Flat Earth is a Front for Intelligent Design

It was evident that in the realm of debate and science that Intelligent Design was losing massive amounts of traction toward human origins. It has been ridiculed time and time again, and it could not be used to ammo in our literal understanding of reality. It had no experiments to confirm, and it only could observe what reality was while never being able to measure a "Creator".

Enter: Flat Earth Theory. This is a theory that has experiments that individuals can try themselves such as moonlight temperature, observing the horizon, measuring shadows with close lights vs. far lights, etc... People can repeat these experiments and actually give themselves hard logic to back up this idea.

The one repeated observation I have with most FE explanations and theories is that they are all backed by Christians... They always cite Jewish writings for their evidence and will always go back to it. Not nearly enough non-religious sites, videos, blogs are created to follow this theory.

I don't have much evidence beyond my own observations while plowing through the internet, but if you ask me it can appear that the Intelligent Designers made this movement to attempt to re-credify the ID movement. It is repeatedly attempted to circle logic back to the Christian Bible to show how it supports a flat earth and since we can observe experiments that would reflect a flat type earth then that would verify the biblical writings... And so here they are back and swinging with something new!

Thoughts?

originally posted by: Myollinir
... It is repeatedly attempted to circle logic back to the Christian Bible to show how it supports a flat earth and since we can observe experiments that would reflect a flat type earth then that would verify the biblical writings... And so here they are back and swinging with something new!

Thoughts?

What biblical writings claim a flat earth? What verses?

a reply to: VegHead

It more boils down to geo vs heliocentric

a reply to: Myollinir

Its a strange thing to observe . I had joined one of the bigger FE sites but soon found out that they were actually anti-bible and not nice about it in the least .But there is also a large Christian demographic that thinks the FE is foolish . Not sure how the split works out in numbers but its a mix is all I can say . I am agnostic on the subject personally .It doesn't really effect the way I read or understand my bible .

a reply to: Myollinir

The flat earth movement does not need to rely on Christian teachings or biblical scriptures in the least to make their arguments. I am not taking a position on either way, but what you are saying is not accurate and I think a lot of Christians would be very offended to be affiliated with flat earthers.

a reply to: pointessa

The flat earth movement does not need to rely on Christian teachings or biblical scriptures in the least to make their arguments. I am not taking a position on either way, but what you are saying is not accurate and I think a lot of Christians would be very offended to be affiliated with flat earthers.

Jesus kept company with sinners ...just saying

ID people are idiots, it's hard to defend them.
They are as stupid as those who imagine virtual particles to justify their theories.

But they're not stupid enough to be flat earthers.

If the Earth is flat, should I then be able to get on Pikes peak in Colorado and see Oklahoma city on a clear day with a telescope?

originally posted by: VegHead
What biblical writings claim a flat earth? What verses?

Here's a few verses:

Earth as the center:

Joshua 10:12-13 – “…And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed…. The sun stayed in the midst of heaven,…”

Habakkuk 3:11 – “The sun and moon stood still in their habitation at the light of thine arrows….”

Ecclesiastes 1:5 – “The sun rises and the sun goes down, and hastens to the place where it rises.”


Stars:

Isaiah 14:13 – “…I will ascend to heaven; above the stars of God…”

Matthew 24:29 – “…and the stars will fall from heaven,…”

Mark 13:25 – “..and the stars will be falling from heaven,”

1 Corinthians 15:40-41 – “..There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars; “

The Sky:

Job 37:18 - “Can you, like him, spread out the skies, hard as a molten mirror?”

Isaiah 40:22 – “…who stretches out the heavens like a curtain, and spread them like a tent to dwell in;”

Isaiah 48:13 – “my hand laid out the foundation of the earth, and my right hand spread out the heavens; “

Psalm 148:3-4 – “Praise him, sun and moon, praise him, all you shining stars! Praise him, you highest heavens, and you waters above the heavens!”


Foundation of the Earth:

1 Samuel 2:8 – “..For the pillars of the earth are the Lord’s, and on them he has set the world”

Job 9:6 – “who shakes the earth from its place, and its pillars tremble.”

Psalms 104:5 – “Thou didst set the earth on its foundations, so that it should never be shaken.”

originally posted by: the2ofusr1
a reply to: Myollinir

Its a strange thing to observe . I had joined one of the bigger FE sites but soon found out that they were actually anti-bible and not nice about it in the least .But there is also a large Christian demographic that thinks the FE is foolish . Not sure how the split works out in numbers but its a mix is all I can say . I am agnostic on the subject personally .It doesn't really effect the way I read or understand my bible .

It also seems like it's yet another topic to divide and conquer us with. I am VERY interested in the topic, and just wanted to communicate this observation I've had and I was just thinking, "Where has Intelligent Design been in the debate circuit lately?"...

I do know that there are many Christians who reject FE, but it sure seems like the majority of FE go back to Jewish scriptures as their reference point...

a reply to: Myollinir

I do know that there are many Christians who reject FE, but it sure seems like the majority of FE go back to Jewish scriptures as their reference point...

Many Christians as well as none Christians fail to consider that the consensus back in OT times was that the earth was flat . That is what the "scientists" of that day thought and so it was a culture norm that the majority of the known world thought to be correct . I was taught in school that even during Columbus's day people thought you could sail off the edge .

originally posted by: bknapple32
a reply to: VegHead

It more boils down to geo vs heliocentric

Yah among other things, they got that wrong too.

But consider this, if it turns out the Universe is infinite, (goes on forever) then there is no center of the Universe, in fact everywhere is the center of everything, so the earth could be the center of the Universe....

Not that that was their thinking , they were just full of themselves.

a reply to: Myollinir

It was evident that in the realm of debate and science that Intelligent Design was losing massive amounts of traction toward human origins

I think its gaining.

Question: DNA is genetic code, right? So who encoded that?

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: Myollinir

It was evident that in the realm of debate and science that Intelligent Design was losing massive amounts of traction toward human origins

I think its gaining.

Question: DNA is genetic code, right? So who encoded that?

The question "who encoded that" needs a lot of assumptions.

"How did the code come about?" is a better question.

originally posted by: Myollinir

originally posted by: VegHead
What biblical writings claim a flat earth? What verses?

Here's a few verses:

Earth as the center:

Joshua 10:12-13 – “…And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed…. The sun stayed in the midst of heaven,…”

Habakkuk 3:11 – “The sun and moon stood still in their habitation at the light of thine arrows….”

Ecclesiastes 1:5 – “The sun rises and the sun goes down, and hastens to the place where it rises.”


Stars:

Isaiah 14:13 – “…I will ascend to heaven; above the stars of God…”

Matthew 24:29 – “…and the stars will fall from heaven,…”

Mark 13:25 – “..and the stars will be falling from heaven,”

1 Corinthians 15:40-41 – “..There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars; “

The Sky:

Job 37:18 - “Can you, like him, spread out the skies, hard as a molten mirror?”

Isaiah 40:22 – “…who stretches out the heavens like a curtain, and spread them like a tent to dwell in;”

Isaiah 48:13 – “my hand laid out the foundation of the earth, and my right hand spread out the heavens; “

Psalm 148:3-4 – “Praise him, sun and moon, praise him, all you shining stars! Praise him, you highest heavens, and you waters above the heavens!”


Foundation of the Earth:

1 Samuel 2:8 – “..For the pillars of the earth are the Lord’s, and on them he has set the world”

Job 9:6 – “who shakes the earth from its place, and its pillars tremble.”

Psalms 104:5 – “Thou didst set the earth on its foundations, so that it should never be shaken.”

Thank you!

I don't see anything that demands a flat earth in these verses, but I'll need to give it more thought and study. I can see how geocentrism could be read into it, but just as we use the phrases "sunrise" and "sunset" it doesn't mean that we believe that is literally what is happening. The bible has multiple authors and many different genres. There is poetry, metaphor, history, etc. In the NT, much of the teachings of Jesus takes the form of metaphor and analogies.

I didn't think "flat earthers" was a real thing... I honestly thought it was kind of a joke, or even satire with some sort of political agenda.

But thank you for sharing the verses - very helpful!

originally posted by: Myollinir
The one repeated observation I have with most FE explanations and theories is that they are all backed by Christians... They always cite Jewish writings for their evidence and will always go back to it. Not nearly enough non-religious sites, videos, blogs are created to follow this theory.

Well yeah... You need to be a religious person to discard scientific findings just because. No non-religious person would support a non-scientific idea like this because it has no logical and scientific basis.

originally posted by: pointessa
a reply to: Myollinir

The flat earth movement does not need to rely on Christian teachings or biblical scriptures in the least to make their arguments. I am not taking a position on either way, but what you are saying is not accurate and I think a lot of Christians would be very offended to be affiliated with flat earthers.

I think it is a matter of you need to be a Christian to believe this idea, but that doesn't mean that all Christians believe it. In other words the OP is saying that believers of FET are a sub-set of Christians. Not all of them. That's how I see it at least.

originally posted by: Myollinir

originally posted by: VegHead
What biblical writings claim a flat earth? What verses?

Here's a few verses:

Earth as the center:

Joshua 10:12-13 – “…And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed…. The sun stayed in the midst of heaven,…”

Habakkuk 3:11 – “The sun and moon stood still in their habitation at the light of thine arrows….”

Ecclesiastes 1:5 – “The sun rises and the sun goes down, and hastens to the place where it rises.”


Stars:

Isaiah 14:13 – “…I will ascend to heaven; above the stars of God…”

Matthew 24:29 – “…and the stars will fall from heaven,…”

Mark 13:25 – “..and the stars will be falling from heaven,”

1 Corinthians 15:40-41 – “..There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars; “

The Sky:

Job 37:18 - “Can you, like him, spread out the skies, hard as a molten mirror?”

Isaiah 40:22 – “…who stretches out the heavens like a curtain, and spread them like a tent to dwell in;”

Isaiah 48:13 – “my hand laid out the foundation of the earth, and my right hand spread out the heavens; “

Psalm 148:3-4 – “Praise him, sun and moon, praise him, all you shining stars! Praise him, you highest heavens, and you waters above the heavens!”


Foundation of the Earth:

1 Samuel 2:8 – “..For the pillars of the earth are the Lord’s, and on them he has set the world”

Job 9:6 – “who shakes the earth from its place, and its pillars tremble.”

Psalms 104:5 – “Thou didst set the earth on its foundations, so that it should never be shaken.”

It's almost as if you totally misunderstood Veg's question lol

But anyways, all I've seen in the Bible are verses that talk about a spherical Earth. Anybody who claims to be a Christian while claiming the Earth is flat, is being lead in the wrong direction.

a reply to: intrptr

Then I suppose I could argue the sun is in fact the center if there is no center, by fact that we revolve around the sun.
And true, it was literally " i am the center of the universe " thinking.

Flat Earth has noticeably gone the way of some neo christian sect.

a reply to: VegHead

Haha no problem - they may not explicitly say "FLAT EARTH" but the verses are all compatible with one - and that is why they are shared with the experimental evidence.

Things like the firmament, the sun being created before the earth, and others... but at least I like to give concrete examples