Armed FL school deputy Resigns after video shows he stood outside did nothing

I think that anyone who joins the police with an expectation they aren't going to put their lives on the line and potentially sacrifice themselves for the people they are supposed to protect, do immeasurable harm to the institution.

Sure, some might crack in the moment, but any more than a tiny percentage points to failures in recruitment,training or indoctrination of the values required.

I know it was his job to protect, but he was scared. It happens in all walks of life.
He will have live with his decision for the rest of his life though.
We all freeze sometimes when you know you should be helping someone in need.

Not every soul can step up when required, even if he pulled out his gun and ran into the school, it would have been better, even if he never found and shot the assailant. Too bad, after 4 minutes did he go inside anyways?

I will openly judge this coward, and I would absolutely say it to his face.

I don't give a sh*t what he 'has to live with' for the rest of his life, this guy is a disgrace to the human race and the badge that he was wearing at the time.

If I was the father of one of the victims, I'm uncertain if those guards at his house would stop me from getting to him.

Maybe he was told to stand down

originally posted by: TheRedneck
If there is a lesson in this tragedy, it is that placing all of one's fate in the hands of a precious few 'elites' who have firearms is a sure method to have that fate blasted to kingdom come. Hire armed, capable security and allow faculty to exercise their proper 2nd Amendment rights... school shootings will become a thing of the past.

Isn't armed security the elite who rule through threat of deadly force? That's what you're advocating for here, giving some the threat of a gun to rule. You're not against the elites, you just want the elite to be people like you.

Besides that point, I don't think you understand the logistics required. I know you're good with numbers, so sit down and think through this. There's 3.2 million teachers in the US, so it stands to reason that we have about 3.2 million classrooms in the US, right? If 1 in 3 teachers were armed, the size of the armed force we would need to equip, train, and pay is the size of the entire US armed forces. if it's 1 in 5 teachers it's the size of our entire police force. The logistics of this are staggering. We have an unemployment rate of 4.1% in a labor force of 94.6 million. Even if every single person in the US were willing and qualified, we could put them all to work and still only reach 75% of the goal.

It's simply not a realistic solution.

Oh, yeah, let's issue AR-15s to 10-year-olds who have never held one. Good idea... not.

TheRedneck

I'm being sarcastic in that suggestion, but why not. If more guns are a good thing, then lets give guns to everyone. At least that way there won't be a power disparity between teachers and students. You don't want armed elites running around without checks and balances do you? Never holding a gun isn't an issue, we're proposing the same for teachers. It's all a matter of training right? The military seems to think gun training can be accomplished over the course of a few days/hours. It's not like it's a hard subject.

a reply to: PraetorianAZ

Do you think that maybe, just maybe, he might have said that?? I certainly would have, rather than face the blizzard of condemnation that's come crashing down on him. Every bit of it deserved.

a reply to: Aazadan

Isn't armed security the elite who rule through threat of deadly force? That's what you're advocating for here, giving some the threat of a gun to rule. You're not against the elites, you just want the elite to be people like you.

You ever watch 3D movies? I do; they're fun little fantasy trips.

There is a scene in the movie "The Incredibles" where the villain has a dastardly plan to make everyone a super-hero, to take revenge on his childhood super-hero for mocking him. He says one poignant line that applies here:

"And when everyone is super... *evil chuckle* ... no one will be."

When everyone is an 'elite'... no one will be.

What I advocate for is not an elite class, but every class. I place no restrictions other than desire and responsibility on anyone. If a teacher, or a janitor, or a coach wants to possess a gun on school property, they need do no more than take a short training class, pass the background check, and buy a firearm. You advocate for only the wealthy, or the police, or whoever the elite du jour is, to be the only ones able to own a weapon and protect themselves.

And you accuse me of wanting an elite class? Look in the mirror!

There's 3.2 million teachers in the US, so it stands to reason that we have about 3.2 million classrooms in the US, right? If 1 in 3 teachers were armed, the size of the armed force we would need to equip, train, and pay is the size of the entire US armed forces. if it's 1 in 5 teachers it's the size of our entire police force. The logistics of this are staggering. We have an unemployment rate of 4.1% in a labor force of 94.6 million. Even if every single person in the US were willing and qualified, we could put them all to work and still only reach 75% of the goal.

I know you're good with numbers as well... but logistics? Apparently not so much.

We're not talking about hiring more people. We're talking about allowing people to do what they already want to do. Firearm safety classes are offered free, as in no charge, by groups like the NRA and GAO. In Alabama, to get a hunting license, one must first pass one of those courses. It costs the government almost nothing.

So there is no additional employment (unless you want to add dedicated security guards), no real cost to the faculty, no real cost to the government, an additional layer of security for the schools, and more freedom. I don't see the downside, but I'm sure you will find one for me... even if it means leaping to where logic never existed.

I'm being sarcastic in that suggestion, but why not. If more guns are a good thing, then lets give guns to everyone.

When I started reading that, I first heaved a sigh of relief. Now I think you have lost your mind. First-graders with AK-47s? Can we get back to reality here?

TheRedneck

a reply to: EchoesInTime

Armed FL school deputy Resigns after video shows he stood outside did nothing

Um... yeah... says the sheriff. And one officer to the New York Times. And I'm not taking their word for anything, especially since it contradicts earlier reports. For example, it was initially reported the school officer may not even have been on campus at the time. I would very much like to see the video. Why wasn't the video released? And I'd like to hear from the officer in question. Reports say he was in the parking lot; was he just arriving back on campus? What did he know and when did he know it?

I would also like to know what proper protocol would be in such an instance. I'm pretty darn sure it's not just, "Go in, address the killer, kill the killer." They've been having drills, they've had Secret Service on campus, they must have a protocol that the school officer was trained to follow. It seems to me at the very least that he would be required to "radio in" to someone before entering the premises for backup at the very least. Isn't that standard protocol for officers on the street? So who did he speak to? What did he tell them? What did they tell him? Did anyone tell him to stand down until backup arrived?

I'm trying to picture just what this officer was seeing and hearing, and how much he actually could have known. Where was the school officer when the shooter set off the fire alarm? Where was he when the shooting began? When did the school officer know the shooter was in that building? Was the shooter on the same side of the building as the school officer? And if kids were fleeing through the doors, would it have even been possible for the officer to get inside the building? And even if he did get in, and found the shooter, then what? Just start shooting as soon as he sees him with all those kids between them? I don't think so. If the officer couldn't engage the shooter before he got into the building... and if the officer wasn't already in the building when the shooter got in... then I honestly don't see a means by which this officer could have engaged him.

I need to know a whole lot more before I jump on this hate bandwagon all on the word of a sheriff with his own significant failings to answer for. Not to mention a clear political agenda. The burden of proof is on the sheriff. Show us the video. Show us the transcript for his call in to dispatch. Show us the written protocols he was trained to follow. For all I know, this school officer is just the Sheriff's fall guy... and if I put my tinfoil hat on, and look at this as a false flag event, then I have to wonder if perhaps this school officer knows something and wants to say something and someone(s) can't have that so this is how he's going to be shut up.

originally posted by: burgerbuddy

originally posted by: EchoesInTime
The school resource officer Scott Peterson resigned after it was revealed he would be suspended without pay, for his role in not engaging the school shooter when he clearly had the opportunity to do so.

Sheriff Scott Israel during a press conference Thursday said video showed Peterson arriving at the west side of the building where the shooting took place. Peterson, Israel said, took up a position but "never went in."

Deputy resigns FOX

Such a shame. There were so many warning signs and chances to stop this tragedy. I guess not everyone is cut out to be a hero. But it was his JOB!! wow

Just heard that!

Damn! I thought the kid took out the guards.

Another thing that was said was that the CCTV system is on a 20 min delay.

So no real time surveillance.

Sad, that guard is gonna have some problems.

That is by far the #tiest CCTV system I've ever heard of, if that is in fact true. I've been working access control and security for a long time and nearly all of them operate on a Cat5 or Cat6 network and are only delayed by a few milliseconds...

EDIT: At least ones built in the last decade.

a reply to: SprocketUK

i remember the incident by parliment and video showed bobbies RUNNING AWAY! but in there defense they were unarmed.

#ing coward, he did nothing and kids died, isnt that dereliction of duty, or something, those kids inside who died needed his protection and he did nothing nothing this is true he needs to be charged with dereliction of doozy or malfeasance or something because he was there protecting his kids and he stayed outside like a #ing coward

originally posted by: proteus33
a reply to: SprocketUK

i remember the incident by parliment and video showed bobbies RUNNING AWAY! but in there defense they were unarmed.

Sure some undoubtedly did, though for what reasons I am not sure, way more ran towards it all though, which is my point.

There is a culture of putting yourself in harm's way amongst the police and I think that should be emphasized more so we get fewer wastes of space like this guy. Someone else could have had his job, someone who might have gone in that school and just maybe saved some innocent lives.

originally posted by: Czulkang
#ing coward, he did nothing and kids died, isnt that dereliction of duty, or something, those kids inside who died needed his protection and he did nothing nothing this is true he needs to be charged with dereliction of doozy or malfeasance or something because he was there protecting his kids and he stayed outside like a #ing coward

I see you didnt read beyond the first page

It is not his duty to protect anyone but himself. no police officer has that obligation

originally posted by: HomelessWhiteMale
It is not his duty to protect anyone but himself. no police officer has that obligation

That doesn't change the fact that he's a coward. Cop or no cop, he had a gun, knew of the situation, was stationed there for the purpose of protecting the school occupants - and he didn't do anything. Your pushing the "it was not his duty" narrative is a mute point.

originally posted by: HomelessWhiteMale

originally posted by: Czulkang
#ing coward, he did nothing and kids died, isnt that dereliction of duty, or something, those kids inside who died needed his protection and he did nothing nothing this is true he needs to be charged with dereliction of doozy or malfeasance or something because he was there protecting his kids and he stayed outside like a #ing coward

I see you didnt read beyond the first page

It is not his duty to protect anyone but himself. no police officer has that obligation

That's nice. Then why did he resign the next day?

Was it the teachers duty , or the coach, or the fellow students to sacrifice themselves to protect each other?

Yet another failure that could have changed the outcome....

From the FBI, to local police, to the armed deputy that was there that AAAALLLLLL failed to act

BUT yup this is a gun issue......Jesus Christ how fkn dumbed Down have we become

a reply to: [post=23172247]Aazadan[/post

School resource officers typically do things like locker checks, run metal detectors, and check parking permits. They're mall cops, not some highly trained soldier expected to get into a firefight at a moments notice.

They receive the same training, qualify with and carry the same weapons as any other deputy. They receive the same pensions and benefits, so don't tell us they're exempt from putting themselves in harm's way.

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask
Yet another failure that could have changed the outcome....

From the FBI, to local police, to the armed deputy that was there that AAAALLLLLL failed to act

BUT yup this is a gun issue......Jesus Christ how fkn dumbed Down have we become

Considering there is now speculation that he was one of 4 cops there, I'd say it's far more than being dumbed down.

originally posted by: knowledge4truth
They receive the same training, qualify with and carry the same weapons as any other deputy. They receive the same pensions and benefits, so don't tell us they're exempt from putting themselves in harm's way.

Why should they be put in harms way? Police Officers are taught to only fight the battles they can win. It has cut down drastically on officer deaths over the years.