Gay Genes, Religous implications ?

Originally posted by Countermeasures
According to recent investigation of DNA sequences in families with gay brothers, several combinations of genes might determine the sexual orientation.
www.scienceagogo.com...
What would be the religious implications ?
[edit on 3-2-2005 by Countermeasures]

OK, going at it from a purely religious perspective and ignoring any debate over how conclusive the findings of the study were, here's where my money would be.

Nephilim. The book of genesis says that angels (presumably fallen angels) came to earth and took human wives. The result was a race of hybrids who were giants and famous warriors. These nephilim ("fallen ones" in english) supposedly gave humanity its first education in weapons and war, and they corrupted the human genome.
So God wiped them out. The bible says that Noah was "perfect in his generations" meaning that he represented the pure line of Adam without any adulturation from Nephilim. This should have been the end of genetic corruption in mankind, but it wasn't for a couple of reasons.
1. If you take the bible literally, the gene-pool was limited to 3 families, one of whom was cast out, meaning that a set of first-cousins and siblings began breeding us (in theory).
2. The bible says there were Nephilim in the earth "in those days, and after" meaning that somehow they showed up again after the flood. This opens up the possibility that Noah was not the sole survivor, but that Nephilim may saved other element of humanity.

In so many words, from a strictly religious standpoint it is probable that homosexuality is the result of interference by Nephilim.
Others might explain that it is a product of sin: perhaps that inbreeding caused such a mutation.

really hope they can prove this beyond all doubt.

Dude, even if they don't prove it, gays and the secular news media will swear they have. There is no DNA for homosexuals. Homosexuality is a choice, not an inheritance. It's not like a hair color, or an eye color, it's a sexual decision. People claim they were born that way,,,,,, BULL!!!!!!!! Show me a three year old that is gay and I'll shut up.
Homosexuality is a direct result of not having a loving caring nurturing male role model. It is learned, not inherited.

I dunno, I've seen some "Christians" up at my college campus who treat gays pretty crappy. As a Catholic myself, I personally see the whole "homosexual relations is a sin" thing as stupid. If two people love each other, isn't that all that matters?

Dude,,, homosexuality is strictly a sexual thing, that's it. If two men "LOVE" each other, but are not in a sexual relationship with each other, then they are just friends. When you add the complication of sex to the friendship, that is the only time it is homosexual,,,, so don't feed me the line of " when two people are in love" That's crap. Homosexuality is wrong and that's all there is to it.

Originally posted by deesw

Homosexuality is a choice,.

That's the biggest crock a crap! How many gays do you know well!? No it is not a choice....gays spend half their lives trying to deny it and being miserable......it just "is" ....something is wrong somewhere, but it's not a choice I am on my way to putting you on ignore.....the motto here is deny ignorance....try it, you may learn something

Originally posted by deesw
Show me a three year old that is gay and I'll shut up.
Homosexuality is a direct result of not having a loving caring nurturing male role model. It is learned, not inherited.

I think you still have to allow for the influence of inherited traits. They influence both a persons abilities and the way a person is treated which ultimately has a tremendous role in the choices a person makes.
You rarely see a really big strong guy who wants to be a librarian. You rarely see a really little frail guy who wants to be an NFL linebacker.
But you know what? That's because of their natural strengths and the way they are treated, which is determined by their inherited traits.

A person's inherited traits can make them more feminine and cause them to be treated a certain way socially, and thus inherited traits unrelated to gender could play a significant role in the development of homosexual physchology.
I bet you that you could take any kid in the world, inject them with the right hormones and treat them the right way, and you could make a homosexual out of them. I also bet that the treatment alone would not work nearly as often without the hormones- it's a push me pull me effect between nature and nurture.


I think I'm a good example when compared to my brothers. We're all very smart, but I'm far and away the smartest- we're not even comparable. Why? Because the other two are lean and athletic like my father and this lead them down a certain path in life. I gain weight very easily and have extremely bad eyes, which took me down another path.

something is wrong somewhere, but it's not a choice I am on my way to putting you on ignore.....the motto here is deny ignorance....try it, you may learn something

Ignore me all you want, do you think you will hurt me? I haven't called anyone names and am behaving myself. I guess that the truth just stings a bit. I am simply giving my opinion like you are. These are the things I believe that I speak, if you do not want to believe or agree, then don't. This is a discussion board, I am discussing. How can you give your opinion and I not? Doesn't seem fair. If you think that noone's feelings are ever supposed to get hurt then think again. I carried my Bible to work one day, didn't have it open, wasn't reading it, wasn't discussing it, but it was on my desk. A women claiming to be a wiccan, and a group of others at my office complained that it offended them to see it. I was told to remove it or I was fired. Later on that week the wiccan brought a book of spells and was showing it around to people and offering advice on getting rid of boyfriends and illnesses by encantations, I complained to management and was again warned. Why are you people allowed to do what you wish, but we as Christians are constantly told we can't give our opinions, read our Bibles in public, or pray in public? Explain to me what's going on.
My Bible is offensive? Seeing two homosexual males making out in public is offensive to me, seeing a witch practicing openly is offensive to me. Until that time, I dealt with the offense, but now everytime you turn around someone is trying to take my liberties away from me. I will no longer be silent.
I love all people, there are just a few I do not like. The Bible does not command me to accept anyone, or like anyone. It simply commands that I love them. There is a big difference between like and love.

think you still have to allow for the influence of inherited traits

Sex was given to us as a gift between a man and a woman. When men and women have sex they make other men and women. That's what it is for. It is a wonderful thing and is abused so much today. Man was given a natural attraction to woman, and vice versa. I don't see how having a trait has anything to do with it. So what if they seem more feminine than they ought to. I have seen plenty of men who were very feminine and were happily married to women. It all comes down to a choice. If you are inheriting traits that make you more feminine, you still make a consious choice to be with a man. Ladyv seems to think that we are all victims of our own bodies and that we cannot control what we do. If that was true, then Ted Bundy was just a victim of his own body and could not help the things he did. Something was just wrong and he could not help it. I just don't think so. He made a decision as well. A very, very bad decision.

This thread promotes ignorance to the fullest degree. If you are religious and believe that God views homosexuality as a sin, then very well, you can interpret your scriptures any way you can and we can argue over the interpretations for a long time. Any other non religious argument is pure crap. Homosexuality is an expression. It's not wrong, its not unnatural (we are nature), its not evil, its not going to end the world, it doesn't corrupt morals. Grow up.

It's not wrong, its not unnatural (we are nature), its not evil, its not going to end the world, it doesn't corrupt morals. Grow up

That is your opinion. Mine is that it is wrong, unnatural, and immoral. It is aiding to the decline of modern civilization.

Originally posted by deesw

It's not wrong, its not unnatural (we are nature), its not evil, its not going to end the world, it doesn't corrupt morals. Grow up

That is your opinion. Mine is that it is wrong, unnatural, and immoral. It is aiding to the decline of modern civilization.

When you can't learn to accept someone who is different from you, then yes it does aid to the decline of civilization. Are you basing your views on (flawed) religious beliefs? If not, i stand by my last statement - grow up.

Its threads like these that make me wonder why i come to ATS. Deny Ignorance people? Put things into perspective... I shan't be posting on this thread anymore.

Deny Ignorance people? Put things into perspective... I shan't be posting on this thread anymore.

You people keep spouting that phrase like it's the golden fleece. Is it ignorance to have a different opinion than someone? I said that what I said was my opinion. I thought that's what this site is for, the sharing of opinions.

No, ignorance is blind faith in something that is wrong. Anyways, wan any other definitions?

It is aiding to the decline of modern civilization.

Fair enough, you don't like Gay People, thats your business,
but "Aiding The Decline Of Modern Civilization"??? just a tad
overdramatic....thats just my opinion however

No, ignorance is blind faith in something that is wrong. Anyways, wan any other definitions?

Explain to me exactly what I believe is wrong please. Then tell me who says I'm wrong.

There are (also in the christian world) several ways to look at gay people and homosexuality.
www.godmademegay.com is an example of a christian point of view that explains why there is nothing wrong with being gay or leading a gay lifestyle.

The sad truth is that many people (christians and nonchristians) can often not be rational enough to look past the "revolting sex" ideas, to find out what being gay really is, and why people commit suicide because they are gay.

Scientists allready found similar brain differences in the brains of gay sheep, it's just a matter of time before they find similar things for humans.
I wonder what all the "I can turn you straight" shrinks are going to say then...

Originally posted by deesw
Dude, even if they don't prove it, gays and the secular news media will swear they have. There is no DNA for homosexuals. Homosexuality is a choice, not an inheritance. It's not like a hair color, or an eye color, it's a sexual decision. People claim they were born that way,,,,,, BULL!!!!!!!! Show me a three year old that is gay and I'll shut up.
Homosexuality is a direct result of not having a loving caring nurturing male role model. It is learned, not inherited.

With such statements you are ignoring about everything scientists have learned in recent history about this subject.
Being born gay is like being born black, a state that you can not change, neither prevent.

If you are truly interested in the truth, it doesn't take a lot of research to find out you are wrong.
If you are not interested in the truth, you can shout that being gay is a choice a few more times untill I no longer care to respond to your ignorance.

Your choice.

Originally posted by Jakko
Scientists allready found similar brain differences in the brains of gay sheep, it's just a matter of time before they find similar things for humans.
I wonder what all the "I can turn you straight" shrinks are going to say then...

I'd be really interested to see this study. Perhaps you can provide a ref.

deesw Ladyv seems to think that we are all victims of our own bodies and that we cannot control what we do. If that was true, then Ted Bundy was just a victim of his own body and could not help the things he did.

Where in the world do you get that!? I have over come much in my own life, a drug addiction, I stopped smoking after years...not mention a lot of other private things.....this has nothing to do with getting over anything. Gay are born that way.....just like one is attracted to certain types of people, you can't help it, that's just the way you "are"

Jakko
The sad truth is that many people (christians and nonchristians) can often not be rational enough to look past the "revolting sex" ideas, to find out what being gay really is, and why people commit suicide because they are gay.

I know many gays, I have a gay sister. I don't know nay gays that have "revolving sex" My sister has been with her partner for about 24 years...most I know are in committed long term relationships...some have had a few, just like us, some have given up in finding that right person...

deeswYou people keep spouting that phrase like it's the golden fleece.

Yep! Because here it is. It's the motto of this site...you should try it!

[edit on 2/6/2005 by LadyV]

Originally posted by deesw

something is wrong somewhere, but it's not a choice I am on my way to putting you on ignore.....the motto here is deny ignorance....try it, you may learn something

Ignore me all you want, do you think you will hurt me? I haven't called anyone names and am behaving myself. I guess that the truth just stings a bit. I am simply giving my opinion like you are. These are the things I believe that I speak, if you do not want to believe or agree, then don't. This is a discussion board, I am discussing. How can you give your opinion and I not? Doesn't seem fair. If you think that noone's feelings are ever supposed to get hurt then think again. I carried my Bible to work one day, didn't have it open, wasn't reading it, wasn't discussing it, but it was on my desk. A women claiming to be a wiccan, and a group of others at my office complained that it offended them to see it. I was told to remove it or I was fired. Later on that week the wiccan brought a book of spells and was showing it around to people and offering advice on getting rid of boyfriends and illnesses by encantations, I complained to management and was again warned. Why are you people allowed to do what you wish, but we as Christians are constantly told we can't give our opinions, read our Bibles in public, or pray in public? Explain to me what's going on.
My Bible is offensive? Seeing two homosexual males making out in public is offensive to me, seeing a witch practicing openly is offensive to me. Until that time, I dealt with the offense, but now everytime you turn around someone is trying to take my liberties away from me. I will no longer be silent.
I love all people, there are just a few I do not like. The Bible does not command me to accept anyone, or like anyone. It simply commands that I love them. There is a big difference between like and love.

I so dislike when so called normal people talk about things that they believe in and think it is ok, but then get mad when any religious person says anything about their beliefs. It just blows my mind away how they are so hypocritical.


PS: I have not read this whole thread yet, but I soo feel where you are coming from and I am not even very religious.

.
I am pretty sure it comes from the developing embryo brain. At a certain critical stage if it gets a testosterone wash [male or female] it will be attracted to females. If it does not it will be attracted to males. [Note: this wash has a harsh effect on the brain, shrinking the Corpus Callosum among other things]

I don't think you will find a gay gene or genes persey. Only genes that have some effect on hormones during embryo development. That would fit with it being more prevelant in certain families without being absolute.

People always say being gay is a choice. My only logical conclusion is that they must be bi-sexual. Completely heterosexual people would not see it as a choice, completely gay people would not see it as a choice. The only people capable of satisfactorily selecting their sex partners gender would be bi-sexual people.

The only people calling homosexuality a sin are self professed sinners.

I do not adhere to your Christian/Islamic/Jewish cult and am therefore not a sinner.

To the intelligent, Shalom.
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