How the world changed after 9/11

Hello fellow ATS journeyers,

We all know about how 9/11 functioned to erode individual privacy and civil liberties (read Philip D. Zelikow's writings pre-9/11 to see how this was done, by design) and to prop up and accelerate the development of the whole security-intelligence apparatus, while serving as a pretext to a near perpetual "war on terror", the results of which the world still experiences to this day 16 going on 17 years, later.

We all know that the whole policy has been, overall, an abysmal failure, and that the response to the 9/11 event in the form of "pre-emptive" war represented a barbaric act of aggression in violation of international laws and norms. For most of us with a certain level of awareness and understanding, these things are plainly obvious.

Of course some might beg to differ simply because such a view might offend their rah rah pro-American "patriotic" sensibilities or because they are in so much denial that they are prepared to go to any lengths, even at the expense of a commitment to truth and reality itself, to support and uphold and defend the official story. Nevertheless, I think that there's something that we can ALL agree on, so please bear with me even if you disagree with my opening assessment.

The post-9/11 world just isn't the same as it used to be.

That's what I'd like to discuss and explore in this thread, no matter what your views are about the event or what ensued in its wake.

And here I'm not simply referring to outward things involving policy or the use of violence and military force, or the neccessity of being gropped by power-tripping cop-faced TSA agents at the airport.

There is something much much deeper and more systemic to it than that. I feel that it's a qualitative shift in perceptual awareness regarding the very nature of the world itself and our own place within it.

This contention seems absurd on the face of it, since "all" we're talking about is a bad and murderous event involving the destruction of a couple of skyscrapers, the attack on the Pentagon and the loss of 3000 lives. As terrible as that is, it shouldn't have altered the quintessential experience and perceptual awareness of being alive, but it did.

Let me try to explain as hard as this is to put one's finger on it..

Perhaps the best way to present this idea, this.. impression, is to point to the qualitative difference in what might be called the "ambiance" of the world as seen in movies and films pre, and post-911.

It can't be just me and neighter can it simply be attributed to changes in production quality after 2001, but the whole scene and setting and "vibe" of the world as seen in films before and after 9/11 has a distinct, but hard to describe quintessential and qualitative difference.

It is this difference, this distinction, that I'd like to draw your attention to and to discuss and explore, because it's my belief and understanding that in becoming present to the nature of the distiction, whatever essential thing it was that was lost, can be reaccessed and recovered.

Whenever i watch a movie, I can tell right away if it was made pre or post 9/11. It's something in the light, in the sky and the world as seen through the camera lens, and pre-9/11, it has a certain poignant innocence or something to it as a felt experience. Post 9/11, and it's just not there.

Does anyone know what I'm talking about and pointing to?

Some old lady was interviewed a year after 9/11 (I can't remember the source now) and asked for her take on things and she said that something in the air was just different, and by that she wasn't referring to a chance in air quality near GZ.

For me it's something in the light of the world as seen and witnessed by the mind's eye.

Something just went bad and a certain quality in the light shifted and changed aterwards and it's never been the same since.

We've all lost something important I firmly believe, and while just a catchy campaign slogan, I think that Trump's "Make America Great Again" is an attempt to capture the idea, that longing for a pre-NWO (satanic) world system, of which 9/11 could be thought of as the inauguration of the beast system where future history is founded on what I would describe as a black magic play.

I believe it failed, but that where it succeeded was to rob us all the whole world over of a quinessetial je ne sais quoi, which contains within it a fuller expression of both a rich joy and a heartfelt poignant melancholy, that's the best way that I can describe it, the lost innocence of the pre 9/11 world.

Maybe it was a big lie that everyone was forced to go along with, that's taken the magic out of the light of day... just say'n.

Perhaps by having a more informed historical context based and founded in the truth, no matter how difficult to reconcile with or how painful to be forced to imagine, that very same beast can be chained up in double binds and tossed headlong into the abyss which means oblivion, simply because it's just not worthy of the 21st century human being.

I think that it might have set modern society and civilization up for a fall, not outwardly, but inwardly, where it counts.

I fear for the facebook kids of today for whom 9/11 is something that they might not even remember.

If you'd lived through the late 70's, 80's and 90's as I have and as many of us have, then you would know precisely what I'm talking about, so for you i point to pre and post 9/11 film and movie making.

The whole thing's out of contro and up in the air now, with the abysmal failure, and it looks like Donald Trump isn't going to be able to put humpy dumpty back together again, whether you support him or not.

The satanists are just waiting in the wings to reboard the ship.

I think it first shifted when they shot JFK in the head before the watching world, and then their evil and wicked tree was firmly planted in the 9/11 event, or was it?

Memory, heart, soul, aliveness, honesty, kindness, love... the light of life is still lit, even if for a time the world has gone dim.

Keep it alive and make it burn brightly, and let us not all lose all the things and the feelings that gave us fond memories and, however naive or innocent, gave us joy even joy in the pursuit of the American dream.

I think that the American people and the world have really taken a beating these last 17 years, and that we've all been victims of a great abuse of power in service to the devil.

Enough's enough! We've seen and heard enough and we have all the data and the "fruits" of that "enterprise" which really does amount to a vast conspiracy that JFK warned about and that he was determined to fight on behalf of the American people.

We must all operate as watchtowers and lighthouses, standing right on the very shoals of destruction for the sake of truth and life and everything that's worthwhile.

Did Jesus not place the original double bind upon them by their own hand, and has history not repeated itself?

In loving memory of the victims of 9/11 which also includes us all, once again it could be said that it was the stone that was rejected by the "builders" that became the keystone. That stone is the little man, and the fount of Liberty and the pursuit of an authentic happiness.

It has something to do with authenticity and being true to one's heart.

Not an easy thing to do in a dark and ignorant world, to be that light in the darkness and to keep the flame alive.

a reply to: AnkhMorpork

Definitely food for thought.

Religiousity aside, part of me has to question other worldly influence.

You mentioned JFK. He sought information about e.t.i. and our first explorations of space and the Moon around his presidency.

There are certain people, one of whom in particular, a past President, who probably not only know, but played a significant role in all of this.

I think it all ties in.

a reply to: CreationBro

I agree. As crazy as it may sound, there've been bad aliens in the mix in there somewhere I wish they'd just f'off.

Putting religiousity back on the table, I like to think that there's higher powers still all the way up, maybe even to the point that it or He could mess with their gateway access points, so I say open the gates and let them all rush home even if it's not to ticker tape parades and hats in the air. Barring that, they could take a plunge into the sun and be done with it in a final act of suicide, but I think they should be allowed to return to their home world, unless they already left that behind their "estate" (it's in the Bible), long long ago, and have quite literally nothing left to do but to watch and bother us.

Some of them are lying little bastards I think, and some might be all intellect with no soul.

Some might even be jealous of us for reasons that we can't even imagine.

They have to be bound also.

"What is loosed on earth is loosed in heaven, but what is bound on earth, is bound in heaven also."

How's that for a vertical and horizontal distinction?

P.S. If some are sentinels observing and monitoring the Oort Cloud to watch out for us, they can stay if that's part of their job and duty. Ha heh.

I think the whole point of the OP is that it is STILL "a world waiting to be born", with or without alien involvement, preferably without it, so that God's love will lead the way, and in the process maybe even teach the aliens a thing or to about the nature of Civility, defined as:

Consciously motivated organization behavior that is ETHICAL in willing submission to a higher power. (taken from "Civility, A World Waiting to be Born" by M. Scott Peck, MD.)

You may, or may not agree with what is said in this OP, but I defy anyone to say that it is not thoughtful and well written. It is a feeling many of the pre-milenials will no doubt recognise that is being highlighted, and the thought that something of that pre-911 light could be regained is a good and worthy one.

If It was within my gift to award a round of applause I would gladly do it.

Ah yes - the social media generation: I'm aghast at the prevalence of 9/11 jokes and some individuals who trivialise the day and say get over it. Or say - terrorism has killed thousands pre/911 and the west didn't care. I know that if those people actually watched the events they wouldnt be so blase... unless they are truly misanthrope. When you watch any one person die before your eyes in a senseless act, it is impressed on your psyche forever.

And regarding the feelings pre 9/11 watching videos - I understand that, I experience it often. I see certain technologies or fashions and I say to myself , ah this is before 9/11, I remember *insert fad insert conflict insert political news*

There is a sense of change in the air. It feels more doomed. Though we may rise up and say the terrorists haven't won, we aren't afraid, I think subconsciously we are to some degree. I admit I am more afraid of things now than I was in 2001 (and I had different things that I was afraid of back then, with death threats and abuse from a family member), mostly its because I am now a parent and I feel more worried for his future. Although, funnily enough I grew up at the tail end of the cold war, and though I was concerned at my tender age about nuclear war, I guess I was less afraid in some ignorant bliss. Maybe that's the same thing going on for the kids born late 90s onwards?

I think the "known unknowns" and the lack of trust many of us have of successive western governments post 9/11 also contributes to this feeling.

a reply to: AnkhMorpork

Thanks for sharing your ideas AM.

Everything feels weird, in this place.
For so many of us, the 9/11 events changed our perspective.

Can't put a finger on it neither.

a reply to: AnkhMorpork

This contention seems absurd on the face of it, since "all" we're talking about is a bad and murderous event involving the destruction of a couple of skyscrapers, the attack on the Pentagon and the loss of 3000 lives. As terrible as that is, it shouldn't have altered the quintessential experience and perceptual awareness of being alive, but it did.

Little thanks to the media. Instead of downplaying and asking everyone to remain calm, they couldn't wait to place George in the smoking rubble, declaring war with a bullhorn.

"The people that knocked down these buildings will hear all of us, soon." We've been at endless war ever since.

a reply to: AnkhMorpork
How the world changed after 9/11?

B I G B R O T H E R and everything else is excused with the "war against the terror".

Terror that seems to be at least allowed, if not worse, by "our protectors". You know, those that want to save our liberal western lifestyle with destroying our liberal western lifestyle, of course for a "good thing", in the "war against the terror", terror that could destroy our liberal western lifestyle...

"Our protectors", that need that terror, to have an excuse for the steady growth of "democratic, liberal and freedom loving" police- and surveillance states. Would "our protectors" really fight terrorism, they would shoot themselves in the feet! Because, no steady terror fear of the people and some people could maybe ask why all that surveillance needs to be!

And how good that all that surveillance- and secret service(some of "our protectors") stuff has failures(just flops, failures and fumbles, everytime) exactly every time another terror act is needed, because the people are not scared enough anymore. Or to deflect from something else!

You need to know the world before and after 9/11, to see what really changed, what mess around the world was created! To realize what freedom was, before 9/11! And who profits from 9/11, since 9/11!
Little hint: It´s not the people!!!

originally posted by: Nothin
Everything feels weird, in this place.
For so many of us, the 9/11 events changed our perspective.

9/11 was nearly two decades ago. Clearly things change, as do fashions and technology. People's realisation of change is just that; realisation. I do not chime with some of what the OP says because I accept that things change and evolve. You can data a film/movie by the fashion - flares in the 70's, shiny suits in the 80's and so on. Over the last 20 years I think films have become darker in tone as technology and filming techniques have evolved. But that's saying nothing of any note.

Those of us who are not American and therefore don't care about 9/11 (in the way Americans do/should do) would probably be more focussed on the turn of the Millennium as a baseline for the "before" and the "after".

As to 9/11 being the start of the great repression of our freedoms. Well, what freedoms have we (in general) across the developed world lost? We've changed into a society that seems to be a slave to social media rather than anything else.

I think 9-11 was a poorly played out scenario,they went overboard with all the props,and all the accusations,when anyone in the construction or demolition industry,this building was a text book drop,the fake planes and storys of building and steel structure being burned by diesel fuel,if that were so diesel engines would be a melted mess,nothing added up,but I was sent to see a psychiatrist because I didn't believe media story,shows the govt does not have peoples interests in mind,they could care less

Psychopaths have been rising to positions of power for a long time. As the 9/11 official story has crumbled in corruption it does present a disturbing representation of how divorced from reality the western political system has become.

There maybe times where we have to kill, but when we cannot even be honest about such acts what are we really fighting for?

The example this has set for the community is an apathetic culture that is all about me. Lets kill, bomb and destroy, as long at it ain't me who cares, ha ha. It seams like the whole community is suffering a dissociative disorder at times. It is easier to turn a blind eye than confront an injustice.

originally posted by: Oldtimer2
I think 9-11 was a poorly played out scenario,they went overboard with all the props,and all the accusations,when anyone in the construction or demolition industry,this building was a text book drop,the fake planes and storys of building and steel structure being burned by diesel fuel,if that were so diesel engines would be a melted mess,nothing added up,but I was sent to see a psychiatrist because I didn't believe media story,shows the govt does not have peoples interests in mind,they could care less

What exactly have diesel engines and diesel fuel got to do with 9/11....?

I think you might need to go back and see your shrink (no offence).

MR

a reply to: Marlborough Red

the diesal fuel on the 50th floor from the plane, got lit, so there was a fire. this fire immedietly melted the steel beams of that floor, as diesal fuel gets 1000x hotter than a regular fire.

This caused that floor to collapse to the next, causing the next floor to give into the weight, and the next, and the next, and the next. Basically at the rate of a free fall motion as those steel beams have no give. Can hardly hold up anything


Sometimes truth is stranger than fiction, and you got to be a warrior or get sent to the psychiatrist.


see that free fall

Those steel beams have no give, like i said.
Basically add a portion of more weight and they disinigrate into dust.

originally posted by: makalit
a reply to: Marlborough Red

the diesal fuel on the 50th floor from the plane, got lit, so there was a fire. this fire immedietly melted the steel beams of that floor, as diesal fuel gets 1000x hotter than a regular fire.

This caused that floor to collapse to the next, causing the next floor to give into the weight, and the next, and the next, and the next. Basically at the rate of a free fall motion as those steel beams have no give. Can hardly hold up anything


Sometimes truth is stranger than fiction, and you got to be a warrior or get sent to the psychiatrist.

Diesel fuel, from the plane on the 50th floor immediately melting steel beams in a fire “1000x hotter than a regular fire”.

Seriously.....?

You need to go see a shrink too!

MR

Dick Cheney stole all the in fun the world.
It's pretty simple really.

originally posted by: paraphi

Those of us who are not American and therefore don't care about 9/11 (in the way Americans do/should do) would probably be more focussed on the turn of the Millennium as a baseline for the "before" and the "after".

It wasn't just Americans effected by 9/11

What changed for those of us in 'western' type cultures was our sense of relative security. Post 11/9/01 we started to feel more exposed after it was shown dramatically that our 'safe havens' were not really safe any more and that's been continuously demonstrated ever since keeping us on edge.

originally posted by: Pilgrum
What changed for those of us in 'western' type cultures was our sense of relative security. Post 11/9/01 we started to feel more exposed after it was shown dramatically that our 'safe havens' were not really safe any more and that's been continuously demonstrated ever since keeping us on edge.

That and the real fact that the event coincided with the true connection of everything with the expansion of the Internet at the very same time the curtain was removed and all could see the Wizard pulling the handles of control when Bush lied to get the US into Iraq. Since that time, very few believe in the Government narative or the MSM that pumps that narative. Since not much good has happened since 9/11 coupled with government failures such as the response to Katrina, the Great Recession of 2008, etc. my sense of things is that Americans have lost faith in the future. Rather than living meaninful lives, people merely "exist" all the while waiting for the next shoe to drop.

Since the election of Obama, the nation has been rent asunder by Identity Politics and the result of that has been that every election has become one of fear and loathing that one side or the other will gain sufficient control necessary to quash liberties and freedoms of the opposing side. This has darkened the pall of imminent doom such that no one feels terribly certain about how things will play out going forward.

As long as that is the case, there is no going forward. What we suffer from is a malaise of constant doubt and foreboding.

a reply to: AnkhMorpork

Seems to be typical conspiracy type paranoia ...

Prior to 2001 most media people and bureaucrats were not focused on Islamic terrorism

This is despite having bombed WTC complex already in 1993

After all why should we worry about some bearded freak in Afghanistan ??

If had read any of the reports circulating then, a terrorist was some survivalist/militia member. Think Tim Mcvey .....

Were expecting some guys out of Deliverance to show up with fertilizer truck bomb

Case of underestimating your opponent Similar thing happened prior to Pearl Harbor when most American
opinion (and government officials) of the Japanese was bunch of 4 eye, buck tooth monkeys....

Underestimating your opponent is often fatal

Same thing occurred after Obama was elected - all references to Islamic terrorism were scrubbed from reports
and training scenes

It was back to NRA members being threats

One report stated way to identify terrorist was look for bumper stickers ! If had NRA, anti abortion, anti government
(Gadsden flag) on car were a terrorist !

Declaring your political opposition as terrorists is a recipe for disaster

Need to chuck the personal opinions conspiracy fantasy and rely on hard provable facts instead

Just my 2 cent

Just my opinion.

The world, people, society, morals...have all gone to $hit since 9/11.

And the downward spiral continues.......