A very simple question that seem to stumped both atheists and evolutionists alike.

a reply to: Noinden

Why don’t you use spirituality when you’re designing new pharmaceutical products?

a reply to: Woodcarver

I answered the question. Its a belief, a gnosis. I could be wrong. That is the answer you shall get. It is the honest answer. It is a gut feeling.

Now answer my questions as you are being insistent, but evasive.

I'm not going to engage deeply if you are unwilling to do the same.

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: Woodcarver

I answered the question. Its a belief, a gnosis. I could be wrong. That is the answer you shall get. It is the honest answer. It is a gut feeling.

Now answer my questions as you are being insistent, but evasive.

I'm not going to engage deeply if you are unwilling to do the same.

Those aren’t answers to my questions. Why do you have those beliefs?

a reply to: Woodcarver

My spirituality holds not place in making APIs (I don't make pills, that is formulation, I make the chemicals, that is API (active pharmaceutical) manufacture.

My job involves intellectual knowledge (εἶδειν eídein), the root from where "idea" comes from. I could pray to one of my gods, engage in magic, sacrifice gold or weapons to a lake, it does not matter.

Again, my spirituality is just that, a matter of spirit.

What if any experiences do you have with multiple (different) spiritual systems. You seem overly hostile towards them.

What is your hang up?

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: Woodcarver

I answered the question. Its a belief, a gnosis. I could be wrong. That is the answer you shall get. It is the honest answer. It is a gut feeling.

Now answer my questions as you are being insistent, but evasive.

I'm not going to engage deeply if you are unwilling to do the same.

insistent? But evasive? I have asked questions and you haven’t answered them.

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: Woodcarver

My spirituality holds not place in making APIs (I don't make pills, that is formulation, I make the chemicals, that is API (active pharmaceutical) manufacture.

My job involves intellectual knowledge (εἶδειν eídein), the root from where "idea" comes from. I could pray to one of my gods, engage in magic, sacrifice gold or weapons to a lake, it does not matter.

Again, my spirituality is just that, a matter of spirit.

What if any experiences do you have with multiple (different) spiritual systems. You seem overly hostile towards them.

What is your hang up?

What is spirit? What is spirituality? You are using vague words that really don’t have any real world value other than in fictional stories and beliefs right? Saying those words don’t really explain anything do they?

Did you say you talk to gods and do magic?

a reply to: Woodcarver

You seem to not be reading.

It
Is
A
Gut
Feeling.

My own set of beliefs are something based on my almost 45 years on the planet, and evolve with each new day of life. My gut tells me that what I believe is correct. Or at least correct to me. As a hard polytheist, I beleive that all gods are unique, but none are supreme. What I follow can be termed Ildiachas (Polytheism in Gaelic) or *Senistrognata (Ancestral ways in reconstructed proto- Celtic).

Like I said, I answered you. You did not like the answer. That is not my problem. I remain a scientist, even if you don't like my spirituality. I've even worked on evolutionary data when I reskilled a little in Bioinformatics. Published even My faith, does not influence my science. My science does not influence my faith. Neither need intersect. Its as if you can't grok that.

a reply to: Woodcarver

Yes I talk to Gods, dead spirits, I do what some would call magic (its a prayer form). I make offerings (weapons, gold, sliver, etc).

All stories end up fictional to some extent.

What occurred yesterday is history today, tomorrow it becomes legend, and the day after it becomes myth.

Spirituality is a series of beliefs, beliefs are generally unverifiable (I believe that XYZ is not the same as I have proof of XYZ, and you can verify that).

You are not going to get this, if you are going to remain hostile. I am not saying convert, or believe, but you are determined I am wrong. Thus you enter this with a conformation bias. A logical fallacy. QED

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: Woodcarver

You seem to not be reading.

It
Is
A
Gut
Feeling.

My own set of beliefs are something based on my almost 45 years on the planet, and evolve with each new day of life. My gut tells me that what I believe is correct. Or at least correct to me. As a hard polytheist, I beleive that all gods are unique, but none are supreme. What I follow can be termed Ildiachas (Polytheism in Gaelic) or *Senistrognata (Ancestral ways in reconstructed proto- Celtic).

Like I said, I answered you. You did not like the answer. That is not my problem. I remain a scientist, even if you don't like my spirituality. I've even worked on evolutionary data when I reskilled a little in Bioinformatics. Published even

My faith, does not influence my science. My science does not influence my faith. Neither need intersect. Its as if you can't grok that.

I mean, they can’t interact can they? They are literally incompatible, right? Lol.

Gut feeling indeed. You do know that gut feelings aren’t really a supernatural thing? Until you drop multiple gods into the mix, i guess. Is this more of like a system that you use to get through the day? Or do you literally talk to multiple gods? Are these traditional gods? Or did you make them up yourself?

a reply to: Woodcarver
How would you know? An honest atheist (and I was a non theistic pagan for a long time in my early teens (at a Christian School no less) and early 20s) would admit there is a chance gods exist. Just as an honest theistic person would admit that there is a chance there are no gods.

You seem to be missing the cues.

Let me help

Ildiachas (Polytheism in Gaelic)

I am what is known as a Celtic Reconstructionist. My deities are the deities of my preChristian Gaelic ancestors. These include the Tuatha de Dannan, Fir Blog, Manan Mac Lir (not one of the Tuatha) and a few of the Fomoirans. I've shown honor to other deities before too.

You really don't seem to be understanding how spirituality works here.

With that (possibly one more post if you've replied to another) I am out of here for the weekend. I'd rather spend time with my family than online.

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: Woodcarver
How would you know? An honest atheist (and I was a non theistic pagan for a long time in my early teens (at a Christian School no less) and early 20s) would admit there is a chance gods exist. Just as an honest theistic person would admit that there is a chance there are no gods.

You seem to be missing the cues.

Let me help

Ildiachas (Polytheism in Gaelic)

I am what is known as a Celtic Reconstructionist. My deities are the deities of my preChristian Gaelic ancestors. These include the Tuatha de Dannan, Fir Blog, Manan Mac Lir (not one of the Tuatha) and a few of the Fomoirans. I've shown honor to other deities before too.

You really don't seem to be understanding how spirituality works here.

With that (possibly one more post if you've replied to another) I am out of here for the weekend. I'd rather spend time with my family than online.

So you just try on new belief systems like trying on clothes? My question is still the same. Why do you believe these things?

I have no idea how spirituality works. It’s not like it’s a science. Everybody who uses that term has some different explanation for it so go ahead and explain exactly what you mean by spirituality and spirits. And I mean really explain it exactly how it works and what it is and why you believe it. Because it certainly seems like you think I should understand what it is, so obviously, this is just real easy to explain and i just haven’t heard, so, go ahead.

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: Woodcarver
How would you know? An honest atheist (and I was a non theistic pagan for a long time in my early teens (at a Christian School no less) and early 20s) would admit there is a chance gods exist. Just as an honest theistic person would admit that there is a chance there are no gods.

A chance? Like as in a percentage? How likely do you think it is? On a scale of 1 to 100, at what percentage do you place the likelihood of this being true? Please show your work and how you come to these conclusions?

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: Woodcarver

Yes I talk to Gods, dead spirits, I do what some would call magic (its a prayer form). I make offerings (weapons, gold, sliver, etc).

All stories end up fictional to some extent.

What occurred yesterday is history today, tomorrow it becomes legend, and the day after it becomes myth.

Spirituality is a series of beliefs, beliefs are generally unverifiable (I believe that XYZ is not the same as I have proof of XYZ, and you can verify that).

You are not going to get this, if you are going to remain hostile. I am not saying convert, or believe, but you are determined I am wrong. Thus you enter this with a conformation bias. A logical fallacy. QED

Hostile? You’re imagining things.

Why is it ok to believe in unverifiable things? Is it ok to believe in any ole thing? At which point do you put your foot down and not accept somebody’s claim?

This will go a lot smoother if you just answer the questions as honestly and as clearly as possible. You seem smart. You should not have a problem putting this in strict, scientific, easy to reproduce terms.

Thank you in advance.

You say, i won’t understand, but you act like i should understand this. You have simply not demonstrated this clearly enough for me to get it. Please help.

a reply to: Woodcarver

Why is it ok to believe in unverifiable things? Is it ok to believe in any ole thing? At which point do you put your foot down and not accept somebody’s claim?

I think the question here is... why is it Not ok to believe unverifiable things?

its impossible to verify a lot of things we see in the cosmos... and a lot of theories that exist today

perhaps one day we will be able to verify the existence of the spiritual realm... even other universes

why is this idea so far fetched to you?

Sure... we have no proof, but 100 years ago we didn't have "proof" that there were other planets around stars in distant galaxies either

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: Woodcarver

Why is it ok to believe in unverifiable things? Is it ok to believe in any ole thing? At which point do you put your foot down and not accept somebody’s claim?

I think the question here is... why is it Not ok to believe unverifiable things?

its impossible to verify a lot of things we see in the cosmos... and a lot of theories that exist today

perhaps one day we will be able to verify the existence of the spiritual realm... even other universes

why is this idea so far fetched to you?

Sure... we have no proof, but 100 years ago we didn't have "proof" that there were other planets around stars in distant galaxies either

If it ever make sense to believe in the spirit world’s and spirituality I’ll be the first to admit it. But until then it makes no sense to believe in those things. Do you really have to ask why it’s not OK to believe in things that don’t make sense? Is it OK to make laws based on these beliefs that don’t make sense?

a reply to: Woodcarver

If it ever make sense to believe in the spirit world’s and spirituality I’ll be the first to admit it.

Why doesn't it make sense to someone who believes in it?

It doesn't have to make sense to those that don't...

Do you really have to ask why it’s not OK to believe in things that don’t make sense?

yeah... what does it hurt to believe in a deity?

I supposed that may depend on what deity but still...lol

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: Woodcarver

If it ever make sense to believe in the spirit world’s and spirituality I’ll be the first to admit it.

Why doesn't it make sense to someone who believes in it?

It doesn't have to make sense to those that don't...

Do you really have to ask why it’s not OK to believe in things that don’t make sense?

yeah... what does it hurt to believe in a deity?

I supposed that may depend on what deity but still...lol

So pretty much anybody can have any belief and you just accept that it’s valid because they believe it.? What if their belief impedes you in some way? Do they still get to practice their belief?

If it’s OK to believe in things that don’t make sense, that doesn’t give you any foundation to stand on, up can be down, one can be three, and pretty much nobody can argue any point. All points of view are valid In your model.

a reply to: Woodcarver

So pretty much anybody can have any belief and you just accept that it’s valid because they believe it.?

nah...

but they are welcome to their beliefs, whatever they may be

What if their belief impedes you in some way?

then there is a serious problem...

Do they still get to practice their belief?

Sure...

apparently they just have me standing in their way.. *shrug*

If it’s OK to believe in things that don’t make sense, that doesn’t give you any foundation to stand on, up can be down, one can be three, and pretty much nobody can argue any point. All points of view are valid In your model.

Ah but beliefs can be many things... including nonsense

a reply to: Akragon

And how can we tell nonsense from reason?

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: Woodcarver

If it ever make sense to believe in the spirit world’s and spirituality I’ll be the first to admit it.

Why doesn't it make sense to someone who believes in it?

It doesn't have to make sense to those that don't...

Do you really have to ask why it’s not OK to believe in things that don’t make sense?

yeah... what does it hurt to believe in a deity?

I supposed that may depend on what deity but still...lol

I guess it really depends on what philosophy that deity is being used to reinforce. Seems like some gods have a way of twisting our perspective on things like neighborly love and civil rights.