Entire (all 100) US Senate called to White House briefing with Sec of State/Defense, others

originally posted by: AnonyMason
a reply to: Sagacity

Having all of the senate join him in the white house points towards more drastic steps being taken.... Because of the media flood I haven't been able to find firm date on the last time (if ever) thats happened.... reddit suggests it wasn't since 1950. With that in mind I would consider this move to be something more than just 'informing' the Senate about further sanctions... The problem with sanctions is that it's up to China to enforce those sanctions... and since China really does whatever they want matter how they want to sugar coat it in their various and extensive diplomatic circles? No this is not an informative meeting.

Or it's just theater. You're basically gathering people in a room to tell them something.

It's more government waste since the people briefing congress could just get ferried to congress. Having the senate come to the Whitehouse requires a lot of expensive logistics, like security and transportation. But hey, it's just the people's money, right?

a reply to: icanteven

I understand that point of view, and the opinion is noted.

The following is my opinion. Having all 100 Senators attend the White House for a classified meeting regarding North Korea is not just theater. My best guess is that Trump wants to flex on North Korea. The simplified version of the meeting this afternoon? US heads of state are planning out a war campaign that can cripple North Korea as rapidly as possible that causes the least damage to our friends in South Korea.

We'll know more about that this afternoon. Also, we're 'testing' a Minuteman missile out of California. That should paint a nice little picture for Pyongyang and send them a not too vague reminder.

Pyongyang has been taunting the States for a while and now there is a President in command who does not take trollery very well. The US will taunt Pyongyang right back, or openly threaten, depending on how one looks at the situation. Either way you prefer to look at it what's happening right now between the US and the DPRK is not pleasant. I've been hoping for a diplomatic solution to this whole mess but more and more that possibility seems to have been thrown out the window.

In like a lion out like a lamb.

I was expecting world war 3 today.

I guess no news is good news.

a reply to: icanteven

To further add to this rapidly deteriorating sh**show China's Korea policy in tatters as both North and South defy sanctions.

When you consider that it's China who is supposed to be enforcing UN sanctions on the DPRK you'll eventually see that China has had different plans for them all along. The US wants to limit them economically with the goal of forcing them into another disarmament/nonproliferation agreement. China wanted to bolster their economy with trade and hope to placate Pyongyang by offering them a seat at the big boy table of Asia. That was, of course, until Pyongyang decided to slap China square in the face and keep behaving like unruly children with very big fireworks.

Now China has been put into a position where they have to keep Washington happy. Unhappy Trumpy means unhappy Chinese economy.

Even more dynamic is this: within days there will be a radar system in South Korea that's strong enough to keep tabs on China.

The fluidity of everything happening right now is hard to keep up with. On paper and in theory we have decent diplomatic relations with China. In practice and regarding the UN: if China is supposed to enforce sanctions against North Korea and an agreement is signed with the UN to do so, that agreement isn't worth the paper it was printed on because the Chinese are not wanting to play the 'America first' game. Even if they're pissed off at Kim Jong-un. Eventually they're going to have to decide. Either they take a back seat and the US military does the talking.. in which case the Chinese can hope to negotiate some kind of control after the dust settles and the bodies are picked up. OR, they really side with the US based n our economic ties to each other and take a hard line enforcing UN sanctions against the Norks, which it may be too late for anyway. SNAFUBAR

The fruit of war is ripe for the picking and two of the three branches of government are meeting about it within hours. Chinese diplomacy is failing, military buildup and posturing all around the peninsula from EVERYONE (China, the Norks, the US, the Russians). It's a perfect storm scenario rushing towards a violent confrontation. I really feel the worst for the South Koreans, though. They stand to lose the most and from the outside looking in it appears they're being played as the pawn. U.S. starts ‘swiftly’ installing controversial antimissile battery in South Korea

Isn't this fun?

originally posted by: whywhynot
a reply to: Indigo5

I think that the War Powers Act of 1973 gives him all the power he needs. With N. Korea making threats to blow us up and with their race to get nuclear ICBMs it's a credible threat.

How?

Even the strike on Syria was considered a violation of the War Powers Act of 1973?

originally posted by: neo96
In like a lion out like a lamb.

I was expecting world war 3 today.

I guess no news is good news.

Trump isn't even going to be there..

This appears a show..

a reply to: Indigo5

There wasn't much appealing about Donald in the first place.... I hope for his sake and our country's that he isn't using this as another dog and pony show for the press. There better be a damn good reason for it because if he wanted a photo op it would have been a easier to put five or six people in a limo and drive to capitol hill...

I seriously hate that guy. This better be a real meeting.

a reply to: AnonyMason

You're writing excellent balanced posts and links on this > keep it up .

What about the Russian side of the affair then ?

Maybe they're being shown the bunkerings or tunnels to them from the WH which Obama put in .
"Here are the bathrooms , " etc . "This is the presidential suite .. "

"This is the hospital morgue ..."

originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: neo96
In like a lion out like a lamb.

I was expecting world war 3 today.

I guess no news is good news.

Trump isn't even going to be there..

This appears a show..

Actually several people in various Senate offices (aides) as well as a few reporters, have mentioned that although this is a Senate run meeting they feel the meeting may be occurring in the White House so that Trump can "pop in" and attend without being formally scheduled to appear at the meeting. I apologize as I don't have links at the moment as I've read multiple releases and every media source is really spamming. Just too much to dig back through. But It's out there. A few reports also stated that the meeting was going to occur at the typical area reserved for such meetings at the House and the Trump offered that they come over to the White House... well the building right next door actually I believe.

Trump will be there at some point, I'm pretty sure of that.

originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: whywhynot
a reply to: Indigo5

I think that the War Powers Act of 1973 gives him all the power he needs. With N. Korea making threats to blow us up and with their race to get nuclear ICBMs it's a credible threat.

How?

Even the strike on Syria was considered a violation of the War Powers Act of 1973?

There's been a good bit of discussion regarding the War Powers Act in some other NK threads. ( We have alot of them don't we ?)

My take on it is this... All recent Presidents of both parties have cited and used the War Powers Act while conducting single strikes and "limited" military action for decades. Most if not all have been challenged, but no legal action has ever been taken that prevented the use of that military action. Wikipedia has some good information on it regarding the Act. Also National Review has two fairly good articles, one that supports the WPA of 73 with regards to Syria, and one that feels it was violated:

One take

Another

Honestly, whether it was in violation or not, there are multiple precedents for decades of it's use for strikes just like Syria.

As for getting back on the topic of NK, I believe the President is moving toward getting appropriate authorizations from the Senate and House now to avoid relying on the War Powers Act. I wouldn't rule out a strike before he received such Congressional approval if NK crossed whatever line the White House has in mind currently. Right now it sure looks like any ICBM launch/test or Kim pressing the button on the nuke test may be that line. We'd certainly strike immediately if any actual attack occurred of course.

a reply to: ZIPMATT

I appreciate that, ZIPMATT.

The short summary on Russia can be done in one word: silence.

The Kremlin has maintained diplomatic relations with the DPRK publicly since 2000. That isn't surprising when you consider that among the KCNA's (official state sponsored media of North Korea kcna.kp) list of officially recognized allies Russia was at the very top next to China. Russia also owns the largest foreign embassy of any allowed in Pyongyang: Embasy of Russia Contact Information

This position as top ally is for several reasons. One, the Kremlin is invested in the economy of the DPRK. So much so that Russian money backed the expansion of several railways that connect the two countries. Russia, like China, also sells oil to the Norks and have a vested interest in maintaining the North Koreans energy development... even if that development only expands as far as them purchasing more oil from Siberia. Their role in the North's oil imports spikes dramatically when Pyonyang and Beijing aren't seeing eye to eye... the result of course is the DPRK purchases more from it's Russian friends. Two, small groups of North Korean students comprised mostly of engineers are allowed to study at Russian universities. On a similar note North Korea also send cheap labor into Siberia when there are Russian construction projects going on there. Pyongyang is happy to embrace Moscow as it's friend.

On the other side of the coin is Moscow's hope (like China) to reign in Pyongyangs belligerent attitude towards nuclear proliferation. They were a participant in the Six Party Talks on North Korean nuclear disarmament, even tho their ability to influence North Korea remained minimal.

While many analysts have assumed that Russia’s deepened alliance with North Korea is a merely a symbolic display of anti-American defiance, a closer examination of Russian conduct reveals a more far-reaching strategic agenda. If Moscow proves to be an effective mediator in the Korean peninsula, Putin will be able to entrench Russia’s position as a major power broker in the Asia-Pacific region for years to come.

Source

Despite the diplomatic romance between them, Russia takes a firm line with the DPRK when it comes to threatening other nations with nuclear annihilation.

“We consider it to be absolutely impermissible to make public statements containing threats to deliver some ‘preventive nuclear strikes’ against opponents,” the Russian foreign ministry said in response to North Korea’s threats. “Pyongyang should be aware of the fact that in this way the DPRK will become fully opposed to the international community and will create international legal grounds for using military force against itself in accordance with the right of a state to self-defense enshrined in the United Nations Charter,”

Russia warns North Korea over threats of nuclear strike

We can gather that Russia and China share the same boat when it comes to the DPRK. Both are trying to bolster the economy, and both are in the business of providing the with fuel and trade agreements. They also have an interest in expanding their influence into the South and are aware that to do so means that Kim Jong-un can't be making threats or brandishing his small nuclear arsenal.

Most recently, as a move to annoy the US and the UN, in my opinion, Moscow reportedly threatened to veto the motion, despite its support from all 14 other members of the U.N. Security Council, including Pyongyang ally China, over the way it was worded.. It was no idle threat, they did veto the motion, later, despite Chinese support in the UN.

What does all this mean moving forward? It means that the US should tread carefully. Russia has started moving military equipment and personnel to the border it shares with North Korea. For what? To me the most logical answer would be to stem the flow of refugees should the situation turn kinetic. As far as becoming engaged in a military conflict between North Korea and the United States? Your guess is as good as mine. I don't think the Russians are ready to engage in WW3... but based on the tension already existing between Moscow the Washington DC over Syria and the fact that Russia is crapping all over anything the US tries to do in the UN? Who can say.

All i know is that this whole thing is ugly. All sides are aware that there is probably justifiable cause for military action against the DPRK but does anyone want to risk another world war over Kim Jong-un's bull snip attitude? I guess we'll find out soon.

originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: neo96
In like a lion out like a lamb.

I was expecting world war 3 today.

I guess no news is good news.

Trump isn't even going to be there..

This appears a show..

So anti-establishement Trump wants the whole of the establishment to gather in one place, but he's not going to be there...

Not at all worrying!

originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: neo96
In like a lion out like a lamb.

I was expecting world war 3 today.

I guess no news is good news.

Trump isn't even going to be there..

This appears a show..

That's fine. He didn't ask for the briefing. Mitch McConnell did on Monday morning. The MSM ignored the truth and painted it as Trump's meeting. Most people always fall for MSM spin/lies. That's why they'll never stop.

a reply to: AnonyMason

Another superb post - well worth asking . Just to bounce back your last point it does seem like Kim jonUn is a silly little beggar with far too much power due only to historical legacy, in world of professional diplomats who are probably rightly concerned about his full-on rhetoric and NKs potential to follow through .
I'd like to know why he/they totally hate America though . It's not as if there's any need nowadays . Did this hating of America start in the cold war / korean war era , or has the US done something which they can't ever forgive and forget ?

originally posted by: McGinty

originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: neo96
In like a lion out like a lamb.

I was expecting world war 3 today.

I guess no news is good news.

Trump isn't even going to be there..

This appears a show..

So anti-establishement Trump wants the whole of the establishment to gather in one place, but he's not going to be there...

Not at all worrying!

Aaahk!

You made me remember the season finale with Cercei Lanister and Game of Thrones!

Trump cannot be present at the meeting nor speak about the meeting. All information regarding the meeting have to be done through Spicer.

Trump is being watched. His movements, the meetings he attends, the people he meets. Everything the president does is a language to other world leaders, and also to the jittery stock markets. He cannot allow himself to be seen to be giving out the wrong signals, because others will put 2 and 2 together, and come up with five. All that a president does is interpreted as an intention...hence language.

He cannot be seen to purposefully provoke Kim Jong-un, as this would partially negate what he wants to achieve with North Korea in the eyes of those whose support he needs.

Kim jong-un is simply being a defiant little imp. He wants to play on the world stage as an equal, but everyone is boxing him in and not taking any notice of the child, except when he makes threats and has an international tantrum.. Somebody should hand him a dummy (pacifier) already!

Why hasn't North Korea conducted its sixth nuclear test? (CNN)

"A US official told CNN Tuesday that the military had observed significant activity at North Korea's Punggye-ri nuclear testing site, with a new digging effort at the tunnel entrance. The official said that this activity suggests a nuclear test is NOT imminent."

....

Nothing imminent perhaps...but maybe in the coming weeks to couple of months... as far as a nuke test...

originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: whywhynot
a reply to: Indigo5

I think that the War Powers Act of 1973 gives him all the power he needs. With N. Korea making threats to blow us up and with their race to get nuclear ICBMs it's a credible threat.

How?

Even the strike on Syria was considered a violation of the War Powers Act of 1973?

N. Korea is threatening the US with nuclear attack. If the President believes that it is a clear and present danger to the US or our allies then he may act in his capacity as Commander in Chief of our armed forces. End of story.

Yes there are partisans who will make claims that he doesn't have that power but they are not correct. In all these years there has been no successful challenge to this Presidential power and until there is one, it stands.

You may review the act easily by googling it.