The “Promised Land” Belongs to Palestinians and Jews

originally posted by: dashen
a reply to: JimNasium

what about the two million arab israelis?

are they'jack jews 'too?

They are the ones that the U.S. aid to Israel™, $38 BILLION over 10 years, should go to and not NuttinButaYahoo and His cronies bank accounts...

a reply to: JimNasium

those arabs make up 20% of the israeli govt, so they get their fair share of shekels

A really great video to share with you guys.Some will like it and others'
will be offended by it.

www.youtube.com...

a reply to: mamabeth

I neither like the video, nor am I offended by it. The doctrines and dogmas expressed in the video, in my opinion, are only substantiated by cherry picking Biblical versus out of context.

With a full contextual reading of the Bible,.... cross-referencing the original Hebrew and Greek words,... and taken into consideration with the people and cultures of the Levant, Mediterranean, Fertile Crescent, and Indus Valley,.... we begin to see that the Old Testament is an off-shoot of Canaanite Polytheism, while the New Testament is a splinter of the Greco-Roman Mystery Traditions.

The message of Jesus, according to his red-lettered words in the Gospels, is quite simple:



1. There is no automatic salvation in simply believing or professing faith in Jesus.

(Matthew 7:21-23)
Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.



2. We are all children of God.

(John 10:34)
Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?



3. The Kingdom of God is within

(Luke 17:20-21)
The kingdom of God cometh not with observation: Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.



4. Love is the ultimate law

(Matthew 22:37-40)
Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

This is the first and great commandment.

And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.



Jesus was a teacher of morals, ethics, introspection, acceptance, forgiveness, love, and divine mystical communion. The various wealthy, powerful, and influential founders of organized Christianity hijacked the message of Jesus and incorporated their various Mysteries and Sun Worship into the newly formed religion.

originally posted by: JimNasium

originally posted by: carewemust
Entire planet belongs to God.

And per the Jewish™ faith, it MUST be God that restores The Land the Jews are to call "Home". The Ones running Israel™ now are Zionist™ playing someone with Jewish faith.

Question. If that is the case Woudnt God had Stopped them from creating the state of israel again? The Romans defied God by stealing the land from them in the first place. It was already established. God through the UN,League of nations restored Israel.

a reply to: mightmight

But just because you as distinct group with a national identity happen to share similar genetic markers connected to some ancient people long gone doesnt mean you are a new incarnation of those people and can claim some sort of heritage. Genetics dont make you anything.

That,.... in conjunction with the fact that this ethnic group of genetic carriers still resides within the Promised Land, and that the displaced among them have only suffered the loss of their ancestral land between this current generation and two generations ago. It is present and ongoing, we are not talking about ancient history.

Palestinians today identify as Arabian. There is nothing with separates an Arab living in the Westbank from an Arab living in Jordan, Lebanon or Syria. They are all par fort he greater pan arabian family.

This is not entirely true. Have you spoken frankly with Arabs from many different countries? I do. On average, they tend to cling to their national identities first and foremost, then secondly to their religion, and then only as part of a “greater pan Arabian family” after those two facts. I have experienced many Arabs who tout their nationality above the nationality of other Arabs, and have even seen Muslims Arabs who refuse to give marriage blessings simply because the other Muslim Arab is of a different nationality.

The idea of a singular and cohesive Arabian family is a farce and fallacy.

Why on earth would i think that? I believe Jews are a people not just a religion.

Because you are basically saying that, Jews who convert to Christianity or Islam have negated their “Jewishness”,.... you label them as Arabs without acknowledging their extremely recent Jewish ancestry,... and fail to acknowledge that they are Arabized and are not true Arabs.

When I learned the Arabic language, a Hanifa Sheikh told me that I am now considered to be an Arab,.... simply because I can utilize their language, even though no one from my family has been known to be Arab, Middle Eastern, or Muslim.

a reply to: yuppa



The Zionists have deceived many well meaning Jewish people via terror, trickery and false propaganda. They have at their disposal the use of a nearly universally subservient media. Whoever attempts to criticize them puts his livelihood and, at times, his very life in danger.

However, despite the media blackout and easy resort to terror the simple truth remains unrefuted and irrefutable: ACCORDING TO THE JEWISH FAITH AND TORAH LAW THE JEWISH PEOPLE ARE FORBIDDEN TO HAVE THEIR OWN STATE WHILE AWAITING THE MESSIANIC ERA!

The Creator gave us the Holy Land thousands of years ago. Yet, when we sinned, He took it away and sent us into exile. Since that time our task is to wait for Him to send the Messiah. At that time, the Creator alone, without any human being lifting a hand or saying a word, will bring us together and take us out of exile. He will likewise establish universal peace among all mankind and all will serve Him in good will.

Some religious Jews, confused by Zionist propaganda quote Biblical verses that state that G-d gave the children of Israel the Holy Land. They overlook, unfortunately, those verses which say that He took it away due to our sins. They further ignore those prophecies which explicitly describe the last exile's conclusion as a Divine, not a human process.

The Creator has commanded every Jew to follow the ways of peace and to be loyal to the country where he lives.

Taken from www.nkusa.org

Also see: www.truetorahjews.com

I will have to read the post again, could not see any mention of Jews being in that part of the world since the time of Abraham, they were there in Roman times, 'Judea' = land of the Jews.

That,.... in conjunction with the fact that this ethnic group of genetic carriers still resides within the Promised Land, and that the displaced among them have only suffered the loss of their ancestral land between this current generation and two generations ago. It is present and ongoing, we are not talking about ancient history.

No, as I said, doesn’t mean anything. We can go back and forth on this and I can only repeat myself, genetics don’t make a people. Heritage does. You will always find genetics markers of people long gone if you look for it. Doesn’t mean anything, those people are long gone, the culture, identity, religions, ideas, peculiarities lost to history. Having the right genetics and living in the promised land doesn’t make you Canaanite, Philistian, Phoenician or Jewish for that matter. Heritage does.
You can disagree but that’s my stand on this.

This is not entirely true. Have you spoken frankly with Arabs from many different countries? I do. On average, they tend to cling to their national identities first and foremost, then secondly to their religion, and then only as part of a “greater pan Arabian family” after those two facts. I have experienced many Arabs who tout their nationality above the nationality of other Arabs, and have even seen Muslims Arabs who refuse to give marriage blessings simply because the other Muslim Arab is of a different nationality.

The idea of a singular and cohesive Arabian family is a farce and fallacy.

I didn’t claim arabian people identified themselves first as and foremost. I said they are members of a greater arabian familiy – whether they like it or not.
This actually changed over the last decades btw. Pan arabian nationalism was much stronger fifty years ago, today the lines are primarily drawn between Shia and Sunni. A religious divide, not a national one.
Fact is, the Palestinians regard themselves as Arabs. Generally speaking you can make no distinction between Arabs in Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Iraq or the Westbank.
And this is why your entire argument fails. There is no canaanite heritage of todays Palestinians. All there is are some genetic similarities which are not uncommon at all and don’t constitute anything.

Because you are basically saying that, Jews who convert to Christianity or Islam have negated their “Jewishness”,.... you label them as Arabs without acknowledging their extremely recent Jewish ancestry,... and fail to acknowledge that they are Arabized and are not true Arabs.

I don’t say that at all, don’t know why you would think that. I don’t label them. I take Palestinians for what they themselves belief to be – Arabs. Its not my place to judge. I call a Jew a Jew if he identifies as a part of the Jewish people. I don’t care what they think about God. I’d call a Palestinian an Canaanite, Philistian or whatever if he would believable claim this heritage. They don’t however and they cant. There are no Canaanites anymore, just living there with the ‘right’ genetics doesn’t make you Canaanite. Especially not if you identify as someone else.

I sure as hell don’t care if they are ‘arabized’, just as I don’t care if the Jews are ‘jewized’ or whatever. That’s crazy. YOUR Identity matters, whether or not you came to be because your grand-grand-grandfather raped a woman from a different ethnic group is totally irrelevant. Declaring someone not to be ‘truly arab’ ‘truly jewish’, ‘truly german’, ‘truly russian’, ‘truly italian’ or whatever is presumptuous and insulting IMO. Who are we to judge?

I apologize for going there, I’m sure you know who else had the brilliant idea to… renegotiate peoples rights solely based on genetics? The guys who ended up killing six million Jews. You didn’t have to live and identify as a Jew to die in the extermination camps. Having the wrong ancestors was enough. See the irony?

You of course don’t want the exterminate anyone. You just want to assign historic claims based on genetics. Just don’t. No good will come from it.

a reply to: JimNasium

ahh. thanks for the clarifcation. problem is now they have nowhere to go. God sees that and dont like it but the alternative is worse.

a reply to: mightmight

you can make no distinction between Arabs in Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Iraq or the Westbank.

What an insensitive thing to allege! I guess all “oriental people” are Chinese too? You can not distinguish between them, but I and others sure can!

An “Arab” is actually and simply a person who speaks the Arabic language. Arab speakers all over the world belong to different ethnic groups and cultures. If you take the time to interact with Palestinians, Syrians, Lebanese, or Iraqi People, you will clearly see that they are culturally different. For crying out loud,.... these are the modern progeny of the Canaanites, Assyrians, and Babylonians. You do realize that these are vastly different people with vastly different histories and cultures? They even look different from one another and speak different dialects of Arabic.

Do you think that English speakers around the world constitute a single and unified people and culture? Do you see no differences between the people of the U.S., Australia, Canada, South Africa, Britain, Ireland, Scotland, or even Hong Kong?

Do you feel that the people of the various South American and Central American countries constitute a singular and indistinguishable culture that is synonymous with that of Spain?

Have you ever befriended Syrians, Palestinians, Lebanese, or Iraqis? Have you ever been invited to their houses? My prior work in Islam has given me these many experiences, and I ABSOLUTELY refute your claim that Arabs are an indistinguishable people.

All Arabs are the same?,.... all orientalist are the same?,... all Hispanics are the same?,.... all Africans are the same?,..... yet!,... we accept that Europeans that live in adjacent countries hold different cultures and different social nuances?

because your grand-grand-grandfather raped a woman from a different ethnic group is totally irrelevant.

How demeaning, and what an inane way to generalize an entire people. Rape does occur throughout the world, however, much of the intermixing within the Levant came through willful conversion to Christianity, Islam, Druze, and through intermarriage. There was, of course, instances of rape,... however, this in no way accounts for the genetic legacy of an entire people. Palestinians do not hold Israelite genes through a majority of rape culture,.... many Palestinians were in fact Israelites to begin with.

First, you allege that Arabs are indistinguishable from one another,.... now you conclude that Palestinians share Israelite genetics due to rape culture. Wow.

I sure as hell don’t care if they are ‘arabized’..... That’s crazy.

Declaring someone not to be ‘truly arab’ ‘truly jewish’, ‘truly german’, ‘truly russian’, ‘truly italian’ or whatever is presumptuous and insulting IMO.

You only think that this is “crazy”, “presumptuous”, and “insulting” because you truly “don’t care” to properly educate yourself on the topic. You have come to these nasty conclusions because of your ignorance on the subject.

It is the Islamic World and the Arab World who supports what I have said about true/pure Arabs versus Arabized Arabs. None of this is my invention.

In fact, the most well-known and respected Islamic biography in the world elaborates on this point:

(”Ar-Raheeq Al-Makhtum” (The Sealed Nectar) by Safiur Rahman Mubarakpuri)




Eber is the Patriarch of all Hebrew people (B'nei Eber), for the word "Hebrew" is derived from his name. He had two sons, the first is Peleg, and the second is Joktan.

Joktan had 13 sons. These sons led two major migrations out of Chaldea. Some of the siblings migrated south along the eastern coast Arabia, and then turned westward toward Africa. These migrating children of Joktan went on to become the forefathers of the ancient "Pure Arabs" (Qahtanian Arabs [Qahtan/Joktan]) of Southern Arabia and Yemen, and the Hebrew-Semites of Ethiopia and the Horn of Africa. The other siblings migrated east into Bactria and India.

Abraham had 8 sons named Ishmael, Isaac, Zimran, Jokshan, Medan, Midian, Ishbak, and Shuah.

Ishmael, first-born of Abraham, had 12 sons and went on to become the Patriarch of the Ishmaelite Arabs. The 12 sons of Ishmael settled in northern Arabia and became known as "Arabized Arabs," (Adnanite Arabs [Adnan]) later dominating the entire Arab world. Islam's Prophet Muhammad is said to have been descended from Ishmael, through the Tribe of Quraysh.

Isaac, Abraham's second son, was father to the twins Esau and Jacob (Israel). Esau became the forefather of the Edomites, while Jacob became the Patriarch of the Israelites.

Abraham's 6 remaining sons; Zimran, Jokshan, Medan, Midian, Ishbak, and Shuah, migrated south, and began to settle and integrate with the "Pure-Arabs" and African Hebrew-Semites descended from Joktan. They were later acculturated into the body of “Pure” and “Ismaelite” Arabs.

In conclusion, the Palestinian People have lived in the Levant for centuries and perhaps millennia. They were residing in the Levant prior to and up to the declaration of the State of Israel. These Palestinians are still living in the Levant today, with many being displaced and expelled by force and/or intimidation. The Palestinians are fully native Levantines who have modernly become Arabized, and who continue to be a distinct people.

a reply to: Sahabi

Ishmael was the first born of Abraham,BUT,he was NOT the son of promise.
His birth was the result of Abraham and Sarah taking matters into their own
hands,not waiting for God to fulfill His promise to them.

a reply to: mamabeth

I believe that you are mistaken.

Besides vague mentions of "offspring," the first mention of a promised son to Abraham occurred in Genesis 15:2-5

2 But Abram said, “Sovereign Lord, what can you give me since I remain childless and the one who will inherit my estate is Eliezer of Damascus?” 3 And Abram said, “You have given me no children; so a servant in my household will be my heir.”

4 Then the word of the Lord came to him: “This man will not be your heir, but a son who is your own flesh and blood will be your heir.” 5 He took him outside and said, “Look up at the sky and count the stars—if indeed you can count them.” Then he said to him, “So shall your offspring be.”

God did not mention Sarah nor any woman, He simply told Abraham that " a son who is your own flesh and blood will be your heir."

According to Genesis 17:15-22, Abraham did not receive promise of a son through Sarah until after the birth of Ishmael.



In Genesis 22, we read about the Binding of Isaac. In this event, God tests the faith of Abraham by asking him to do what the followers of Moloch have been known to do; sacrifice his son. Abraham faithfully and dutifully obeys the words of his God. He sets up an altar, gathers firewood, and binds his son. Just as Abraham lifted his hand to sacrifice his son, God interrupts the ordeal, spares the son, and provided a ram to sacrifice instead.



In verses 2, 12, and 16 of Genesis 22, we are given the phrase, "your son, your only son," in reference to Abraham's mock sacrifice. This is very telling, because this phrase can only apply to Abraham's firstborn son Ishmael. The only time that Abraham had an "only son" was prior to the birth of his second son Isaac. Ishmael was the only son, which changed at the birth of Isaac.



In Genesis 21:13, God affirms that Ishmael is Abraham's son. Abraham, himself, also acknowledges Ishmael as his son. God nor Abraham never labelled Ishmael as illegitimate or a bastard.

As many Islamic scholars and lay-Muslims believe, it appears as though Ishmael was the son who was to be sacrificed, not Isaac.




Blessings BEFORE the birth of Isaac

Genesis 15

5 He took him outside and said, “Look up at the sky and count the stars—if indeed you can count them.” Then he said to him, “So shall your offspring be.”

18 On that day the Lord made a covenant with Abram and said, “To your descendants I give this land, from the Wadi of Egypt to the great river, the Euphrates— 19 the land of the Kenites, Kenizzites, Kadmonites, 20 Hittites, Perizzites, Rephaites, 21 Amorites, Canaanites, Girga#es and Jebusites.”

(Ishmael is the offspring and descendent of Abraham)

Genesis 16

9 Then the angel of the Lord told her [Hagar], “Go back to your mistress and submit to her.” 10 The angel added, “I will increase your descendants so much that they will be too numerous to count.”

(Direct blessing for Ishmael)

Genesis 17

When Abram was ninety-nine years old, the Lord appeared to him and said, “I am God Almighty; walk before me faithfully and be blameless. 2 Then I will make my covenant between me and you and will greatly increase your numbers.”

3 Abram fell facedown, and God said to him, 4 “As for me, this is my covenant with you: You will be the father of many nations. 5 No longer will you be called Abram; your name will be Abraham, for I have made you a father of many nations. 6 I will make you very fruitful; I will make nations of you, and kings will come from you. 7 I will establish my covenant as an everlasting covenant between me and you and your descendants after you for the generations to come, to be your God and the God of your descendants after you. 8 The whole land of Canaan, where you now reside as a foreigner, I will give as an everlasting possession to you and your descendants after you; and I will be their God.”

9 Then God said to Abraham, “As for you, you must keep my covenant, you and your descendants after you for the generations to come. 10 This is my covenant with you and your descendants after you, the covenant you are to keep: Every male among you shall be circumcised. 11 You are to undergo circumcision, and it will be the sign of the covenant between me and you. 12 For the generations to come every male among you who is eight days old must be circumcised, including those born in your household or bought with money from a foreigner—those who are not your offspring. 13 Whether born in your household or bought with your money, they must be circumcised. My covenant in your flesh is to be an everlasting covenant. 14 Any uncircumcised male, who has not been circumcised in the flesh, will be cut off from his people; he has broken my covenant.”

(Ishmael is a descendent of Abraham. Ishmael and his descendants have observed the circumcision throughout the centuries through the Arabized-Arabs and Islam)

Blessings for Ishmael

Genesis 21

13 I will make the son of the slave [Ishmael] into a nation also, because he is your offspring.”

18 Lift the boy [Ishmael] up and take him by the hand, for I will make him into a great nation.”

Blessings of the mock-sacrifice

Genesis 22

15 The angel of the Lord called to Abraham from heaven a second time 16 and said, “I swear by myself, declares the Lord, that because you have done this and have not withheld your son, your only son, 17 I will surely bless you and make your descendants as numerous as the stars in the sky and as the sand on the seashore. Your descendants will take possession of the cities of their enemies, 18 and through your offspring all nations on earth will be blessed, because you have obeyed me.”

a reply to: mamabeth

Ishmael, first-born son of Abraham, has been marginalized and bastardized by Judaism and Christendom. A major reasoning is that Ishmael was born "out of wedlock" to Sarah's slave; Hagar.

If we yield to this reasoning, then surely we must apply it to Jacob. If we bastardize and marginalize Ishmael for being the son of a slave/handmaiden, then we must do the same to some of Jacob's children.

Jacob is the father of the 12 Tribes of Israel (Reuben, Simeon, Levi, Judah, Dan, Naphtali, Gad, Asher, Issachar, Zebulun, Joseph, and Benjamin). Jacob took the sisters Leah and Rachel as wives and sired children with them both. He also fathered children with the slaves/handmaidens of his wives. Zilpah, slave of Leah, gave birth to Gad and Asher. Bilhah, slave of Rachel, gave birth to Dan and Naphtali.

If we use the standard reasoning for Ishmael's bastardization, we must similarly bastardize Gad, Asher, Dan, and Naphtali. The 12 Tribes of Israel then become the 8 Tribes of Israel. But we see this isn't so,... why?

Furthermore, in Genesis 16:3 we read that Sarah gave Hagar to Abraham as a wife. Therefore, Hagar's status of slave was elevated to that of wife. Hagar was the second wife of Abraham and Ishmael was his first son.

According to Genesis 16:3, Hagar was indeed Abraham's wife:

"So after Abram had been living in Canaan ten years, Sarai his wife (אֵֽשֶׁת־) took her Egyptian slave Hagar and gave her to her husband to be his wife (לְאִשָּֽׁה׃)."

In the above verse, Strong's Concordance gives word #802 נָשִׁים (ishshah) as the meaning for both words (wife) referring to Sarai and Hagar.

a reply to: mamabeth

What’s further interesting is that the Palestinians are literally the seed of both Isaac and Ishmael. If we use the Bible as a standard, this should mean that the Palestinians are double blessed

Bottom line here is that the land belongs to Israel and Jerusalem is
her capital!
Another video that I like and will share with you all...www.youtube.com...

Here is another interesting article that I just found and thought I would share it.
www.foxnews.com...

This article was posted for interest purposes only!

a reply to: mamabeth

This is a thread about reconciliation and peace. You and others have come to this thread to promote opinions that are NOT based upon the Bible, nor archeology, nor history, nor genetics, nor brotherhood, nor compassion, nor empathy. I have presented points based upon all of these, yet you ignore it in favor of opinion that is not even substantiated by scripture or science.

You can endorse the ethnic cleansing of the Levant all that you want, but that is NOTHING but heartless. I favor mutual and respectful living in the Levant for Jews, Israelis, Palestinians, Muslims, and all others.

Can you please engage me in scripture and/or science? This game of apathetic and unsubstantiated opinion is both a waste of my time and showing the whole world your heartlessness to the suffering of all the people in the Levant.

Israelis and Jews deserve to live in peace with their Palestinian brothers, not egged into a self-perpetuating cycle of violence and suffering.

a reply to: Sahabi


There will be no peace until Yeshua/Jesus returns! From my understanding of
Islam,there will be no peace until Israel is "wiped off the map". I have nothing
more to say on this topic.

I have my core beliefs and will not deviate from them.Political correctness protects
some but not others.

originally posted by: mamabeth
Here is another interesting article that I just found and thought I would share it.
www.foxnews.com...

That article has nothing to do with this thread. Show me one instance in this thread where I have presented falsities or “fake” accounts of scripture, history, or science.

From the article:

”The Jewish people have in fact lived in their land of Israel for more than 3.000 years and took possession of the city of Jerusalem itself almost exactly 3,000 years ago.”

I agree with this fact. However,.... we must also acknowledge the facts:

(1) The ancestors of the Palestinians were the ones who were attacked and displaced by Joshua and the Hebrew Israelites.

(2) These ancestors of the Palestinians continued to live in the Kingdoms of Israel and Judah due to the fact that the Hebrew Israelites fell short of the absolute genocide that YHWH commanded.

(3) The ancestors of the Palestinians continued to live in the Levant during and after the Babylonian Captivity and Assyrian Exile.

(4) The Palestinians were residing in Mandatory Palestine before the great aliyot and declaration of the State of Israel.

(5) The Palestinians continue to inhabit the Levant today.

(6) Many Palestinians have been confirmed to be the direct offspring of Hebrew Israelite Jews.



YOU are among those who are perpetuating a false narrative of the Promised Land.

Israelis and Jews should not leave the Levant, and neither should the Palestinians: they are brethren.