Metformin is an Endocrine Disruptor and Threat to Humankind

Just read a couple of articles about a cure for T2D in mice with diabetes with no side effects. I thought the details could be useful to add to this discussion.Article
Additionally there is an article explaining why test results sometimes work for
mice but not people.

Not trying to spread false hope, but members in this thread are knowledgeable on the subject and I wonder if, and hope this info may be of benefit somehow.

Berberine, extracted from plant roots, is also known to reduce blood sugar levels.
Some studies found it to be nearly as effective as Metformin.
Depending how well it works for someone, it may replace Metformin or can help to
reduce the dose.
Berberine is also relatively cheap.

originally posted by: TiredofControlFreaks
a reply to: TiredofControlFreaks

sorry - pressed enter before I finished.

taking 100 aspirin all at once will kill you. Take 1 aspirin for 100 days and you will be fine and maybe experience beneficial effects.

Just because a lot of something causes a problem, does not mean that a little of the same thing will also have an effect.

The poison, as usual is in the dose.

I call this doom porn

you're using common sense and logic, anti vaxxers and proponents of big pharma however...

a reply to: M4ngo

Metformin is a threat to humankind? No, it's not, at all. Tiredofcontrolfreaks has been trying to explain to you why it's not, but I don't think you are listening.

Metformin is safe and one of the best first line meds for diabetes type 2. This is such a complex condition it's impossible to say one drug is better than the other, because every person reacts differently to it and need a personalized plan. Many respond well to diet an exercise only at first but, as it has been said already, it is a progressive condition that requires more and more medical input with time.

You have posted an FDable screenshot showing how Metformin is first cause of death in thousands of cases.... well, you are wrong in assuming that. The site shows all adverse reports which are voluntary reports from all kind of people, some are professionals but many are lay people who believe a certain drug caused a certain reaction. That list is not a confirmation of adverse effects, it's just a list of people beliefs and assumptions.

Every drug on this planet has thousands of adverse reactions reports, let's take Lantus for example (as you are promoting insulin over Metformin and Lantus is one of the most commonly used ):



See? Thousands of deaths 'caused' by insulin. I can show you the same for every other type and maker.

Insulin is actually more dangerous than Metformin, it is incredibly effective, don't get me wrong, but it has a much higher chance of causing serious hypoglycemic episodes which can cause death if not treated quickly. A few years back I worked in a Brain Injury Unit and we had a few patients with permanent brain injury caused by hypoglycemia (patients who injected too much insulin or injected the correct amount and didn't eat). Have you heard of the 'dead in bed syndrome'? Research it, it's very rare but it does happen to diabetics on insulin.

Having said that I know insulin is a life saver, but patients have to be able to used it correctly. Insulin gives people with diabetes type 1 a second chance in life, as they couldn't survive without it.

The inhaled insulin is too recent to compare it to anything, it's not even sold yet in many countries (like the UK where it's still on Clinical trials). It's also quick acting insulin only, which means it is only suitable for a small percentage of diabetic people.

You have posted lots of links regarding Metformin on page 5 but the links don't work. Please post them properly, I would like to read them and discuss them with you. Only the ones on page 5 because they ones on the OP about the environment are not relevant, you can find all types of drugs flushed in our water systems which are affecting flora and fauna.

Can you also explain why the makers of Metformin are Big Pharma evils but the makers of Affrezza are not?

And if those promoting Metformin are shills (your words), what does that make you promoting another Big Pharma product? Can't you see the irony of your own accusations?



a reply to: TiredofControlFreaks

Excellent posts! I will have to go back and star all of them because you have posted sensible information and facts. Great job!

a reply to: Agartha

Listen to the two of you? No.

Great success against T2 is to attack at sugar and carb level to the point of a near zero carb. Let that ride awhile. The body will start to turn fat into glucose which will account to why sugar is staying high for several week even with a very humble diet. Metformin taken with zero carb and zero sugars diet is very effective. Cant just eat whatever and believe drugs are going to do all the work.

By the way I had very high BP. Was on 5 BP meds. Lost 30lbs after D2 diagnosis. Discontinued all BP meds early because of Beta Blockers effect on insulin production. BP is near normal and stable now without BP meds.

a reply to: M4ngo

But ... but .. Metformin slows aging and increases lifespan potentially *see link*, even in non-diabetics. Should not we all be taking metformin? Plus, it is very cheap as far as cost.

www.medicalnewstoday.com...

www.diabetes.co.uk... 4343757.htmla reply to: Fowlerstoad

another link ... there are a lot of proposed human studies. I just grabbed this one:

www.diabetes.co.uk... tml







Ugh. I cannot get this link to work, but if you do a websearch for life expectancy studies with metformin, you can find your own links. Sorry.

originally posted by: Fowlerstoad
a reply to: M4ngo

But ... but .. Metformin slows aging and increases lifespan potentially *see link*, even in non-diabetics. Should not we all be taking metformin? Plus, it is very cheap as far as cost.

www.medicalnewstoday.com...

Yeah, that's a bunch of BS. But by all means load up if that's what ya want to do—lots of ignorance in this thread.

originally posted by: M4ngo
Yeah, that's a bunch of BS. But by all means load up if that's what ya want to do—lots of ignorance in this thread.

I couldn't agree more! Just look at all the misinformation in the OP!

I have been wondering why you wouldn't post links for the articles you cited as 'real science' on page 5, so I searched for them myself and now I understand:

Antidiabetic drug metformin (GlucophageR) increases biogenesis of Alzheimer's amyloid peptides via up-regulating BACE1 transcription.

This is in vitro, and anything can happen in a petri dish. Let's wait for the in vivo studies and then clinical trials to see if they really are onto something. This study proves nothing.

Biological and biophysics aspects of metformin‐induced effects: cortex mitochondrial dysfunction and promotion of toxic amyloid pre‐fibrillar aggregates

This one was an in-vivo study, but with mice and unfortunately what happens with mice doesn't always mirror humans. We need clinical trials. This study proves nothing.

Metformin Facilitates Amyloid-β Generation by β- and γ-Secretases via Autophagy Activation

Mice again and you know success in a lab doesn't always mean success with humans. Clinical trials needed. This study proves nothing.

Metformin increases APP expression and processing via oxidative stress, mitochondrial dysfunction and NF-κB activation: Use of insulin to attenuate metformin's effect

This was the most interesting article, I really enjoyed reading it but I am surprised you posted it as it shows the benefits of Metformin. A snippet from your article:

The combined use of metformin and insulin could be a therapeutic strategy for Alzheimer's Disease

The study was on mice once again, hence this is in the conclusion:

The relationship identified between the key pathogenic peptide of AD and metformin/insulin is clearly of great interest and may have important implications for the treatment of T2DM and AD. However, large clinical trials are necessary to confirm and clarify the therapeutic efficacy of these compounds.

Hope this was useful!

originally posted by: Agartha

originally posted by: M4ngo
Yeah, that's a bunch of BS. But by all means load up if that's what ya want to do—lots of ignorance in this thread.

I couldn't agree more! Just look at all the misinformation in the OP!

I have been wondering why you wouldn't post links for the articles you cited as 'real science' on page 5, so I searched for them myself and now I understand:

Antidiabetic drug metformin (GlucophageR) increases biogenesis of Alzheimer's amyloid peptides via up-regulating BACE1 transcription.

This is in vitro, and anything can happen in a petri dish. Let's wait for the in vivo studies and then clinical trials to see if they really are onto something. This study proves nothing.

Biological and biophysics aspects of metformin‐induced effects: cortex mitochondrial dysfunction and promotion of toxic amyloid pre‐fibrillar aggregates

This one was an in-vivo study, but with mice and unfortunately what happens with mice doesn't always mirror humans. We need clinical trials. This study proves nothing.

Metformin Facilitates Amyloid-β Generation by β- and γ-Secretases via Autophagy Activation

Mice again and you know success in a lab doesn't always mean success with humans. Clinical trials needed. This study proves nothing.

Metformin increases APP expression and processing via oxidative stress, mitochondrial dysfunction and NF-κB activation: Use of insulin to attenuate metformin's effect

This was the most interesting article, I really enjoyed reading it but I am surprised you posted it as it shows the benefits of Metformin. A snippet from your article:

The combined use of metformin and insulin could be a therapeutic strategy for Alzheimer's Disease

The study was on mice once again, hence this is in the conclusion:

The relationship identified between the key pathogenic peptide of AD and metformin/insulin is clearly of great interest and may have important implications for the treatment of T2DM and AD. However, large clinical trials are necessary to confirm and clarify the therapeutic efficacy of these compounds.

Hope this was useful!

First of all—I included all the links to Metformin being a neurotoxin on Page 1, post 3. You failed to look.

Your misinterpretations are not useful. Insulin INHIBITS the oxidative stress CAUSED BY Metformin. Lol. That is not a good thing. Metformin causes Alzheimer's, don't give me some smartass remarks when you don't even know what you're talking about.

You seem to also not understand a lot.

Fact: Metformin directly alters gut microbiota and long-term Metformin use causes chronic vitamin b12 deficiency. Do you know what vitamin b12 is used for in the body? Obviously not because if ya did, then ya would not be blindly arguing a drug that causes it. Vitamin b12 is essential in DNA synthesis and red blood cell production.

Fact: people die all the time from lactic acidosis caused by Metformin.

Good luck with your blind acceptance to whatever other drugs the paid shills of the Endo establishment throws at ya.

Hope that helped!

a reply to: M4ngo


I hear you on long term use. Hope to get off of it at some point soon and the sooner the better. However why you have high sugar 750 say. It took 3weeks plus with diet and Met to get down to normal. Hope I can get off it soon.

By the way it seems to me looking at the info that problems caused with Met have to do with folks not wanting to change their diet or intake of the wrong things to the point where Met is used as a crutch. They want to drink for example and continue with the carbs.

a reply to: Logarock

I truly do think it is awesome that you are strong willed enough to maintain that commitment with diet and exercise. The problem is the paid shills that refuse to acknowledge that their line of thinking (the same official Consensus on T2D management algorithms) has been a failure. First line treatment should be insulin (personally I think Cannabis). For type 2 nothing works better than an insulin that mimics the endogenous secretion of insulin like that of normal functioning pancreas which eliminates the need to have a strict diet and allows for a normal life style. They make too much money from the Injectable Insulin Cartels to care about changing anything. Endos are some of the most closed-minded, corrupt people out there. Some of the ones constructing these diabetes management guidelines are not only receiving grant and research funds, having biased research published in their favor, and being highly compensated, but some are SHAREHOLDERS of the companies (which is evidenced in the post with the Disclosure). Some are OK with this. I am not.

I too hope you succeed in getting off, seems like you are pretty close to that goal.

Metformin Exposure Effects Human and Mouse Testicular Cells In Vitro and In Vivo

RESULTS:
In human and mouse organotypic cultures in vitro, metformin decreased testosterone secretion and mRNA expression of the main factors involved in steroid production. In vitro, the lowest observed effect concentration (LOEC) on testosterone secretion was 50 µM in human, whereas it was 500 µM in mouse testis. Lactate secretion was increased in both human and mouse organotypic cultures with the same LOEC at 500 µM as observed in other cell culture models after metformin stimulation. In vivo administration of metformin to pregnant mice reduced the testicular size of the fetal and neonatal testes exposed to metformin during intrauterine life. Although the number of germ cells was not affected by the metformin treatment, the number of Sertoli cells, the nurse cells of germ cells, was slightly yet significantly reduced in both periods (fetal period: P = 0.007; neonatal period: P = 0.03). The Leydig cell population, which produces androgens, and the testosterone content were diminished only in the fetal period at 16 days post-coitum.

CONCLUSIONS:
This study showed a potentially harmful effect of metformin treatment on the development of the fetal testis and should encourage future human epidemiological studies.

Metformin exposure affects human and mouse fetal testicular cells

originally posted by: M4ngo
Metformin Exposure Effects Human and Mouse Testicular Cells In Vitro and In Vivo

Let me explain again: in vitro is in a petri dish, anything can happen in a petri dish, I could kill cancer cells with a cigarette in a petri dish! In vivo is with mice and what happens with mice does not necessarily translate into humans. This study proves nothing, hence in the conclusion it says we need more studies. If you want to prove anything you need to post clinical trials that have been replicated.

Fact: people die all the time from lactic acidosis caused by Metformin.

Perhaps a 'fact' in your fantasy world but on planet Earth the association between Metformin and lactic acidosis is very rare, ratio 1:100000, but please post evidence for your 'fact'.

Fact: Metformin directly alters gut microbiota and long-term Metformin use causes chronic vitamin b12 deficiency. Do you know what vitamin b12 is used for in the body? Obviously not because if ya did, then ya would not be blindly arguing a drug that causes it. Vitamin b12 is essential in DNA synthesis and red blood cell production.

LOL of course I know what vitamin B12 is, I give Cyanocobalamin injections to most of my patients regularly (my speciality is geriatrics). And whilst it is true that long term administration of Metformin carries a small risk of vit B12 deficiency, what research is showing is that levels of vitamin B12 should be monitored as part of the yearly diabetic check. Research is not saying to stop Metformin.

Many common medications can cause vit B12 deficiency, like Chloramphenicol, H2 antagonists (Ranitidine), PPis (Omeprazole) etc, drugs millions use every day. You are just trying to single out one of them, which makes it very suspicious.

Metformin causes Alzheimer's, don't give me some smartass remarks when you don't even know what you're talking about.

No, it doesn't and you are yet to show evidence for your assumption. The study you posted did not for obvious reasons I pointed, one of them being 'in vivo' and not a clinical trial that has been replicated.

I included all the links to Metformin being a neurotoxin on Page 1, post 3. You failed to look.

?????????? Those links are the same ones you posted on page 5 and I have analyzed them already yesterday (and explained why they are not showing any valid results for anything).

a reply to: Agartha

Let me explain again: It is a fact that Metformin induces beta-amyloid aggregates. It is also a fact that after three months, Metformin is useless (see: the recent CV trial w/ Metformin).

Endocrinology & Metabolism International Journal
Diabetes, Neurodegenerative Diseases, GLP-1 & Surgery: Evidence Calls for Exploration

Optimal control of diabetes can reduce the progression of cognitive deficits in patients with AD. The use of drugs such as rioglitazone, pioglitazone has demonstrated to have a positive impact upon cognition and memory in patients with mild to moderate AD. While metformin by itself increases the formation of Β-amyloid, combined with insulin it enhances the effects of insulin in reducing amyloid levels.

While metformin by itself increases the formation of Β-amyloid

Endocrinology & Metabolism International Journal


Increased Risk of Cognitive Impairment in Patients With Diabetes Is Associated With Metformin

Participants with diabetes (n = 126) had worse cognitive performance than participants who did not have diabetes (n = 1,228; adjusted odds ratio 1.51 [95% CI 1.03–2.21]). Among participants with diabetes, worse cognitive performance was associated with metformin use (2.23 [1.05–4.75]). After adjusting for age, sex, level of education, history of depression, serum vitamin B12, and metformin use, participants with diabetes who were taking calcium supplements had better cognitive performance (0.41 [0.19–0.92]).

Metformin use was associated with impaired cognitive performance.

One recent case-control study that included 14,172 participants 65 years of age or older reported that taking metformin over the long term increased the risk of AD

Among participants with diabetes, cognitive performance was worse in patients who were taking metformin

MMSE scores were lower in participants with diabetes who used metformin (mean score ± SD 22.8 ± 5.5) than in those who did not use metformin (24.7 ± 4.4).

In our series, patients with diabetes who were taking metformin had worse cognitive performance than participants who were not taking metformin.

Our observations agree with those previously reported by Imfeld and colleagues (22), in particular that patients who are taking metformin may be at an increased risk for cognitive impairment.

Alternatively, patients who are prescribed metformin may have worse glycemic control or diabetes-related complications than patients with diabetes who are not prescribed metformin

Metformin is a widely prescribed first-line monotherapy for type 2 diabetes but is associated with vitamin B12 deficiency and peripheral neuropathy.

A case-control study of more than 14,000 patients reported that long-term metformin use was associated with an increased risk for AD in those ≥65 years old

Alternatively, metformin also impairs absorption of vitamin B12 via a drug interaction that occurs at the distal ileum. Low serum vitamin B12 levels are associated with AD and other neurodegenerative diseases

• This study was presented at the 2012 Smart Geelong Network Research of the Year Awards, Victoria, Australia, 26 October 2012, for which it was awarded the Population Health Researcher of the Year Award.

Increased Risk of Cognitive Impairment in Patients With Diabetes Is Associated With Metformin

So remember: Endocrinologists themselves published this in their International Journal:

While metformin by itself increases the formation of Β-amyloid

a reply to: Agartha

a reply to: M4ngo

Thank-you very much for posting this thread.I am going to
throw my husband's metformin in the trash after I post this.

Just threw them away and I want to show my husband this
thread and the information you found.

a reply to: M4ngo


Man I am to go see a Dr today for the first time about this. BS is down now to near normal and I am not really wanting to go. Certainly after reading your post. I will be assigned an Endo today if I go. I told my wife they are just going to give me more pills.

By the way do you know anything about Beta Blocker BP meds screwing up natural insulin production? I read that several places online. Stoped 4 weeks about.

a reply to: M4ngo

Thanks for that report, both my brothers are on that medication, weight centers like to give it away like candy to lose weight

Taking into consideration that most medications that people takes including over the counter medications ends in our sewer system and then back into the ecosystem people should be very concern, as of today, about 70% of the population in the US takes prescription drugs, that is without counting the over the counter ones

We are poisoning our selves and any living thing in the planet and big pharma have not problem facilitating the poisons.

a reply to: Logarock

Gymnema research on it, it helps control sugar in the blood.