Enough is enough. Public massacres and school shootings must stop.

Enough is enough! Public massacres and school shootings must stop!

Stephen Willeford grabbed his AR-15-style rifle after hearing the gunfire and went over to investigate. Confronting the shooter, Devin Kelley, Willeford shot him in the leg and torso before Kelley dropped his weapon and fled the scene in his SUV.

At Moore, Oklahoma, a man went crazy at a food plant and attacked a female worker, literally chopping her head off. He then went after a second woman. Hearing the screams, C.O.O. Mark Vaughan pulled out his firearm, ran to the scene and shot down the killer.

The Clackamas Mall shooting in Oregon, a psycho with a semi-automatic rifle opened fire. Nick Melli, a young man carrying a .40 pistol on a permit, drew and aimed at the gunman. Melli didn’t fire, for fear of hitting innocents behind the perpetrator, but the gunman at that point fled through an employee’s-only doorway and down an inside hall, where he then committed suicide. What could have been a high-casualty mass murder was apparently aborted by the mere sight of an armed citizen.

Jeanne Assam, armed with the 9mm pistol she was licensed to carry as an armed citizen was at Church in Colorado Springs, Colorado, in 2007 , she shot the killer on the run and dropped him, at which time he shot himself, concluding the matter. Assam was hailed for her courageous act, which indisputably saved many lives.

An enraged man entered a psychiatric clinic and shot a caseworker dead and wounded one of the doctors before the latter drew his pistol and shot the man down, limiting the death toll to one. The doctor recovered and, declared a hero by local police, suffered no consequences for being armed in a “gun-free” zone.

The lessons are clear. One fights fire with fire, and defeats force with force. Criminals make a point of striking in places where police are absent, and the police can’t repeal the laws of time and motion to get to the scene in time to stop the murders. If someone collapses with a heart attack, a citizen first responder with an AED is more likely to save him than waiting for a paramedic unit. The State of Maine and New Hampshire do NOT require a concealed weapon Permit. In these states, anyone can carry a pistol in their pocket, or in a holster, No License Needed!

Let’s save America, and abolish the draconian laws that restrict it’s citizens from protecting themselves.

a reply to: Violater1

This was the school's fault in my opinion. This kid got expelled for making threats.

Why weren't authorities alerted before? How was he not hit with a felony. That would bar him from buying a gun.

Many of these shooters have had diagnosed mental illnesses. That should stop you from getting a gun.

Which one of these is more likely to deter a criminal.

a reply to: Violater1

I'm all for a few more rules.

Hell, make it the same as car registry. Always transfered immediately.

But pandoras box is open. The guns are out there.

Banning them will only empower criminals.

*everyone* why do these shootings keep happening?

*also everyone* treat's everyone around them like a human ATM's and sees other humans as resources with zero to no empathy

I would rather keep my rifles and outlaw war weapons. I would rather the NRA become a extinct business. I would rather vote out all Republican Congress. They are letting people die and our children are targets.

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: Violater1

This was the school's fault in my opinion. This kid got expelled for making threats.

Why weren't authorities alerted before? How was he not hit with a felony. That would bar him from buying a gun.

Manynif these shooters have had diagnosed mental illnesses.

Really?
If the teacher that was shot dead in the hallway had been armed, this would have had a different outcome.
Sheeesh, blame the school! I suppose you would blame the bottle company that got guy drunk and plowed into a families minivan. Dang bottle!

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: Violater1

This was the school's fault in my opinion. This kid got expelled for making threats.

Why weren't authorities alerted before? How was he not hit with a felony. That would bar him from buying a gun.

Manynif these shooters have had diagnosed mental illnesses.

I think I heard the weapon was stolen.

a reply to: Konduit

If you have a society that needs to arm and train teachers then you have a broken society that more guns will never fix

Let the blood dry on the ground before politicising it eh.


And hey. UK had one school shooting. We sat down as a society and said this must never happen again. We disarmed, got rid of our guns. And lo and behold, no more school shootings.

a reply to: Violater1

Lives are only important before birth. That is the essence of Dominionist philosophy.

You are part of the human race.

It's a troubled species.

originally posted by: Konduit
Which one of these is more likely to deter a criminal.

depends on how psychotic and motivated the murderer actually is

originally posted by: MOMof3
I would rather keep my rifles and outlaw war weapons. I would rather the NRA become a extinct business. I would rather vote out all Republican Congress. They are letting people die and our children are targets.

Oh yes, those darn Republicans in Chicago are arming all of the gangsters, and allowing them to murder 4 people a day.

originally posted by: Violater1
Let’s save America, and abolish the draconian laws that restrict it’s citizens from protecting themselves.

Okay, but maybe there's some way for us to stop these people before they kill. Having some gun-toting citizen jump in after people have already been killed is a little like locking the barn door after the horse is gone.

How about instead of doubling up on the killing (the victims and the shooter), we try to stop it before it happens with at least some attempt at proper counseling and identification of troubled individuals?

Or we could go the Wild West route that you're so jazzed about.

originally posted by: Painterz
Let the blood dry on the ground before politicising it eh.


And hey. UK had one school shooting. We sat down as a society and said this must never happen again. We disarmed, got rid of our guns. And lo and behold, no more school shootings.

Oh gee, and no more raping, and no more bombings and...

a reply to: Violater1

Another empty stupid argument. I care a thimble full for your kind. Trying to convince me we can’t stop this. We can. Just get rid of republicans who can’t protect and govern.

originally posted by: Blue Shift

originally posted by: Violater1
Let’s save America, and abolish the draconian laws that restrict it’s citizens from protecting themselves.

Okay, but maybe there's some way for us to stop these people before they kill. Having some gun-toting citizen jump in after people have already been killed is a little like locking the barn door after the horse is gone.

How about instead of doubling up on the killing (the victims and the shooter), we try to stop it before it happens with at least some attempt at proper counseling and identification of troubled individuals?

Or we could go the Wild West route that you're so jazzed about.

originally posted by: Konduit
Which one of these is more likely to deter a criminal.

Konduit says it best!!

Just like locks on doors, laws are only for honest people. Locks don't stop burglars and more laws won't stop criminals.


Trump wants to spend billions on a southern border fence. He should spend millions on security fences with limited, monitored access gates around schools.

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: Violater1

This was the school's fault in my opinion. This kid got expelled for making threats.

Why weren't authorities alerted before? How was he not hit with a felony. That would bar him from buying a gun.

Manynif these shooters have had diagnosed mental illnesses.

What felony were you going to charge him with? Just make one up so he cant buy a gun? As for mental illness, that is a slippery slope. A huge number of people in this country have been so-called diagnosed with some form of what is now considered a mental illness. If you ever say the word "depressed" you now have a diagnosed mental illness. It is very easy after the fact to talk about taking away someone's freedom. No one argues when you say you want to limit the freedom to own firearms of a convicted killer. But when you start predicting behavior and enforcing a legislative solution to that prediction you meet with fierce resistance. And you should.

As for this particular individual, it was known that he had guns. It was also known that he was just 18 years old. If he was known to have guns prior to turning 18 this could have been avoided. If he made threats to the school prior to this incident that were not investigated, this may have been preventable. There are a lot of "ifs" here.

I have a feeling that he owned firearms before he was legally able to do so and this was an entirely preventable situation. Or at least it could have been more closely scrutinized before ending so tragically.