Bigelow, UFOs, MUFON and ‘DeLonge’ Road to AATIP

What happens in Vegas stays in Vegas.

This is an important thread. Excellent work on context, ties that bind, and little known details of how all those "ties" bind. Looking forward to getting back and diving in after my chores today. Thank you, MM.

a reply to: mirageman

Great stuff and plenty of pointers to sink my teeth into, as usual.

One thing, I'm sure you're aware of it. Perhaps as a benefit to others who might care.

Annie Jacobsen is not the infallible truth-telling investigative journalist people make her out to be. She's just a human being.

As an example, in her book 'Phenomena', which I did enjoy, there were so many factual errors, that it provoked one of the employees of the Stargate problem to write a quite critical review of her book in the JSE.

www.scientificexploration.org...

My take on all of this, that at least when it comes to the players in the public view on this subject, we all tend to think that they know (and hide) much more than they actually do. Most have pieces of secrets, things they don't want to tell, but most everybody just keeps on searching (for what? that elusive 'proof'? whatever that is...). And guess this applies to Knapp, Lazar, Bigelow, Green, Puthoff, Alexander, Pandolfini, etc.

BTW, whatever happened to Tim Cook(one of those who heard the Skinwalker ranch shoot-out story?) I remember him from the Hunt for the Zero Point days (there's another CIA/blackops/Puthoff connection right there, the coincidences just keep on coming). The last time I heard, he was co-authoring a book with Tim Clark (the father of whom was in Special Forces, doing top secret mission during WWII.... does this rabbit hole never end...?)

a reply to: Pathaka

He was producing a sequel to his book on ZeroPoint last I heard.

Mirage, it might be worth mentioning that Bigelow funded Stanton Friedman’s research into a second crash site at Roswell.

a reply to: mirageman


It was a strange story re Gigal and the Jack Sarfatti story. Rather wild would one not say?

She herself is a very interesting lady.

www.starpod.us...


www.gigalresearch.com...

a reply to: cuckooold

Good to see you around again cuckooold too.

I've tried to piece together the links and connections leading up to AATIP being revealed. Obviously time is limited to do something like this. However there is a hell of a lot more and the things which have not been made public are probably the most interesting. We can only sit and wait for whatever else comes of it.

a reply to: IsaacKoi

In other words, even if you get some relevant people to tell you what they "know" then there's still quite a bit of work left to be done...

I know

Although that might not stand up to rigorous testing.

Like the new avatar by the way.

a reply to: Kurokage

This is a genuine question by someone with an open mind who wants to believe that we could be witnessing visitation, do any of us think that 2018 is anything different than say the Disney UFO film or more of the same?

I think we just have to wait and see whether this all fizzles out like MJ12 and SERPO before it or whether anything of real substance comes of it. So far, despite all the fanfares, everyone still employed by the US Government has either said nothing or told us nothing came of the AATIP project.

Which Disney film are you talking about by the way?

originally posted by: CardDown
What happens in Vegas stays in Vegas.

I heard Tom was only in town pawning one of his old guitars at Rick Harrison's place.

Amazing who he just happened to bump into!

originally posted by: mirageman
a reply to: Kurokage


Which Disney film are you talking about by the way?

Thanks for taking the time to reply to me, and again i would like to thank you for the time you must have but in to writing these posts, it was a great thread to read and was very informative.

I was refrencing the Disney UFO documentry/film which was supposed to finally show the "alien" landing at a US base but was changed at the last minute by the Airforce/powers that be just before release.

a reply to: mirageman

Just finished reading your epic OP.

Thank you for fleshing out the backstory as you have researched it. Most appreciated!

I also appreciate your fairmindedness - even though you seem to lean towards skepticism of TTSA.

It is an old and tangled web. We shall see, no?

a reply to: Kurokage

the Disney UFO documentry/film which was supposed to finally show the "alien" landing at a US base but was changed at the last minute by the Airforce/powers that be just before release.

Ahh OK. There were plans for DIsney to produce something in the 1950s. See Walt Disney, UFOs and the USAF.

And also the rather obscure Alien Encounters released in the 1990s. See Lost Walt Disney UFO Documentary

But the specific one you mean is the 1970s one which features in a recent thread : UFO'S: It Has Begun

Actually I'm glad you mentioned it now. Are you seeing a pattern here. 1950s, 1970s, 1990s...???

originally posted by: mirageman
a reply to: Kurokage

the Disney UFO documentry/film which was supposed to finally show the "alien" landing at a US base but was changed at the last minute by the Airforce/powers that be just before release.

Ahh OK. There were plans for DIsney to produce something in the 1950s. See Walt Disney, UFOs and the USAF.

And also the rather obscure Alien Encounters released in the 1990s. See Lost Walt Disney UFO Documentary

But the specific one you mean is the 1970s one which features in a recent thread : UFO'S: It Has Begun

Actually I'm glad you mentioned it now. Are you seeing a pattern here. 1950s, 1970s, 1990s...???

Yeah, that's exactly what i was thinking and why i was referring to the Disney documentary/film and the pattern of release and deny.

a reply to: AboveBoard

History has shown that whenever it seems something interesting appeared to be happening in the world of UFOs that everything was either a load of disinformation or doors were slammed shut shortly after. So I certainly remain cautious about what we've seen and heard so far.

As Sherlock Holmes once said :

..when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth

So yes we shall see.

My recent article on the the AATIP and Robert Bigelow contains some editorializing, but features a few bits about Bigelow's UFO case grabbing that aren't widely known. It'll be interesting to have further details uncovered to clarify just how much of the Pentagon's UFO program was BAASS's contracted research, and to see just what they produced. What we have so far is a bit murky at best.

UFOs, the Media, the Military & Dreams of Discovery

Great OP... 'I think Bigelow is really obsessed getting und using alien techn.

I think it was no coincidence that when nasa was running its BPPP (
en.wikipedia.org... )

one of its consultants was Eric Davis, who was working for Bigelow and at the same time was investigating the skinwalker ranch:
I remember his speech in front of the SSE , when he admitted that UFOs unofficially were of interest and that two "wormhole" incidents happened at the ranch: one where a creature was crawling out and one , where a flying trangle appeared-

www.youtube.com...

(at 37:30)


Davis is now a member of earthtech which was founded by TTSA - team-member Hal Puthoff

I smell "TRONDANT." And a rather full-bodied bouquet it is this vintage---with subtle but decidedly fruity hints of MJ-12 & SERPO as has been noted in the OP. Sorry, could not resist that. I'm gonna lighten up a bit I promise.

In my defense, I will say that if anyone isn't familiar with the circumstances or players surrounding the MJ-12 & SERPO stories/mythologies then you are doing yourself a disservice if you are trying to wade through and find any kind of answers as regards the AATIP-Delonge-TTSA-Bigelow revelation/team effort.

Don't get me wrong. I'm NOT saying there's nothing here of value when it comes to the question of Capital "D" Disclosure or soft, little "d", disclosure.

But first and foremost let's ask ourselves this question: How might the National Security Act be relevant to the topics herein? Especially in light of the perils on the world stage to include the war on terror, proxy wars with other Super-Powers, etc. and thereby taking into consideration the foreign policy and goals of The United States.

Should we put those "National Security" glasses on before we start to "read" the events and scant info surrounding these current events? I do believe so.

Those in the know, know that from the very beginning UFOS, Ufology, and the Intelligence Community have been intertwined (often for good reason) as if hammered together in the forge of Vulcan. And I don't mention Vulcan lightly, but we'll leave that aside for now.

As MM pointed out, so far the U.S. Government isn't openly endorsing the "revelations" coming from To The Stars Academy (A Team Bigelow Production.) That's not to say they aren't unofficial sponsors either. Could be. As MM also stated, we mostly only have questions---which is always the current state of ufology haha.

MM also introduced James Carrion former International Director of MUFON who, in my opinion, is often overlooked as to his contributions--scholarly and otherwise--towards some of the very pertinent subjects here.

Just prior to the 17-minute mark of the podcast, Carrion was asked where he first saw evidence of deception in ufology.

"I would have to say during the time I was in MUFON," he explained. "When I first joined the organization, just like everybody else, I was very curious. I wanted to know why this subject was still a mystery. The more I started to look into it, the more I started to research it, and the higher that I got up in the organization, the more I could see that there was a large element of human deception involved.

"A lot of the cases, for example, that I investigated personally during MUFON, there was no paranormal. There was no extraterrestrial aspect to a lot of these cases. A lot of it boiled down to strange people passing strange stories – and of questionable backgrounds – and really trying to spin the whole rumor mill around the subject."

Carrion offered a couple examples of such circumstances, then added, "We get a lot of these strange characters that just pop into the UFO field. They make these grandiose claims and none of it really pans out."

James Carrion to Podcasters: Deception Inherent to Ufology; Don't Focus on the Signal, Focus on the Noise

So keeping in mind questions of National Security and the numerous connections to the Intelligence Community to this "disclosure" effort, do we have any idea of the breadth of Bigelow's current projects with the various government entities? Types and dollar figures?

Knowing that, I would proffer, would significantly narrow our scope and sharpen our focus in forming pertinent questions. The kind of questions that suggest answers if that makes sense to you and it will to a few.

That's my opening salvo. Thanks, also, for the interesting stuff about Kit's research, MM. I'm looking forward to catching up on that. Also…could you tackle fleshing out Hal Puthoff? Please? He always gets kind of overlooked and not delved into and yet there he is at the very center of…everything!

originally posted by: CardDown
My recent article on the the AATIP and Robert Bigelow contains some editorializing, but features a few bits about Bigelow's UFO case grabbing that aren't widely known. It'll be interesting to have further details uncovered to clarify just how much of the Pentagon's UFO program was BAASS's contracted research, and to see just what they produced. What we have so far is a bit murky at best.

UFOs, the Media, the Military & Dreams of Discovery

HIGHLY recommended article. Thank you, CardDown!

a reply to: mirageman

By 1996, he had also purchased Skinwalker Ranch. A property where many paranormal happenings were reported to have taken place.

The Skinwalker ranch book is a big disappointment.

The ranch owner and his family are the only ones, the book records, experiencing the supposed weird incidents; none of the scientist saw anything.

I wonder why this is even known as a spooky place having anything to do with Ufology.

Maybe the government and their tricksters and Bigelow have buried Ufology on the ranch!

What we know and don’t know has to be understood:

What we know:

The government can’t EVER be trusted=100 percent true

There is a strange phenomenon going on within what is termed UAP and UFO /Alien phenomenon=100 true

What we do not know:

We (the people) generally don’t know the nature of this phenomena is=100 true

We don’t know what the government knows=100 percent true

Possibilities:

Alien/Ufos are a phenomena here to monitor nuclear weapons and aid humans in survival and development

Aliens are in contact with the government and a massive cover-up is underway

Government knows little about the phenomena and are only covering up their ignorance( very likely the case)

Government is taking military, political and industrial advantage of the unknown phenomena ( very likely)

The Alien/Ufo phenomena are a demonic and negative force ( unlikely)

Alien/Ufos are an inter-dimensional reality with spiritual ramifications( likely)

Alien/Ufos are a pure physical reality from some other planet system( unlikely)