San Antonio passes paid sick leave ordinance

a reply to: DieGloke

no it's about do you actually make enough money to pay for this and how does it impact your workforce

you can argue merit on the idea all day but at the end of the day the business has to be X profitable or it's not worth running

originally posted by: toysforadults
a reply to: DieGloke

no it's about do you actually make enough money to pay for this and how does it impact your workforce

you can argue merit on the idea all day but at the end of the day the business has to be X profitable or it's not worth running

And a buiness can only be profitable if it's work force and equipment are productive.

Personaly I never gave a single # about the personal life's or well-being of my past employee's. They where just tools to get a job done. But tools, even human tools need maintenance to be productive.
I worked for multinationals and ran my own small buisness, the principle of humans resources is the same.

Manage your employees well = £££££££

Manage them badly = Failure.

originally posted by: CB328
I am surprised not to see this on here. Apparently Austin already passed this, now San Antonio. As a contract worker I can tell you that it is ridiculous to work for a fortune 100 company and if I get sick I don't get paid a dime, though I am one of the top workers in my department. I think there should be some kind of national law passed that all major employers have to have some sort of sick leave for their workers. Missing just a few days can cause people to not be able to pay their bills, and I believe that leave is a human rights issue, that our increasingly capitalist country must be forced to respect.

www.texastribune.org...

More than that, paid sick leave saves companies money. It's far less of a revenue hit to have one person out due to an illness than to encourage them to come to work sick, get others sick, and then suffer the productivity hit of several people.

I'm in that situation myself, I don't get any PTO and zero sick days. I find that to be absolutely ludicrous. PTO is just a perk, but sick days actually make a lot of financial sense for the company.

originally posted by: BrianFlanders
I guess I'm a little confused. Why would anyone pay you to get sick?

They're not paying you to get sick. The point of paid sick leave, is that not only can you rest and return to full productivity quickly, but that you don't feel compelled to come into the office and get other people sick, thereby costing the company even more money.

a reply to: DieGloke

I just don't think you get it, I can afford for you to take a day off but I can't afford to pay you for it

originally posted by: Nickn3
I am torn on sick leave. I would love to have it, but.

I have about 65 employees right now, I run a construction company. I have no doubt most of the guys would take a day to go fishing and we would have an epidemic the opening day of deer season. The next thing is who would pay for it? Say the employees is accruing 1/2 a day a month. That six a a year times 65 = 370 sick days. At $250 bucks a pop on average, that’s $92,500.00 dollars. Quite a hit to the bottom line. My benefit package is currently about $6.75 per hour. For educational expense, insurance, vacation, 401K, holiday pay, clothing allotment, ect.

If you were one of my Customers would you mind another modest increase on your invoice to pay for my employees sick days?

$92.500 over 65 employees each putting in 2080 hours per year is 68 cents per hour billed.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: CB328
I am surprised not to see this on here. Apparently Austin already passed this, now San Antonio. As a contract worker I can tell you that it is ridiculous to work for a fortune 100 company and if I get sick I don't get paid a dime, though I am one of the top workers in my department. I think there should be some kind of national law passed that all major employers have to have some sort of sick leave for their workers. Missing just a few days can cause people to not be able to pay their bills, and I believe that leave is a human rights issue, that our increasingly capitalist country must be forced to respect.

www.texastribune.org...

More than that, paid sick leave saves companies money. It's far less of a revenue hit to have one person out due to an illness than to encourage them to come to work sick, get others sick, and then suffer the productivity hit of several people.

I'm in that situation myself, I don't get any PTO and zero sick days. I find that to be absolutely ludicrous. PTO is just a perk, but sick days actually make a lot of financial sense for the company.

Yeah exactly.

I am not a bleeding heart liberal.

And as a past manager and buisness owners I honestly didn't give two #s about being "kind" to my minions.

But was smart enough to know that having employees come in sick not only cut into productivity but but the deparment/company at risk.

Better to to let them have sicks days........but woe to the two employees or should I say ex employees I caught pulling a fake sicky

originally posted by: toysforadults
a reply to: DieGloke

I just don't think you get it, I can afford for you to take a day off but I can't afford to pay you for it

Problem with that is people then feel compelled to drag themselves in even when seriously sick. A situation I saw first hand that ended up in catasphrohie as I explained.



When budgeting my old department and business I always filled sick pay as a nessary expense like machine maintenance and servicing .

originally posted by: toysforadults
a lot of smaller companies just can't afford it plain and simple

Yes they can. 6 paid sick days per year results in a 2.3% increase to payroll, which generally means a 0.76% increase in operating expenses. If they're not offering it, it could be fully funded with less than a 1% increase to sales prices.

In fact, it could be implemented with 0% increases and still save money, because it keeps productivity higher. When people come to work sick, they get other people sick and that causes less work to get done.

Responsible companies encourage people to do what's best for the company and that often times means not coming into work sick. In fact, at many jobs they even offer work from home options where someone can still be 50% productive and not put the rest of the office at risk which is win/win for everyone. Money is made, work gets done, viruses aren't spread.

originally posted by: toysforadults
a reply to: DieGloke

I just don't think you get it, I can afford for you to take a day off but I can't afford to pay you for it

If you don't pay the employee for taking the day off though, you're incentivizing them to come to work so that they do get paid. Then you end up with a whole crew that's sick.

What costs more? Your entire 5 person crew working at 50% productivity for 3 days because someone came in sick, or 1 person being out for 1 or 2 days?

People are going to act in their self interest, and self interest means following the money first. Pay them to come to work sick, and that's what will happen. Then the employer loses more money.

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa
a reply to: CB328

It seriously seems unbelievable to me that in any wealthy first world country, Theirs still full time employee's who aren't entitled to a certain amount of payed sick days a year.

In Australia we get 10 a year. If you don't use them, then they accumulate... So if your smart you can just save them up over the years, so you've got a few months of payed sick leave, if something unforeseeable happens where your unable to work.

Its a human rights issue, as far as I'm concerned...

I like that idea. It's bad enough to lose money missing work but add dr bills and medications on top and getting sick in the US is an expensive proposition. What if government allowed each working adult 3- 5 sick days and if you don't use them you get to have them (+ 20% as an incentive) deducted from your income tax? A bit like a personal savings account that one could use when needed based on pay at minimum wage.

Not a big fan of government intervention but it is an endemic problem in the US. Take the money from a tax on stock trade profits.

a reply to: Aazadan

I just don't think you guys have ever run a business with tight profit margins and get what all of these government regulations are doing to small business in this country

but yeah, back to what theoretically sounds good

originally posted by: toysforadults
a reply to: Aazadan

I just don't think you guys have ever run a business with tight profit margins and get what all of these government regulations are doing to small business in this country

but yeah, back to what theoretically sounds good

Yes I have.

And to maximise my profits, meant maximising my staffs productivity while reducing the risk of flu ect wiping out my staff for a week.

It's about mathematics and risk management. You take short term expenses to maximize long term profits.

a reply to: DieGloke

no, if you're sick you take a day off

me and YOU keeping your money in our pocket is what creates prosperity in this country, the fewer taxes I pay and fewer social safety net regulations I have to comply with the more money I make the higher I pay you the faster I can invest my profits into growing the company and advancing your position

it sounds cool and makes you feel good but it's the #1 problem with the economy in this country and why half the country is in poverty

a reply to: toysforadults
It's not about feeling good.


Part of investing in your buisness is investing in the employees and equipment.

Without your employees you have no productivity.

You want to get the most work out of your employees correct?

Part of getting the best work out of them is investing in certain perks. Those perks translate into more work done that creates more profit than what you intialy paid with the perk.


Your just trying to save a few bucks in the short term without looking long term.

I know the USA has this mindset that treating employees like # = money saved but countless studies show the opposite.

You want the best work then you have to invest in your employees.

Almost all successful buisness know this and why Human resources is a big buisness in itself.

It's not about feeling good or being kind it's about maximising the productivity and profit from the resources avalibe and humans are a resource.

Treat a machine or piece of equipment like crap and it will become unrealible and break.
That principle is the same with employees.

originally posted by: toysforadults
a reply to: DieGloke

no, if you're sick you take a day off

me and YOU keeping your money in our pocket is what creates prosperity in this country, the fewer taxes I pay and fewer social safety net regulations I have to comply with the more money I make the higher I pay you the faster I can invest my profits into growing the company and advancing your position

it sounds cool and makes you feel good but it's the #1 problem with the economy in this country and why half the country is in poverty

Actually not doing so kills productivity and prosperity. The less you take care of your employees the more taxes you have to pay and the more employees you send into poverty. In lesser civilized, more natural society you would not survive with this attitude unless you could back it with force. At best you would be kicked off the island. I think unfortunately for your types, society is getting closer to getting a bit less civilized.

You guys are so clueless you have no idea what you're talking about

Whats the difference between me paying you better and you saving your money for a day off vs you using the government to force me to pay you less per hour to create a pool of capital to pay you to not be at work?

What if you never get sick?

Why is it your business how I run my company? News flash its not

Get the he'll out of my business

originally posted by: toysforadults
You guys are so clueless you have no idea what you're talking about

Whats the difference between me paying you better and you saving your money for a day off vs you using the government to force me to pay you less per hour to create a pool of capital to pay you to not be at work?

What if you never get sick?

Why is it your business how I run my company? News flash its not

Get the he'll out of my business

Never said the government should force you.
Company's should be smart enough to provide sick pay themselves.
If your company's to stupid to see the benefits of sick pay and vaccations then you suffer the consequences of low productivity and resulting loss of profits.


You want to make profit right?

Productivity = profit.

Productivity = work of staff and equipment

Equipment needs maintenance and care.

Employees are your most expensive pieces of equipment.

originally posted by: toysforadults

Why is it your business how I run my company? News flash its not

Get the he'll out of my business

Why so defensive? Is it because you don't like your entrenched , preconceived notions challenge by new facts?
Are you brainwashed to think vacations, sick pay and other benefits are such leftie, liberal, commie notions that offering them is purely a "feel good factor" and pointless lefty trash that you ignore the facts that these actually create profit for a company?

I am just a fellow buisness owner offering friendly advice on what worked for me and how I increased productivity and hence profit.

It's up to you if you take it. If you don't like productivity, meh it's your loss.

a reply to: DieGloke

you're asking for a cut in pay so someone else save money for you

that's how stupid that is, save your own money I don't want a cut in pay so someone else can save money for me. I want to work everyday get paid for it and reinvest my money so I can retire

a lot of people think like that

also, as a business owner the more you cut into my profits the less I can invest into growing my business the less jobs I have to offer the less i can pay my employee's

originally posted by: Asktheanimals
I like that idea. It's bad enough to lose money missing work but add dr bills and medications on top and getting sick in the US is an expensive proposition. What if government allowed each working adult 3- 5 sick days and if you don't use them you get to have them (+ 20% as an incentive) deducted from your income tax? A bit like a personal savings account that one could use when needed based on pay at minimum wage.

Not a big fan of government intervention but it is an endemic problem in the US. Take the money from a tax on stock trade profits.

If you incentivize people with a higher wage for coming into work you're back at step 1. People have an incentive to come in and infect the office. Now tax revenues are down, and business revenues are down.