Christian Leaders To Jeff Sessions: The Bible Does Not Justify Separating Families

a reply to: Teikiatsu

I didn't ask you, but if you want to answer, great.

Your post carries no reply tag and followed mine.

Thank you for granting me permission.

originally posted by: ketsuko
I totally remember those scriptures in the Bible where Jesus was being infairly tortured and executed by the Romans for having done nothing to anyone except offend the Jewish high priests and he preached all those pain-ridden homilies against the terrible Roman political system of the day!

Oh wait ... he didn't.

In fact, had he done something like it, the Jews might not have been so antagonistic toward him and might not have been so quick to get the Romans to execute him for no reason.

The whole thing makes no sense. Romans no more represent humanity than some thugs in an alley. They are no 'wordly' authority. If someone goes and preaches peace to some thugs and they unjustly kill them? How is that supposed to bring redemption to humanity, it simply does not follow.

originally posted by: RowanBean

originally posted by: Xenogears

originally posted by: RowanBean
a reply to: UKTruth

I believe it to be a very Christian thing to do to save children from the pure evil of their mothers who would risk their lives trekking to the border

Does that include the mothers who try to escape from drug cartels?

At the cost of their children being raped or possibly killed en route? Besides open the borders and how long till US is cartel territory too.

So you'd prefer they stay still where they are?

So the children came into the world, and then the cartel made their presence known? Or do you think it more likely the cartel was already there and they simply brought children into the world and put them at risk?

You know there are places where I hear most children die before the age of 5 from starvation. Whose fault is it? Eh? Whose fault is it when it is more than likely the cartel's presence precedes the child's conception, just like the conditions of famine may precede it in other locations. Irresponsible parents.

a reply to: Xenogears

Are you aware that drug cartels force people to become their mules? By your logic the parents in the Middle East are irresponsible parents. Like when ISIS presence precedes them.

a reply to: Xenogears

Romans no more represent humanity than some thugs in an alley.

Even thugs in an ally are representative of humanity. We own all of humanity, from its place in the filthy bowels to its lofty platitudes, we are all of it.

So the children came into the world, and then the cartel made their presence known? Or do you think it more likely the cartel was already there and they simply brought children into the world and put them at risk?

Typical Xtian hypocritical "blame the victim" stance.

a reply to: Xenogears

The point is that Jesus did not come and lecture on politics.

He came to preach to individuals.

During his time, he lived in an empire that was way more harsh and oppressive than anything the left currently inhabits right now. In fact, the Empire had slavery as part and parcel of its economics and way of life. This is actually reflected in the Gospels. Jesus taught to the world he inhabited without thought to political change.

His change was purely spiritual.

So it's a mistake to try to claim that Jesus is on your side when making a purely political message.

a reply to: Isurrender73

That's a decent argument!

(Somewhat unusual these days ... )

I guess your very good argument turns on one assertion however: border agents want the Trump Wall.

You didn't provide any backup for that claim.

However, it seems that it may be questionable.

But Border Patrol agents on the front lines say they need more technology and additional personnel to curb the illegal traffic, according to a report released on Thursday by Democrats on the Senate Homeland Security Committee. The report was based on internal Customs and Border Protection documents from the 2017 fiscal year. It concluded that less than one half of 1 percent of the agents’ suggestions to secure the Southwest border mentioned the need for a wall.

What Border Agents Say They Want (It’s Not a Wall) - NYT

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: Xenogears

The point is that Jesus did not come and lecture on politics.

He came to preach to individuals.

During his time, he lived in an empire that was way more harsh and oppressive than anything the left currently inhabits right now. In fact, the Empire had slavery as part and parcel of its economics and way of life. This is actually reflected in the Gospels. Jesus taught to the world he inhabited without thought to political change.

His change was purely spiritual.

So it's a mistake to try to claim that Jesus is on your side when making a purely political message.

Come now he violently threw the tables of people selling at the temple, iirc. You think he's going to stand by people who put children in a situation where they're likely to die or be raped?

originally posted by: RowanBean
a reply to: Xenogears

Are you aware that drug cartels force people to become their mules? By your logic the parents in the Middle East are irresponsible parents. Like when ISIS presence precedes them.

Look if ISIS invades your country, that's not your fault. But if ISIS is occupying your country and taking say every 5 year old girl to their camp, and you have a baby girl that's on you.

a reply to: Xenogears


Good thing 1st century Egypt let Jesus, Joseph and Mary in, being how she irresponsibly had a child that led to the death of hundreds of baby boys!

a reply to: Willtell

The LAW is Supposed to Also be Religious Blind...........Ahem......

a reply to: ketsuko

Check your PM's please.

a reply to: Willtell

When an American breaks the law and goes to jail does that American get separated from their family?

a reply to: Alien Abduct

Yes.

Are their children institutionalized?

Are their families permitted to visit them? To communicate with them?

originally posted by: Xenogears

originally posted by: RowanBean
a reply to: Xenogears

Are you aware that drug cartels force people to become their mules? By your logic the parents in the Middle East are irresponsible parents. Like when ISIS presence precedes them.

Look if ISIS invades your country, that's not your fault. But if ISIS is occupying your country and taking say every 5 year old girl to their camp, and you have a baby girl that's on you.

Yeah.
"Be responsible and don't have sex. Oh BTW you're not welcome here. I don't care if you have no where to go."

originally posted by: Phage
Thank you for granting me permission.

You're welcome!

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: Alien Abduct

Yes.

Are their children institutionalized?

Are their families permitted to visit them? To communicate with them?

Anecdotal - they see if other family members can take care of them. I had a co-worker taking care of his nieces (7, 6 and 4 years of age) while his brother and wife were both in jail, for about a year.

Visitation was not recommended. If my co-worker had not taken them, the girls would have been sent to foster care or state orphanage through child protection services.

a reply to: Teikiatsu

Ancedotal

Yeah. I'm aware of that. The children are not warehoused as these kids seem to be.

I think visitation could be problematic. But at least the parents know where their kids are, and can talk to them if they want to. Or is that incorrect?

a reply to: Willtell

“Oh please... these parents know full well the consequences of breaking the law, yet they choose to put their children at risk for the sake of their selfish choices. Can they not apply legally ? The fact that literally millions have gotten away with this crime is why there is such a constant dedication to dismissing laws, and putting children at risk.

As far as your BS Christian reasoning here... the bible has quite a few examples of families being torn apart and because of divine will. Even Jesus said that following Him was more important than loyalty to unbelieving family members.

As sad as it is to see children being used as pawns by many who think it will give them easier access or more gov funds.. lets put the blame where it belongs. On the adults who don’t seem to care enough for these children, and who often use them for their own nefarious purposes.”

-Sheye

I guess you don’t have a response to this?

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: Teikiatsu

Ancedotal

Yeah. I'm aware of that. The children are not warehoused as these kids seem to be.

I think visitation could be problematic. But at least the parents know where their kids are, and can talk to them if they want to. Or is that incorrect?

Are you talking about the ex-Walmart that has been renovated into a functional shelter? Because if you are, they aren't being stored on pallets and inventoried, then shuttled around on forklifts...