Social dysfunction

mm, keto is good, maybe you need to eat more fat. Try eating butter and cream, your sensitivity will go down real quick. Fewer veggies and more fat, good bacon.
I have a few veggie only friends and they are hypersensitive, that's what comes to mind. Most vegetarians stay well away from fat, head more in the direction of sugars. a reply to: Bluesma

originally posted by: ancientthunder
mm, keto is good, maybe you need to eat more fat. Try eating butter and cream, your sensitivity will go down real quick. Fewer veggies and more fat, good bacon.
I have a few veggie only friends and they are hypersensitive, that's what comes to mind. Most vegetarians stay well away from fat, head more in the direction of sugars. a reply to: Bluesma

Actually, I would make a similar correlation with some vegetarians I know. But I kinda think that is why they are vegetarians though? Because they get very concerned about killing animals.....

I put butter and coconut oil in my coffee, eat so much fat! I am eating a bowl of mascarpone right now. But I will say that I find a big difference when I eat this way. I went off for a while and just went back lately.
My mind is so much clearer, that has actually become my main reason for sticking to this diet. It does have an impact on my social behavior, because my thinking is clearer. I hadn't considered that. Glad you brought it up - another reason to stick with it!!

a reply to: Bluesma

I'm the same way. And when it's all over, I agonize over every word, worrying if I came off wrong or rude or stupid. My hubby tries to tell me it's not so bad, that Im my own worst critic. I dunno. It's so exhausting I just end up avoiding people.

It hasn't always been this way, which is what's so strange to me. It's come on in like the last five years. I used to do a lot of public speaking and talk to strangers all the time. Now I just hide out.

originally posted by: kosmicjack
a reply to: Bluesma

I'm the same way. And when it's all over, I agonize over every word, worrying if I came off wrong or rude or stupid. My hubby tries to tell me it's not so bad, that Im my own worst critic. I dunno. It's so exhausting I just end up avoiding people.

It hasn't always been this way, which is what's so strange to me. It's come on in like the last five years. I used to do a lot of public speaking and talk to strangers all the time. Now I just hide out.

I do that too. Even when my husband will say I was fine, I always become convinced afterwards that I was a catastrophy.

I actually don't know if I have always been like this - I tend to think it developed when I came to France, then just got worse and worse. But maybe I was just as socially innappropriate before that, but just not consciously aware of it!

You may be still mega low on fats, just a guess mind you. It's a weird reality, mixing total compassion whilst being true to your humans self. It boils down to compassion for everybody including yourself. I'm finding that with keto, I've turned more to the element fire and have dropped the excessive sensitivity. Loving the experience reply to Bluesma

a reply to: Bluesma

Geezus! I am interested in others, I care about others, I like to be with and laugh with others...

This is the image you want to portray, however........

I walk away thinking, dammit! Why didn't I ask them this or that... about their family/work/vacation.....why couldn't I remember their name? Or that of their spouse? They tend to think I just am a space cadet because I stuttered and watched them like an owl, or worse, that I am arrogant and uninterested in others.

Maybe you have heard that it is right and good to be interested in others.
Are you really interested in others or do you just want to influence them?

It's awesome when you're in nature and one with everything, but not great for making friends and influencing others.

Is making friends about influencing?

originally posted by: Itisnowagain

Maybe you have heard that it is right and good to be interested in others.
Are you really interested in others or do you just want to influence them?

Yes, I am interested in others. I learn something from everyone I meet. Seriously.
What I feel bad about is that while I benefit a bit from every meeting, I am influenced or impacted in some way, it is not a true exchange if I am not offering something back.
So, in answer to your question, yes, I am really interested in others, and yes, I would like to offer something back for others to find interest in. Even if it is only the knowledge that they influenced me. I think it is sad to imagine how many people think they had no impact upon me, when they might have had a huge impact...but it happened inside me, or over time.

Is making friends about influencing?

Uh, yeah... of course! Getting to know someone is having an awareness of them enter your consciousness, and the better you know them the deeper that awareness goes. This is why I often find myself in the strange position of feeling someone is a friend, while they don't. I have soaked up all kinds of awareness and knowledge of them, I develop an appreciation for certain qualities they have, maybe even affection, while they still feel I am just an aquaintance they don't know very well because I either didn't say a thing, or shut down further sharing by declaring myself not worth knowing.

It is, in a way, sort of stingy - not sharing the positive aspects of my individual personality with others, while I reep up those of everyone else.






Well, you know what it is like to do that, don't you?

originally posted by: ancientthunder
You may be still mega low on fats, just a guess mind you. It's a weird reality, mixing total compassion whilst being true to your humans self. It boils down to compassion for everybody including yourself. I'm finding that with keto, I've turned more to the element fire and have dropped the excessive sensitivity. Loving the experience reply to Bluesma

I gotta say I find the same thing. I haven't been back in ketosis long, but I am finding myself facing and attacking all kinds of projects, actions, and issues I have been passively neglecting. Hence the rant on this behaviorism. When I start to talk about it, it signals a desire to make changes.

This week I tore down a rotting wall in my bathroom and am obligated to renovate the whole room, called up some old friends I have lost touch with and got together with them (more planned this weekend), made a super neat gift package of art supplies to send to my grandaughter, actually started considering a job opportunity still standing for me that I've been ignoring because of lack of confidence. Being more active, aggressive and projective is definately something I am experiencing right now, and it might be linked to the diet.

a reply to: Bluesma

They tend to think I just am a space cadet because I stuttered and watched them like an owl, or worse, that I am arrogant and uninterested in others.

Does it matter what others think of you?
Are you sure that is what they think?
Are you afraid of coming across arrogant and uninterested? If so - why?

originally posted by: Itisnowagain
a reply to: Bluesma
Does it matter what others think of you?

It does.
-In terms of their feelings and emotions, feeling someone is uninterested in you is lonely and uncomfortable.
It is an undesirable feeling for many people. I would like to provoke positive, pleasurable feelings in other people.

-It also matters in very down to earth terms. Relationships are important to mental and physical well being.
They are part of our needs for survival as human beings. This is undeniably proven already.

- In all aspects of living, relationship and networking is an important part of cooperation and creation. Even besides the personal aspect of friendships, think about work- in many types of work, nurturing positive relationships with others is essential. In the modern world, many people having a negative image of you can result in losing your financial means for survival.

Are you sure that is what they think?

Not always, no. But I have had enough people confirm to me verbally that that was their first impression. Most of the people who identify themselves as my friend now have said to me that they radically misinterpretted who I was and how I was, because of this behavior. They also give me feedback (as I described earlier in this thread) on the impression others received of me, when they are observers as a third person. They sometimes are privy to other peoples comments about me when I am not around, and can help me understand what kind of image they have formed of me.

Are you afraid of coming across arrogant and uninterested? If so - why?

Most of that is answered in my first response above. That doesn't make people feel very good.
It is detrimental to forming alliances and relationships in all areas of life.
It is also simply a false impression of what I feel inside - and since I am interested in others, I would like them to want to be around me, so I can continue to experience them.

a reply to: Itisnowagain

Let me be more precise on something-

One reason I fail to ask people I run into details about their lives is because I am afraid of being indiscrete and intrusive- I am not sure what they feel comfortable with exposing to me.

The reason I wish I could be less concerned on that is because

when you bring up things like the names of their family members, knowledge of events that have happened to them or those family members,
they become aware you thought about them and kept in memory things they exposed to you last time you met.
They gain awareness that they had an impact, of influence, upon you.


Oftentimes, this is true, but my lack of expressing it verbally leaves them unaware of that.
It is all good and great to love and think of people.... but in the end it doesn't really have much worth if that isn't expressed somehow in word or act for them to become aware of it.

Otherwise that love and appreciation is just sort of for ones personal pleasure in feeling good.
It's like being a hoarder.

But I also end up thinking more about people when they are not around- when they are in front of me, there's that total reception thing going on, with no thought.

It's like when I come here- I am alone, I stop being active and I think and write about things.
But when I am in action, you can bet I am not thinking! There's a time for everything. But I can't listen to someone speak right now and be thinking about the past at the same time.

To stick with the same analogy- I'm being a hoarder collecting more in those moments, and not looking through what I already have piled up and can give away or share.

originally posted by: Bluesma

It's like when I come here- I am alone, I stop being active and I think and write about things.
But when I am in action, you can bet I am not thinking! There's a time for everything. But I can't listen to someone speak right now and be thinking about the past at the same time.

Are you saying that when you are with people there is no problem - it is only on reflection there seems to be a problem?

originally posted by: Itisnowagain

originally posted by: Bluesma

It's like when I come here- I am alone, I stop being active and I think and write about things.
But when I am in action, you can bet I am not thinking! There's a time for everything. But I can't listen to someone speak right now and be thinking about the past at the same time.

Are you saying that when you are with people there is no problem - it is only on reflection there seems to be a problem?

Yes. That is what I meant when I described realizing I should have said more or different things, after the interaction.

In the moment, whatever is happening to us is just happening, I have no thoughts about it. Even if the person might act negatively towards me (even in a hostile way) I have no judgement upon what is happening.

It is later that I am able to analyze the event and come to judgement.

I suspect from your religious/philosophical belief system, that means there was nothing wrong then. I simply should not reflect or think about the past -ever.

But to use the most obvious type of example I can, what if a superior at work acts in a way that is undesirable (considers you less capable than they previously thought, takes away some of your responsibilities, decides against a raise they were offering you, or fires you!) because of the way you interacting with them one day.

If you do NOT ever reflect upon that event, and your part in creating it, then you shall not seek ways to behave which will create different events. (that will have a different impact upon your superiors).

That is just an example, I am not speaking only of interactions in the professional world.

Though in the moment, my behaviors arise without effort or thought, they arise as a result of thoughts, values and perceptions formed during my "thinking" time. (like now). Those are the moments of "programming" the self.

The behaviors of which I speak are results of my thoughts, values, and perceptions. My rant is a result of coming to the decision that I wish to find the perceptions or beliefs which are incoherent with each other.


ETA - though to be precise, I can and sometimes do perceive a problem in the moment, in terms of "something happening now that is painful/undesirable" I still experience emotions and sensations. I just don't perceive the complex ways the problem came about right then- I do not perceive my or the others part in the creation of that event. (my 'problem" being my part of responsibility)

a reply to: Bluesma
It is so hard for me to relate to any of this because I do not seek ways to behave - thoughts do not arise about how I should be. It is rather heavy walking around with rules of how I should be - quite stifling really.
Life (for me) does not have 'events' - it is just a flowing - a moving through.

Those are the moments of "programming" the self.

The behaviors of which I speak are results of my thoughts, values, and perceptions. My rant is a result of coming to the decision that I wish to find the perceptions or beliefs which are incoherent with each other.

Did you watch the video that elemalgrove posted?

It is very good.

originally posted by: Itisnowagain
a reply to: Bluesma
It is so hard for me to relate to any of this because I do not seek ways to behave - thoughts do not arise about how I should be. It is rather heavy walking around with rules of how I should be - quite stifling really.
Life (for me) does not have 'events' - it is just a flowing - a moving through.


Did you watch the video that elemalgrove posted?

Yes, but I find it slightly off subject because it refers to belief systems which are learned and conditioned from the exterior (what the french call les idées récus).

Even in what you have said here, it seems you are referring to some sort of "rules" coming from the outside (what is right and wrong, good or evil, from an ethical point of view).

But I do not have any such beliefs. I do not believe in "good" nor "evil". I do not believe in a "right" way to be nor a "wrong" way to be.

I do not believe in any inherent values to anything or anyone.

But I do have desires and set goals for experience.... these give forth meaning/value.

For example, I desire to experience doing this type of activity.
Depending upon context, some actions will lead towards that experience,
some will lead away from that experience.

That becomes what is "right" or "wrong" for me, according to my goal.
I change my goal, those values change.

This becomes a matter of really defining, for myself, how much I want to have this particular experience, and being willing to create the behaviorisms which will lead towards it, and not those which will lead away from it.

It's not "heavy" (especially while in action- when interacting with people, going about my day outside, I am not thinking about what to do or not do! ) My actions arise from the subconscious, without effort, triage or thought.
But the subconscious was programmed earlier, when I was alone, still, and focusing within instead of without.


I do not find it stifling, but at crossroads where I decide to orient myself in a specific direction or goal, there can be a moment of frustration at my lack of focus and direction up to now.

It's like deciding your closet is so full of crap you can't find the sweater you want when it is cold, so you get pissed off (anger is energy created for action) and you take everything out to decide what you want to throw away or change, and re-organize.

If you have never decided to move into a totally new direction and consider the things you'll have to do (or not) to get there, that is good for you if it suits you. It does take effort, which can be quite stimulating and lead to radically different explorations of experience in this world. I like that.

originally posted by: Bluesma
Even in what you have said here, it seems you are referring to some sort of "rules" coming from the outside (what is right and wrong, good or evil, from an ethical point of view).

Rules that you put on yourself - in regard to - I must not appear disinterested - I must not appear arrogant.

I do not believe in a "right" way to be nor a "wrong" way to be.

If you believe that you should have done it different - then that is a belief in a right way and wrong way for you to be.

I do not find it stifling, but at crossroads where I decide to orient myself in a specific direction or goal, there can be a moment of frustration at my lack of focus and direction up to now.

If you have rules on how you should be while in company, then that maybe why you become speechless or stutter or say inappropriate things.

originally posted by: Itisnowagain

Rules that you put on yourself - in regard to - I must not appear disinterested - I must not appear arrogant.

No, that is not accurate. My judgement upon myself is "I have not projected myself forward honestly"
There is nothing inherently wrong with being disinterested or arrogant, it is simply not what I truly feel inside.
It is a false image, which also is not inherently bad to project, but as I am determining right now, leads away from my desired experience of more close, intimate and constructive relations with others.

If you believe that you should have done it different - then that is a belief in a right way and wrong way for you to be.

But not a belief in inherent right or wrong. That is the key notion. Taking the cap off a pen is neither right nor wrong to do. Except within the context of desiring to use that pen for writing- then it becomes a right things to do in relation to that goal. I am free to keep the cap on. But I will not make any marks on a paper with it.

If you have rules on how you should be while in company, then that maybe why you become speechless or stutter or say inappropriate things.

I don't agree with your usage of the word "rules". But if you can only comprehend it that way, I would correct your statement by saying my desires (goals) are contradicting, so become obstacles with each other.

Like the desire to not be intrusive to another - is contradicting my desire to get to know the other more deeply.
(being curious while not wanting to be TOO curious and causing them to feel repelled)

Wanting to create open and warm exchanges with everyone also creates clashes and confusion in me, because what one person is comfortable with another person present might not be- you can't always make everyone present feel good in a given situation.



The kind of behavior you preach as desirable here usually suggests simply letting go of any attempt or desire to steer, curb, or control the subconscious drives and appetites that arise automatically.

This is where the idea of early conditioned social skills is relevant to the conversation.
If you are having dinner with someone else, your fingers go into the plate of the other and start feeling around in the contents of their plate, then your philosophies says it is just what is happening, and you go with it never to think about this moment again.

Two things to point out there -
There is nothing inherently wrong with that. It might make the other person get angry and yell at you, and leave the room, never to spend time with you again. You can just smile and go with that.
Unless you'd like to see this person again and have a relationship with them of some sort, be it personal professional, whatever.
But if you don't care either way. Fine.

But I am betting you don't ever do that, no such actions arise.
Why? Probably because you were taught early on as a child never to do that, so now you don't have to think about it, your body just doesn't do it. You are riding upon your early learned behaviors.

-And if you were born and raised in Morocco, visiting to the UK, that would be the natural and spontaneous action to do. This would most likely have detrimental effects upon their relations with others there, and they would suddenly have to analyze their action and determine whether it is beneficial to their goals, and if they would like to act differently within that context.

The reliance upon conditioned reactions and reflexes is only reliable if you stay in the same context and environment.

But itisnowagain,

I certainly appreciate the way interaction with you has the way of "exorsizing" that passive receptivity/lack of boundry I have when I feel it is not welcome in such intensity!

A few back and forth posts with you and every bit of that becomes you and not I. Gives me a way to project it elsewhere. Since it is what you desire to experience being anyway, it seems to work out well for us both, no??

I get to be the controlling ego you wish to get rid of too.

originally posted by: Bluesma
I get to be the controlling ego you wish to get rid of too.

The stories about 'you' in the past or stories about 'you' in the future creates the illusion that there is a separate solid you that can do something (have control).
But right now the now is going on. Now is all there is (or rather, what is happening is all there is). Now can appear as a story about you (a person that can do) but really there is only now going on.