Age of solar system on the premises of the Bible

a reply to: ignorant_ape

please persaude the xian wingnuts

Ha ha you atheists have this habbit of showing off your adolescent
intelligence with ad-hominems right from the gate. " The stars of
Heaven" proclaim a Gods handiwork pal. There are no two ways about
that. For a little more read my sig.

originally posted by: spy66
a reply to: bobsa

Science is the proof that makes genesis chapter 1 make sense.

It should also be mentioned that it was a Catholic priest that put forth the Big Bang Theory ==> en.wikipedia.org...

a reply to: whereislogic

It's just such a strange psychological impulse that makes people believe in liars over those telling the truth.

People believe the Greeks and Romans over the Hebrews.

People believe the media over the whistle blowers.

People believe individuals commit suicide after they scream out before "I am receiving threats and I will not kill myself!"

When individuals come out to say they are undergoing strange abductions, nobody believes them.

Yet individuals write in the past "This individual was miraculously born of a virgin" and everybody believes it!

The family and close friends of this individual speaks out "He was not born of a virgin!" But people reject them and still believe against their testimony "He was born of a virgin."

There is something more to it than just mind control. There is something strange about the psychology in people that makes them believe in what is false. This impulse is so real that even if Christ came back and told them, "I did not turn water into wine," nobody would believe him!

a reply to: AlienVessel

Did you just stumble into this thread half crocked?. And
by the time you hit the reply button completely forgot
the topic?

originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: AlienVessel

Did you just stumble into this thread half crocked?. And
by the time you hit the reply button completely forgot
the topic?

No.

a reply to: Seede
Well, if you like some of the more simple and easy to understand discoveries that Newton made from his studies and experiments and shared with the world (or just his close friends because of the religious climate he was in), I've got an excellent blog for you:

Isaac Newton's Search for God
A snippet:

Perhaps the best summary of Isaac Newton’s Scriptural arguments for his repudiation of the Trinity is found in fourteen ‘Argumenta,’ written in Latin, giving Bible citations for many of them. Numbers four to seven are particularly interesting:

“4. Because God begot the Son at some time, he had not existence from eternity. Proverbs 8:23, 25.

5. Because the Father is greater than the Son. John 14:28.

6. Because the Son did not know his last hour. Mark 13:32, Matt. 24:36, Rev. 1:1, 5:3.

7. Because the Son received all things from the Father.”

A perusal of Newton’s religious writings cannot fail to impress the reader with their thoroughness, and a realization of his long and deep meditation, his scholarly ability and grasp of the original Bible languages. His conclusions regarding the Trinity therefore merit our respect and consideration, even though he did not feel constrained to make them public during his lifetime.

Today, when much more evidence is available than Newton had access to, we too should make investigation of our beliefs as he did, always seeking to reason first on the evidence of God’s Word. This will build in us a strong faith fully in harmony with the teaching of original Christianity.

Here are some snippets from a documentary about Newton that will avoid mentioning any of the points Newton made above as they paint him as someone who "denies the Deity of Christ" and "reads himself into heresy" (that paintjob I cut from the documentary though, too propagandistic for my taste, as most of that documentary is, even painting the God of the gaps-straw man argument on him, which I also cut from the video and making a few changes to give a different impression that shows how he really reasoned about it, keywords such as "calculating" and "Design(er), science"; the original documentary also tries to paint him as a doomsayer or false prophet with a love for the occult, something that is also done to a certain other group of people with the same or almost the same views as Newton; I cut that part also which covers almost half an hour of the original documentary because that's the part that increases viewer ratings, which saying anything too negative and truthful+useful* about the doctrine of the Trinity won't do with so many potential Trinitarian viewers, that would not 'tickle their ears', see 2 Timothy 4:3,4, "they wil not put up with" it). *: or "wholesome, beneficial teaching" (quoting 2 Timothy 4:3,4).

Here's another person (genius? capable person?) who understands the meaning of the phrase "to have their ears tickled" at 2 Timothy 4:3,4, at 5:00:

Danny Kaye | Dec. 13, 1970 (Herald-Journal)

During “Two by Two,” the rangy star indulges in strenuous portrayal shifts, as Jehovah of the Old Testament shuttles Noah’s age from 602 to 900 and back again. He also participates in a half dozen songs.

In a way, it's a little unfair to Satan to hog all the best ones , Satan still got the numbers though, but I prefer quality over quantity anyway:

a reply to: whereislogic
Just out of time to edit in the phrase "The truth is out there" to avoid giving the wrong impression about some of the videos I shared as if implying something else than merely that phrase. The 'hogging'-joke may leave the wrong impression concerning Danny Kaye and Bob Marley, not to be taken too literal but with a grain of salt and a wink. When I made the hogging joke I was actually more thinking about the likes of Isaac Newton and Michael Sevetus (the latter having made equally significant discoveries and breakthroughs in medicine, biology and theology as Isaac Newton as well as near equal levels of education, knowledge and intellect, but much less known, or less of a reputation for that; even debunking the same Pagan Greek philosophers such as Aristotle and his fans, who were, if you count Plato as well for a moment, also involved with evolutionary philosophies and the doctrine of the Trinity, or had an influence on those).
There are some caveats I have with the video below (based on doctrines within Unitarianism) which is why I don't share it that often, but it's doable regarding the point I just made:

Michael Servetus—A Solitary Quest for the Truth: Awake!—2006

Here are 3 more diligent students of the bible and highly educated men, making scientific/knowledgeable discoveries (one of 'm is from my country):

Three 16th-Century Truth Seekers—What Did They Find?

A little something for the thread:

The Scriptures, in stating, “In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth” (Ge 1:1), leave matters indefinite as to time. This use of the term “beginning” is therefore unassailable, regardless of the age scientists may seek to attach to the earthly globe and to the various planets and other heavenly bodies. The actual time of creation of the material heavens and earth may have been billions of years ago.

Source: Creation: Insight, Volume 1

Details:

Science and the Genesis Account: Was Life Created?

Many people claim that science disproves the Bible’s account of creation. However, the real contradiction is, not between science and the Bible, but between science and the opinions of Christian Fundamentalists. Some of these groups falsely assert that according to the Bible, all physical creation was produced in six 24-hour days approximately 10,000 years ago.

The Bible, however, does not support such a conclusion. If it did, then many scientific discoveries over the past one hundred years would indeed discredit the Bible. A careful study of the Bible text reveals no conflict with established scientific facts. For that reason, Jehovah’s Witnesses disagree with Christian Fundamentalists and many creationists. The following shows what the Bible really teaches.

Genesis does not teach that the earth and the universe were created in six 24-hour days just a few thousand years ago

When Was “the Beginning”?

The Genesis account opens with the simple, powerful statement: “In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.” (Genesis 1:1) A number of Bible scholars agree that this statement describes an action separate from the creative days recounted from verse 3 onward. The implication is profound. According to the Bible’s opening words, the universe, including our planet, Earth, was in existence for an indefinite time before the creative days began.

Geologists estimate that the earth is 4 billion years old, and astronomers calculate that the universe may be as much as 15 billion years old. Do these findings—or their potential future refinements—contradict Genesis 1:1? No. The Bible does not specify the actual age of “the heavens and the earth.” Science is not at odds with the Biblical text.

How Long Were the Creative Days?

What about the length of the creative days? Were they literally 24 hours long? Some claim that because Moses—the writer of Genesis—later referred to the day that followed the six creative days as a model for the weekly Sabbath, each of the creative days must be literally 24 hours long. (Exodus 20:11) Does the wording of Genesis support this conclusion?

No, it does not. The fact is that the Hebrew word translated “day” can mean various lengths of time, not just a 24-hour period. For example, when summarizing God’s creative work, Moses refers to all six creative days as one day. (Genesis 2:4) In addition, on the first creative day, “God began calling the light Day, but the darkness he called Night.” (Genesis 1:5) Here, only a portion of a 24-hour period is defined by the term “day.” Certainly, there is no basis in Scripture for arbitrarily stating that each creative day was 24 hours long.

How long, then, were the creative days? The Bible does not say; however, the wording of Genesis chapters 1 and 2 indicates that considerable lengths of time were involved.

Six Creative Periods

Moses wrote his account in Hebrew, and he wrote it from the perspective of a person standing on the surface of the earth. These two facts combined with the knowledge that the universe existed before the beginning of the creative periods, or days, help to defuse much of the controversy surrounding the creation account. How so?

A careful consideration of the Genesis account reveals that events starting during one “day” continued into one or more of the following “days.” For example, before the first creative “day” started, light from the already existing sun was somehow prevented from reaching the earth’s surface, possibly by thick clouds. (Job 38:9) During the first “day,” this barrier began to clear, allowing diffused light to penetrate the atmosphere.* [In the description of what happened on the first “day,” the Hebrew word used for light is ’ohr, light in a general sense, but concerning the fourth “day,” the word used is ma·’ohrʹ, which refers to the source of light.]

On the second “day,” the atmosphere evidently continued to clear, creating a space between the thick clouds above and the ocean below. On the fourth “day,” the atmosphere gradually cleared to such an extent that the sun and the moon were made to appear “in the expanse of the heavens.” (Genesis 1:14-16) In other words, from the perspective of a person on earth, the sun and moon began to be discernible. These events happened gradually.

The Genesis account also relates that as the atmosphere continued to clear, flying creatures—including insects and membrane-winged creatures—started to appear on the fifth “day.”

The Bible’s narrative allows for the possibility that some major events during each day, or creative period, occurred gradually rather than instantly, perhaps some of them even lasting into the following creative days.* [For example, during the sixth creative day, God decreed that humans “become many and fill the earth.” (Genesis 1:28, 31) Yet, this event did not even begin to occur until the following “day.”—Genesis 2:2.]

According to Their Kinds
...

I'll spare everyone the rest because it's probably already too long anyway. There's more evidence discussed there though, and even more here:

The Untold Story of Creation
Earth: Insight, Volume 1

a reply to: whereislogic
One more thing about the videos and the people in them though (Isaac Newton uses the pseudonym Iehova Sanctus Unus, it was in the documentary but they messed up the translation to "God ...." instead of "Jehovah ..."):

Exodus 9:16

16 But for this very reason I have kept you in existence: to show you my power and to have my name declared in all the earth.

JW ARCHIVES DIVINE NAME JHWH YHWH JEHOVAH JAH NWT NIV COMPARE.

It's still a funny notion how many people talked to Michael Jackson at their doors without recognizing him (being in disguise as not to distract from Jehovah's message and in all humility; and the more obvious practical reasons):

In case the message in his songs isn't getting through, this song fits well with the Earth Song:

This one fits well with "They Don't Really Care About Us" (which in turn fits well with Bob Marley's song "Babylon System"):

And these 3 fit well with "Heal the World":


Song 21 Happy, the Merciful! vocals

Oh btw, the video I shared earlier about Michael Servetus for which I said I had some caveats...I have no caveats with that video, I was confused with another one.

a reply to: whereislogic

There wasn't a J

a reply to: whereislogic


My personal opinion is that Moses was not standing on earth when he was writing about what he saw.

I think Moses visualized the event in first person view within in he's mind. It is with your mind you get visions.


I also dont think verse 1 in genesis chapter one is correctly interpreted either. The reason for that is what is describes in verse 2 and verse 8 in genesis chapter 1. If heaven and earth were created in verse 1. Moses should have been able to see it, and heaven (the firmament) should have been created. But it is not. That is confirmed through verse 3 to 8.

a reply to: Akragon
Try a bit Bob Marley.

a reply to: whereislogic

Ya mon... dar was no J