happening on our southern border right now. Its not immigration. Its not asylum. Its an invasion.

a reply to: CornishCeltGuy

Credit where credit is due.

originally posted by: worldstarcountry
a reply to: CornishCeltGuy
It sounds like you guys need guns to learn how to be civil again.

Yeah, more guns... That always solves any given social issue.

Proven fact.

More Muslims

That always solves any given social issues.

Proven fact.

Easy access to knives should put a ban on those things. Maybe only plastic allowed do they have safety knives?

a reply to: Breakthestreak

OK cool thanks for the reply...

one of the problems are the police.
some examples

- earlier this year a burglar broke into an elderly couples house the elderly man defended himself and his wife suffering from dementia, the burglar died during the fight.
what happened after the elderly man was arrested and questioned ( later released), the family of the burglar then taunted and threatened the elderly man forcing them to be moved to a secret location, the same family put up a memorial on someone elses property, when people got angry and pulled it down, the police threatened people with arrest if they did it again.
No arrests or threats for the family of the burglar even though they were doing it in public including on social media.

- theres apparently no money for police on the streets but they have money for patrolling royal weddings, politicians and for new fancy cameras to catch drivers using mobile phones and speeding
new camera for making money

- expanding on the cameras, the police mainly focus on catching people driving 1 or 2 mph over the limit so they can send them on ''driving courses'' where you get to pay anywhere from £150 to £200 depending on where you live, you spend about 4 hours listening to some idiot telling you things you already know and showing videos of crashes.
yet if you are rich you dont pay fines for speeding way over the limit.
If you have a car accident, even if its proven to be not your fault the police will twist things to send you on another driving course, where you will get to have a driving lesson and again pay £100s for nothing.
fact is police only care about making money not saving lives.

- they are more interested in catching people being non pc, trawling social media for people saying bad things and arresting them, again easy work.

- they have told people not to contact them for what they call minor issues like burglary, assault ect, as they dont have time.

- the fact people who commit crimes like murder, assault and burglary are not doing time, are not going to prison, but people not paying the tv licence are getting months in jail, people who say bad things get time.

- they have been found lately covering up crimes and committing crimes themselves, they finally had to admit they lied about he people in the Hillsborough football club, lying about people being hooligans and drunks including children, covering up evidence the police themselves are the reason it went all wrong.
the police force in yorkshire, shropshire and other areas have at a minimum not believed and at the worst covered up sexual assault regarding white girls, because the rapists where of a certain ethnicity.
these are just a couple of the examples of police cover ups and crimes

- all of the above plus more cause people not to trust or respect the police even law abiding people have no respect for the police force.
if law abiding people dont trust the police do you think criminals will fear them. if the police are saying dont bother us with burglary or assault, do you think violent criminals will give a damn if they are filmed or caught

originally posted by: ufoorbhunter
a reply to: worldstarcountry

...
TV has loads of violent mixed martial arts on it and young kids must be being mind altered by this and such violence does need banning if it is held as a sport or glorfied.
...
Maybe Brits are predisposed to violence or something?

In view of the many forces that advocate or glorify violence, is it possible to become a truly peaceable person in today’s world? According to the Bible, yes we can. The Bible helps us to understand what is happening now and why people act in such extreme ways. It accurately describes attitudes we commonly see. For example, the list found at 2 Timothy 3:3, 4 states that people would have “no natural affection” and that they would be “without self-control, fierce, without love of goodness,” and “headstrong.” It also says: “In the last days critical times hard to deal with will be here.” (2 Timothy 3:1) Yes, what we see is evidence that we are living at the end of the present system of things. Conditions, along with people’s attitudes, are on a downhill slide. Can we expect an immediate solution? The Bible answers: “Wicked men and impostors will advance from bad to worse.”​—2 Timothy 3:13.

Does this mean that mankind is doomed to an endless cycle of vicious violence and escalating crime?

Some argue that the propensity for violence or killing has always been inborn in humans. Supporters of evolution maintain that we come from wild animals and have simply inherited their violent characteristics. Such theories would leave us doomed to an endless cycle of violence from which there is no hope of escape.

However, there is much evidence to the contrary. The theories mentioned above do not explain why in different cultures there are wide variations in frequency and types of violence. They do not indicate why in some cultures responding with violence seems to be the norm, whereas other societies report very little violence, with murder almost nil. Psychoanalyst Erich Fromm exposed cracks in the theory that we inherit aggression from primates by pointing out that although some of them are violent as a result of physical needs or for self-protection, humans are the only ones who have been known to kill for the sheer thrill of killing.

In their book The Will to Kill​—Making Sense of Senseless Murder, Professors James Alan Fox and Jack Levin state: “Some individuals are more prone to violence than others, yet free will still exists. The will to kill, though governed by numerous internal and external forces, still includes choice and human decision making, and thus accountability and culpability.”

Religion is often linked to violence, including sectarian violence and terrorism. But it is not just bigots, extremists, and fanatics who are to blame. During the two world wars, members of mainstream religions​—“Christian” and non-Christian—​slaughtered one another, often with the blessing of their spiritual leaders. Such behavior offends God.​—Titus 1:16; Revelation 17:5, 6; 18:24.

Even though violence may be triggered by a number of elements, its primary roots lie within ourselves. How so? Jesus Christ, who had profound insight into the human heart, stated: “Out of the heart of men, injurious reasonings issue forth: fornications, thieveries, murders, adulteries, covetings, acts of wickedness, deceit, loose conduct, an envious eye, blasphemy, haughtiness, unreasonableness.” (Mark 7:21, 22) We feed such wrong inclinations when we repeatedly look at, listen to, or think about bad things.​—James 1:14, 15.

On the other hand, when we feed our mind with wholesome things, such as those mentioned here, we starve and “deaden” bad desires and nurture good ones. (Colossians 3:5; Philippians 4:8) God will then help us “to be made mighty in the man [we] are inside.”​—Ephesians 3:16. Also see the text under my accountname (which is from the article in my signature).

A Realistic Solution—Is It Possible? Awake!—2003
Song 141 Searching for Friends of Peace (with lyrics)

a reply to: Vroomfondel

If those people going around stabbing people had easy access to guns they'd just shoot more people - more deaths.

This really is pretty simple; we don't want US style gun control laws.
We don't want to take yours away from you - your business, different country, different culture.

Numerous Brits come on ATS and for years have repeated this message....yet time and time again arrogant Americans assume to know more about our country than we do.

a reply to: worldstarcountry

general dissatisfaction with the way things are

corruption of those in power.

the breakdown of law and order

tyrannicidal laws being passed.

heightened sense of hopelessness among those on the bottom

inequality

encouragement by the powers that be get to nobodies to blame other nobodies for the state of the nation.

more and more people are sliding into poverty

the growing sense of injustice and inability to fix it


would you like me to go on?