Religion of peace update...

Originally posted by saint4God
This would be extreme for me. I'd be hard pressed to pet the mosquito sucking on my arm. Maybe I'm seen as violent then?

Hahaha....it's not violent to kill a mosquito, it is just that such is not allowed in a mosque. The weird thing is, in all my years going to the mosque, it hasn't happened (or I haven't noticed it happening) to me. I suppose you should just shoo it away.

There are mixed feelings about India. None of it is religious, though. There are too many muslims in India for that. Things keep see-sawing. There was a whole lot of excitement about the opening of a bus service over through Kashmir. However, I just learnt now that someone (apparently India) blew it up.

[edit on 7-4-2005 by saint4God]

Originally posted by babloyi

Originally posted by saint4God
This would be extreme for me. I'd be hard pressed to pet the mosquito sucking on my arm. Maybe I'm seen as violent then?

Hahaha....it's not violent to kill a mosquito, it is just that such is not allowed in a mosque. The weird thing is, in all my years going to the mosque, it hasn't happened (or I haven't noticed it happening) to me. I suppose you should just shoo it away.

*scribbles down note: when visiting mosque, shoo mosquito, not squash*

Originally posted by babloyi
There are mixed feelings about India. None of it is religious, though. There are too many muslims in India for that. Things keep see-sawing. There was a whole lot of excitement about the opening of a bus service over through Kashmir. However, I just learnt now that someone (apparently India) blew it up.

I heard about the tensions, but from the other side (?). Apparently there are some that believe India was invaded because of crusader-type war. Sounds like it was similar to the Christian Crusade which in effect had nothing to do with scripture.

I started a new thread titled "Wake up!! Islam is comiing in your back door" for the following but thought that it also applied here:

I've posted proof and references in other threads that the real intent of the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR) is to make Islam the dominant religion in America and now there are more organizations being established to ensure that this becomes a reality.

At Dawa.net it explains how to introduce Islam to your children in public schools

At Islamicfoundation.com, Yahiya Emerick explains her vision on how to make America an Islamic nation

And that old 7-11 convenient store down the block that was converted into a mosque? They are inviting non-Muslims and preaching one thing to them while teaching their true intent to their regular members.

In her first installment of the series, Piercing the Veil of Duplicity: An Investigative Seriesl Laura Mansfield outlines her personal experiences of being invited to a mosque to "learn about Islam". What they didn't know is that Laura is fluent in Arabic and well aware of the intent of the Islamic movement in America.

It's time to wake up!! Don't take my word for it. Download a copy of the Qur'an/Hadith and read for yourself what Islam is about. Educate yourself. Eduacte your children. And if your local public school even hints at introducing Islam to your kids--well I know that I would be down there faster than light to set the administration straight. BTW, public schools are no place for any kind of religion. But it will be proponents of Islam that will be the proverbial "camel's nose under the tent" who will test that infringement of the Constitution.

In light of the recent London attacks, there are at least some who are finally waking up to the fact that the literal interpretation of the Quran exists even among the so-called "moderate" Muslims. This article shows the realization by at least one journalist who is waking up; a journalist who has before defended Islam by proclaiming extremism as a bastardized version of Islam and the primary cause of the violent jihadist mentality. But when even "moderates" spew the wretched verses of the Quran as justification for murder under the guise of Jihad, even the peaceful, non-violent Muslims are losing the battle for their religion. Non-violent Mulsims have been woefully silent about the "hijacking" of their religion which makes me wonder what they really want--freedom and democracy; or Islamic rule/law.

Here is an excerpt:

It's time we accepted the difficult truth: many of the Muslims we invite to live in Australia want to destroy us.

FOR four years, since the September 11 attacks, I've begged our Islamic leaders to drive extremists from their mosques.
For four years I've also reassured you that most Muslims here are moderate.

I've even insisted they have some moderate Muslim leaders, and last week again endorsed Sheik Fehmi Naji El-Imam of Preston mosque as a man of peace.

How eager I was to praise. Heavens, I described as "moderate" the Melbourne-based Islamic Information Services Network of Australia (IISNA), which purged from its website articles I'd noted claiming democracy was a sin, Jews were behind September 11 and Western society was a pollution.

But was I just kidding myself? Isn't it becoming terribly clear that Islam -- at least the Islam of Australia's Arab sheiks and imams -- is hostile to our society?

Isn't it now obvious we should never have let into our country those imams who now preach hate?

Isn't the evidence that some cultures -- Muslim Arab ones -- pose more problems than their importation at this rate is worth? Isn't multiculturalism making these problems worse?

I know these are dangerous, hurtful questions. I also know many Muslims will feel deeply offended, loving this country and obeying its laws, and I wish only I heard from them far more often.

But the London bombings, perpetrated by home-grown Muslims, makes our silence on such issues not a sign of civility, but suicide.

So let me admit that the past few days have been terrible for those of us who thought we could count on Muslim leaders for real help against the Muslim extremists who threaten us.

Such setbacks we've had.

Only last week I'd praised Sheik Fehmi as a good man, who'd condemned the London bombings. But a day later he was asked about fellow Melbourne sheik Mohammed Omran, a friend of a suspected al-Qaida boss, who'd claimed September 11 was really the work of a US-based conspiracy.

"He is entitled to his own thinking," Fehmi replied meekly. Then, asked if Osama bin Laden and his al-Qaida terrorists had committed those attacks, he added: "We cannot say. We do not know these things."

How can Muslim leaders fight terrorism, when the most moderate of them won't condemn even bin Laden, or admit that monster's self-confessed guilt?

Fehmi was not my only disappointment. I checked the IISNA site this week, and among the announcements of classes and prayers found this advice to a reader who'd asked if it was a sin to kill non-Muslims:

"In regard to non-Muslims who are at war with the Muslims and do not have a peace treaty with the Muslims or are not living under Muslim rule, then Muslims are commanded to kill them, because Allah says . . . 'Fight those of the disbelievers who are close to you, and let them find harshness in you.' "

If that's advice passed on by a "moderate" Islamic group, what must the radical ones here say?


If you non-violent "moderates" want to save your culture and your religion then you need to do more than be silent. Anything else makes you part of the problem.

too much hate been shown here mate. There is a line between opinion and bias, and i think youve just crossed into bias territory.

peace

DC Watson updates his list. I expect such updates will be keeping him busy in the coming months.

The following is an update to the running list of arrested, convicted, deported, or still at large 'tiny minority' of radical, America-hating Muslims who are out on the fringe on the 'religion of peace' and tolerance, Islam.

Apparently, they just don't get it. They just don't understand that the followers of Islam only wish to coexist with non-Muslims everywhere in the world and live in harmony. At least that's what the fine, outstanding representatives of Islam at the Council on American Islamic Relations would have us believe.

We know better, and we always will. The mainstream media continues to conduct interviews with the fine, outstanding Muslims at the Council on American Islamic Relations, who tell the American public that killing innocent people goes against Islam. While CAIR distracts our politicians and our media outlets with complaints of 'Islamophobia,' Muslims like those on the list below are speaking softly, smiling at you, waiting for their orders. You see, in Islam, non-Muslims just don't meet the 'innocent people' criteria.

Qur'an 5:51 "Believers, take neither Jews nor Christians for your friends."

Qur'an 9:27 "Fight against such as those to whom the Scriptures were given (Jews and Christians)...until they pay tribute out of hand and are utterly subdued."

Caught:

Randall "Ismail" Royer
Sami Al-Arian
Ghassan Elashi
Nuradin Abdi
José Padilla
Bassem K. Khafagi
Zacarias Moussaoui
Sami Ibrahim Isa Ardel Hadi
Abdurahman Alamoudi
Karim Iraq
Ahmed Omar Abu Ali
Ahmed Barodi
Sadeq Naji Ahmed
Mukhtar al-Bakri
Princess Buniah al-Saud
John Muhammad
Bashir Noorzai
Faysal Galab
Bayan Elashi
Ali al-Timimi
Shafal Mosed
Ibrahim Al-Niqrish
Sahim Alwan
Imam Fawaz Damra
Ihsan Elashyi
Yahya Goba
Ahmed Ressam
Yasein Taher
Ali bin Mussalim
Hasan Akbar
Basman Elashi
Nemr Ali Rahal
Hazim Elashi
Clayton Morgan, aka Isamu Dyson, aka Cayson Bin Don
Tarik ibn Osman Shah
Rafiq Sabir
Samir Yousif Shana
Munir Yousif Shana
Shabbir Ahmed
Arwah Jaber
Sheik Rahman
Hamid Hayat
Umer Hayat
Mohammad Adil Khan
Mansoor Hassan
Mohammad Hassan Adil
Mohammed Khalil Ghali
Samih Fadl Jamal
Hana Al Jader
Ramsey Youssef
Abdul Hakim Murad
Wali Khan
Muhammed Aatique
Nabil Gharbieh
Donald T. Surratt
Hammad Abdur-Raheem
Ibraham Ahmed al-Hamdi
Caliph Basha Ibn Abdur-Raheem
Seifullah Chapman
Masoud Ahmad Kahn
Dr. Rafil Dhafir
Rabih Haddad
Levar Haney Washington-(convert to Islam)
Gregory Vernon Patterson-(convert to Islam)
Abdullah Alnoshan
Khalid Fadlalla
Karim Ahmed Abdel Latif Ahmed
Mahoud Ahmed Abdel Latif Ahmed
Ahmed Mohamed Atta
Mohamed Ibrahim Gaber
Mohamed Palat Anwar Jozain
Homaidan Al-Turki
Aref Ahmed
Mohammed Ali Hassan al-Moayad
Mahmud Faruq Brent
Shahawar Matin Siraj
Ibrahim Abu Mezer
Hammad Riaz Samana
Abdul Rauf Noormohamed
Naji Antoine Abi Khalil
Imam Jamil Al-Amin

That's interesting. Several of the people on this list are named Mohammed, or Muhammad.

Please teach your children well about the 'religion of peace'--because they're teaching their's about how to deal with non-believers and idolators, Christians, and Jews.

Does Sharia law exist in Canada? Before answering "no", follow this link and find out what many Muslim Canadian women have to live with in matters concerning their marriage.

Here's another fine example of Islamic "protectors" of women!!

"Tehran, Iran, Sep. 06 – Women who violate Iran’s strict Islamic dress code will be flogged immediately, prosecutor’s offices in provincial centres announced on Tuesday."

Why do Muslim women want to have anything to do with an ideology that views them as second class or otherwise less important than men? I know in Iran and most other Islamic nations they don't have a choice. But the question is being asked of those women who live in western countries where they have a choice of faith. Maybe a Muslim woman can provide some insight.

When health/medical equipment designed to improve the lives of the sick and injured are denied because they are made in Israel; well, let's just say Islamic intolerance is again indicated:

Medical equipment manufactured in Israel worth over $50 million was returned recently by a Dubai hospital in the United Arab Emiratesbecause it carried Made in Israel labels.

"The equipment included staff uniform, patient clothes, bed sheets, pillows and towels. A hospital source refusing to identify itself or the hospital, said the fact the equipment was made in Israel was discovered during routine equipment inspections by hospital staff. "They were stunned to see the Made in Israel labels," he said."

And this isn't Suadi or Syria. These are relatively westernized arab nations. But, then again; when the Qur'an specifically states to not take the Jews as friends what can one expect of those Muslims.

Originally posted by Freedom_for_sum
When health/medical equipment designed to improve the lives of the sick and injured are denied because they are made in Israel; well, let's just say Islamic intolerance is again indicated:

Medical equipment manufactured in Israel worth over $50 million was returned recently by a Dubai hospital in the United Arab Emiratesbecause it carried Made in Israel labels.

"The equipment included staff uniform, patient clothes, bed sheets, pillows and towels. A hospital source refusing to identify itself or the hospital, said the fact the equipment was made in Israel was discovered during routine equipment inspections by hospital staff. "They were stunned to see the Made in Israel labels," he said."

And this isn't Suadi or Syria. These are relatively westernized arab nations.

Really?

www.odci.gov...

Looks pretty close to Saudi and Syria to me. What makes the United Arab Emirates western?

I really don't know, I've never been there.

Saint;

I'm not talking about their geographic location; but, rather, their social/economic structure. For example, unlike Saudi Arabia, you can by beer in downtown Abu Dahbi. This would be a crime in some other Arab nations. My point in the previous post is, however, that regardless of how western or secular islamic nations are, you can't change the basic tapes constantly played in Islam.

Another fine example of the intolerant and hateful nature of Islam is presented in these articles describing the angry reactions of thouasands of Muslims at a play enacted two years previous at a Coptic (Christian) church. The claim is that this play is offensive to islam. I say: SO WHAT?? Since when do Muslims corner the market on being offended? And since when does their being offended give them license to cause damage and injury to others? Their actions are a prime example of what the Qur'an and Hadith instruct them to do in these circumstances. :bnghd:

Here are the articles:

From CNN

From Al Jazeera

Flame Away!!

Some excellent questions asked of Muslims in general by Dennis Prager, a sydicated radio talk show host whom, I believe, is one of the most articulate and sensible speakers I know of. Here they are:

(1) Why are you so quiet?

Since the first Israelis were targeted for death by Muslim terrorists blowing themselves up in the name of your religion and Palestinian nationalism, I have been praying to see Muslim demonstrations against these atrocities. Last week's protests in Jordan against the bombings, while welcome, were a rarity. What I have seen more often is mainstream Muslim spokesmen implicitly defending this terror on the grounds that Israel occupies Palestinian lands. We see torture and murder in the name of Allah, but we see no anti-torture and anti-murder demonstrations in the name of Allah.

There are a billion Muslims in the world. How is it possible that essentially none have demonstrated against evils perpetrated by Muslims in the name of Islam? This is true even of the millions of Muslims living in free Western societies. What are non-Muslims of goodwill supposed to conclude? When the Israeli government did not stop a Lebanese massacre of Palestinians in the Sabra and Chatilla refugee camps in Lebanon in 1982, great crowds of Israeli Jews gathered to protest their country's moral failing. Why has there been no comparable public demonstration by Palestinians or other Muslims to morally condemn Palestinian or other Muslim-committed terror?

(2) Why are none of the Palestinian terrorists Christian?

If Israeli occupation is the reason for Muslim terror in Israel, why do no Christian Palestinians engage in terror? They are just as nationalistic and just as occupied as Muslim Palestinians.

(3) Why is only one of the 47 Muslim-majority countries a free country?

According to Freedom House, a Washington-based group that promotes democracy, of the world's 47 Muslim countries, only Mali is free. Sixty percent are not free, and 38% are partly free. Muslim-majority states account for a majority of the world's "not free" states. And of the 10 "worst of the worst," seven are Islamic states. Why is this?

(4) Why are so many atrocities committed and threatened by Muslims in the name of Islam?

Young girls in Indonesia were recently beheaded by Muslim murderers. Last year, Muslims — in the name of Islam — murdered hundreds of schoolchildren in Russia. While reciting Muslim prayers, Islamic terrorists take foreigners working to make Iraq free and slaughter them. Muslim daughters are murdered by their own families in the thousands in "honor killings." And the Muslim government in Iran has publicly called for the extermination of Israel.

(5) Why do countries governed by religious Muslims persecute other religions?

No church or synagogue is allowed in Saudi Arabia. The Taliban destroyed some of the greatest sculptures of the ancient world because they were Buddhist. Sudan's Islamic regime has murdered great numbers of Christians.

Instead of confronting these problems, too many of you deny them. Muslims call my radio show to tell me that even speaking of Muslim or Islamic terrorists is wrong. After all, they argue, Timothy McVeigh is never labeled a "Christian terrorist." As if McVeigh committed his terror as a churchgoing Christian and in the name of Christ, and as if there were Christian-based terror groups around the world.

As a member of the media for nearly 25 years, I have a long record of reaching out to Muslims. Muslim leaders have invited me to speak at major mosques. In addition, I have studied Arabic and Islam, have visited most Arab and many other Muslim countries and conducted interfaith dialogues with Muslims in the United Arab Emirates as well as in the U.S. Politically, I have supported creation of a Palestinian state and supported (mistakenly, I now believe) the Oslo accords.

Hundreds of millions of non-Muslims want honest answers to these questions, even if the only answer you offer is, "Yes, we have real problems in Islam." Such an acknowledgment is infinitely better — for you and for the world — than dismissing us as anti-Muslim.

We await your response.

I say; don't hold your breath Dennis!! A Muslim acknowledging problems in Islam is un-Islamic and considered apostacy which is punishable by death.

www.khaleejtimes.com.../middleeast/2005/December/middleeast_December384.xml§ion=middleeast&col=" target="_blank" class="postlink">Here 's a tolerant Islam alert from Kuwait


KUWAIT CITY — A Kuwaiti lawmaker yesterday slammed the government for providing Christians with two plots of land to build churches, saying this was against Islamic law.

“The recent measure of allowing non-Muslims to build places of worship in Kuwait is illegal under Islamic law,” Waleed Al Tabtabai said in a statement after the government provided the land.


Despite Kuwait being a relatively "westernised" Islamic nation, this tiger still can't change its stripes. Islamic law in intolerant of any other religion, especially Crhistianity and Judaism.

In the "damned if you're raped or damned if you defend yourself department", a 18-year woman old is sentenced to death for killing a man who attempted to rape her and her neice when she was 17.

Excerpt:

Tehran, Iran, Jan. 07 – An Iranian court has sentenced a teenage rape victim to death by hanging after she weepingly confessed that she had unintentionally killed a man who had tried to rape both her and her niece.

The state-run daily Etemaad reported on Saturday that 18-year-old Nazanin confessed to stabbing one of three men who had attacked the pair along with their boyfriends while they were spending some time in a park west of the Iranian capital in March 2005.

The court, however, issued on Tuesday a sentence for Nazanin to be hanged to death.

Another interesting tidbit from this article is the fact that their boyfriends RAN AWAY in typical cowardly Islamic fashion.

It has been a few months so here is an updated list of about 300 misunderstanders of Islam who...

From D.C. Watson:

...fail to understand that as followers of Islam, they should strive to coexist peacefully with non-Muslims everywhere in the world and live in harmony and equality with them -- as it is prescribed in the Qur'an. I know it's in there somewhere...I'm still looking for the passage!

This is not a global list of names. These individuals are our neighbors, co-workers, and fellow "citizens" here in the US.

all religions are religions of intolerance, hate, and violence. there are only 2 exceptions: buddhism and flying spaghetti monsterism.

not a single person has been killed or persecuted under buddhist law or the law of the flying spaghetti monster. though several buddhist monks have torched themselves in protest...

okay, so nobody has died because of flying spaghetti monsterism.

before you go bashing islam, just consider how horrible america would be if the religious fundamentalists that WE had were in charge...

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
all religions are religions of intolerance, hate, and violence. there are only 2 exceptions: buddhism and flying spaghetti monsterism.

not a single person has been killed or persecuted under buddhist law or the law of the flying spaghetti monster. though several buddhist monks have torched themselves in protest...

okay, so nobody has died because of flying spaghetti monsterism.

before you go bashing islam, just consider how horrible america would be if the religious fundamentalists that WE had were in charge...

I know I don't have an appointment, but it sounds like Dr. Spin is in. Have your read what the topic is about? At all? If you'd like to go on a carpet-bombing run, there are some more generalized threads on ATS for doing so.

this topic is about blatently bashing mainstream islam because a a group of radicals, saint. i know spin when i see it in a thread title, so i countered with my own spin.

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
this topic is about blatently bashing mainstream islam because a a group of radicals, saint. i know spin when i see it in a thread title, so i countered with my own spin.

When you say "a group of radicals" what exactly are you talking about? What number are you attributing to this group? Throughout this thread I've provided a plethera of evidence that these "radicals" are not the "tiny minority of extremists" that Islamic apologists would have us believe.

Instead of attacking the so-called extremists for hijacking their religion, "mainstreamers" label those, such as myself, as having "Islamophobia" without ever addressing the legitimate questions being asked about Islam.

I challenge you to come up with a list, equating to even half the size of the one I provided in this thread, of those Christians, Jews, etc, who have kidnapped and decapitated people in the name of their god; who have raised money to send to terrorists who blow up themselves and innocents; who during the religious celebrations (Hajj) call for "death to _________"