One more week to March 18 Medjugorje date: true or false, in the 100th Fatima anniversary

originally posted by: 2012newstart
a reply to: Kohll

I respect the man and believe he knows quite a lot, more than I do. That's why I constantly quote it all over my recent threads. But he is a human and he might not know everything too. John Paul II didn't, as he and Ratzinger mistakenly messed the year 2000 with the end of the century...of Fatima.

There was no mistake. They waited for Fr. Martin to die in 1999, and then played a shell game with the Third Secret just months after his death. In 2000 the Vatican released the alleged text. In Ratzinger's commentary that went along with the release, he cites to only one scholar, Fr. Dhanis, someone who suggested Sr. Lucia may have engaged in "unconscious fabrication." What they released was apparently a separate vision of Sr. Lucia that she had mailed to the Vatican.

And you raised the question, how do we know it was Fr. Martin telling the truth. Well, a lot of reasons, actually. After the Vatican released what they claimed was the Third Secret in 2000, it was quickly determined by experts to be completely inconsistent with the known facts. What the Vatican released was about 62 lines and not in the form of a letter. To begin with, Bishop Venancio, the person entrusted to transport the Secret to the Vatican, noted that the secret was written on a single sheet of paper of about 25 lines. He provided measurements for the margins of the paper as well. Cardinal Ottaviani also said publicly that it was written on a single sheet of paper. Guess who else said this? Fr. Martin on the radio, referring to a one-page letter that he read.

What the Vatican released in 2000 was not in the form of a letter. In this case, aside from Fr. Martin we have it from Sr. Lucia herself in an early interview with a Fr. Jongen from 1946 in which she made it clear it was communicated in the form of a letter. That's not to mention the Vatican's own press release from 1960 in which they stated in reference to the Third Secret, "[I]t is most likely that the letter will never be opened...".

This is just a sample and it's clear as a bell who was telling the truth and who wasn't.

a reply to: Kohll

I have followed all that, thanks for clarifying for the readers. However it doesn't prove that Malachi Martin got the original. May be close enough copy. The story he was behind the closed door to listen...

More intriguing is why the Vatican of John Paul II and Ratzinger decided to published an entire forgery. The handwriting of "Lucia" doesn't match. There are websites, was it Traditioncatholic or others, or Fatima crusader, forgot who, that posted detailed research on the handwriting by professional specialists and the conclusion was: the person who wrote the official release in year 2000 was not sister Lucia.

The worst is however the text itself. It calls for a mega sacrifice, not only of one pope but of unknown scores of priests and laymen. Together with the words of John Paul in Fulda, it comes clear those in hierarchy of yesterday didn't see it necessary to SAVE the population rather prepare it for a mega sacrifice, contrary to the free will and choice that population would make if it knew the secret. That attitude has nothing Christian in it. Christian is to sacrifice oneself for the flock, not to send the flock to sure death without saying anything. And if it is just one battle, one city, we may say, "that was the will of God"...but if it concerns the entire earth, then certainly it is not the will of God all to die. Because then there won't be Christianity as well as humans.

Some will say, but it is not God it is the evil people with the nuclear weapons...Well we don't know in first place what is in the secret. It might be much worse than the Neues Europa that talks of WW3, as Malachi Martin said the core element (of what he knows as 3rd secret) is not found even in the so drastic version of Neues Europa.

It is worth to listen carefully to Martin, with a grain of salt who had the interest to leak it thru the honest Martin to the public 20 years later.

originally posted by: markosity1973

You've just described the general scam of all religion - live a crap life of suffering and no fun and in return you might get to live forever. The only problem is that you'll first have to die to find out.

Dig a little deeper into these prophesies and you will see another pattern - someone is trying to, via spiritual teachings, influence humanity into a simpler way of life to save the planet.

To save the planet, or to PREVENT the believers to escape on time. Time will be short. Insiders speak of only two weeks maximum 3 of forewarning of whatever event approaches. Someone wants to sacrifice maximum people and that someone cannot be Virgin Mary or God. Because most people who live today did not choose their fate, neither did they sin so grossly to deserve it. Some sinned enough to deserve it, but not all.

a reply to: 2012newstart

Seems Mirjana Soldo puts all her weight behind the date March, 2017

Wayne Weible's Medjugorje Newsletter, October 2016 states, “The link of the two sites will occur in March 2017, according to Medjugorje visionary, Mirjana.” I asked the newsletter about this and was told, "This comment was taken from Mirjana speaking with a group of pilgrims last month in Medjugorje. Also in her book she refers to March 18 but the 2017 comment was taken from her verbal comment."

...
Fatima and Medjugorje.

motheofgod.com/threads/medjugorje-march-18th-2017.9602/page-2

If it fails let they blame no one else but themselves. Should we give 13 more days to Medjugorje seers until March 31? 35+ years are enough of waiting!

Someone asked me, would I deny Fatima if it fails to fulfill by October 13, 2017? Yes I would! I don't care if it fulfills after 150 years! I am not obliged to believe it (as the dogmas) and my eternal salvation DOES NOT DEPEND on private revelations, be they approved by the Church (Fatima) or not (Medjugorje, Garabandal). It depends on the acceptance of Jesus the Savior! Much was said how the world lost grace, or spirituality and "finds it in Medjugorje" (JPII). Let boldly say, that is not a dogma, and the popes could err too.

If Medjugorje is true, let it show it by March 18, ok let it be by March 25 the Annunciation, although for a 35 year long private apparition a week more shouldn't matter.

If some folks think that Virgin Mary came to Fatima to announce the coming Bolshevik revolution, so to say, predicted it a month earlier, let they check the history again. The revolution started half a year earlier and culminated in October (November 7 Gregorian calendar).


You may follow hour by hour the history of the revolution that started months before October 1917, carried out by RT in "live tweets" 100 years later. Time to pause and make reflection

www.rt.com...

14 March 1917

After dinner with the local command, Nicholas refuses to become a constitutional monarch, arguing that such a move is pointless, because he has a “duty to God,” and will not waver in surrendering the responsibility for running things to any sort of committee or democratically chosen official.


13 March 1917

A second telegram from Moscow is received in Petrograd: “Moscow is in the midst of a total revolution.”

By 9pm Petrograd time, there are two official governments in Petrograd: the War Committee, headed by Engelgardt, and the Social Democrats’ own Committee. A decision has now been made between the two to work together and form a united body.

edit on 15-3-2017 by 2012newstart because: (no reason given)

Pope John Paul II in Fulda Germany

The October 1981 issue of the German magazine Stimme des Glaubens reported on a discussion that Pope John Paul II had with a select group of German Catholics, in November of 1980. The following is a verbatim report of the discussion www.fatima.org...

(other sources say, a group of German Catholic bishops. Indeed, it would be very strange if John Paul talked that openly to a random group of catholics.)

Text of the Published Report The Holy Father was asked, "What about the Third Secret of Fatima? Should it not have already been published by 1960?"

Pope John Paul II replied: "Given the seriousness of the contents, my predecessors in the Petrine office diplomatically preferred to postpone publication so as not to encourage the world power of Communism to make certain moves.

On the other hand, it should be sufficient for all Christians to know this: if there is a message in which it is written that the oceans will flood whole areas of the earth, and that from one moment to the next millions of people will perish, truly the publication of such a message is no longer something to be so much desired."

The Pope continued: "Many wish to know simply from curiosity and a taste for the sensational, but they forget that knowledge also implies responsibility. They only seek the satisfaction of their curiosity, and that is dangerous if at the same time they are not disposed to do something, and if they are convinced that it is impossible to do anything against evil."

The Holy Father was then asked: "What is going to happen to the Church?"

He answered: "We must prepare ourselves to suffer great trials before long, such as will demand of us a disposition to give up even life, and a total dedication to Christ and for Christ … With your and my prayer it is possible to mitigate this tribulation, but it is no longer possible to avert it, because only thus can the Church be effectively renewed. How many times has the renewal of the Church sprung from blood! This time, too, it will not be otherwise. We must be strong and prepared, and trust in Christ and His Mother, and be very, very assiduous in praying the Rosary."

That text shows the double standard the Catholic hierarchy played all the time, even holy persons like St John Paul II.

Many questions can be asked: how for example the Communism would be emboldened by revelation of a religious secret, if the communists didn't believe religion, even less apparitions of virgin Mary that are not believed by the Orthodox church either? Perhaps the secret involves something quite non religious, some facts that are valid for all humanity.

Second part, if the oceans will flood whole areas of the earth and millions people will die, then...we don't desire to publish it...

That is to say, the Catholic hierarchy was ready to let those millions die but not to lose its own interest and power.

I don't know what the message is, does it involve some extraterrestrials who already contacted Russia etc. Could they provide salvation to the world for example. And the Catholic church fears that will ruin its own authority in the post cataclysmic world saved by ET?

"and that is dangerous if at the same time they are not disposed to do something, and if they are convinced that it is impossible to do anything against evil."

What is evil then, if John Paul prefers to let millions die without telling them all options, and at the same time insists he is doing that to save them from the so called evil, that otherwise they would be convinced it would be impossible to resist?

Should we redefine what the evil is, named as such by the Catholic hierarchy (at that time) if that hierarchy apparently prefers its own interests and power than the survival of millions of human beings?

The publication of the forged third secret version in year 2000 shows exactly that trend. The Catholic hierarchy is concerned for its own martyrdom MORE than for the option millions of people to die from one moment to the other, as the words of John Paul in Fulda clearly speak of.

The conclusion paragraph of John Paul "We must prepare ourselves to suffer great trials before long, such as will demand of us a disposition to give up even life,... it is no longer possible to avert it, because only thus can the Church be effectively renewed."

He has decided on behalf of the billion wide church we have to give up our lives for the renewal of that church...Why is no longer possible to avert it? Because the Church needs the sacrifice to be renewed... DAMN IT!


After decades passed at the 100th anniversary, and when many catholics from different background understand they have been LIED all that time, it is a time to see whether the CURRENT Vatican wants to play clean and take the interest of survival of humanity first instead of its own interest of power control, or will continue the deceit by its predecessors.

As I said, may be ET havce contacted Russia that's why the boldness of communism at that time, that is my assumption derived from excluding all other options that we know of: WW3, asteroid etc. that are pretty well published everywhere in details. The only thing the Churches still don't speak about is the extraterrestrial issue.

Another strong argument is ex-president and current PM Medvedev spoke openly on the issue, even though in a "joke mode", admitting there are ET personals residing on Russian territory.

I don't discuss their polarity here, before we know anything more detailed about them. John Paul II if he knew it, went too far branding whatever is inside that secret as apriori evil but without telling us what it is. He must know it, because mgr Corrado Balducci Vatican exorcist started giving interviews about ET life during the pontificate of John Paul II. And published Neues Europa version in Osservatore Romano weeks before the election of John Paul II. Such things are not done by one's own decision in the strictest theocratic monarchy on earth that is the Holy See.

That doesn't mean the presumed ET in Russia are the only ones who contacted the Earth. There are volumes of info online speaking of US, British, Latin American etc contacts of different ET races.

My view, not based on Fatima texts: should the world cataclysm come and the only option to be saved is to choose ET rescue, we will be given the option to choose between ET races and given the knowledge of them in advance. May be that's why the internet technology advanced so much for so short time, to be able to make informed decision.

Another option is, the different ET races have divided the Earth with its several major religious and ethnic groups to take care of each of them, and will play in accord to each other (even if they had struggles in the past, as the secret history of Sumer and others tell us). I don't know what the real case scenario will be.

When I watch Star Wars Rebels the easiness of boarding ships and encountering different planets, both good and not so good, I think the time when that option will be given to our kids and ourselves is not far off.

In 4 days will you shut up?
Either way?

a reply to: Phage

why dont you go pour your BS somewhere else, troll?

Vikings - Avengers. One of the races that Holywood promoted openly.

Are they good? Coming to help us? On God's side? By their deeds you will know them, said Jesus.

a reply to: 2012newstart

So, that would be a "no?"
No matter what happens, or not, you'll keep yapping.

originally posted by: 2012newstart

10th jubilee or 50th anniversary of OCCUPATION of Jerusalem.

Other than the above typo that I've corrected for you, that was an interesting read

As the things are of today, March 15th 2017, I do not see any real chance for the Warning and Miracle to happen in 2017, therefore before the Chastisement and before an era of peace by the end of October, according to all expectations of Fatima. Therefore, a review of all contemporary Catholic prophecies is needed...

The Rapture is a possibility that is all inside the hands of God.

a reply to: Phage

what is your problem, guy? If you don't want to hear me just please don't visit here. Forum is for writing reasonable responses, if one has what to say on topic. But you know that, and you know why you are here. Only, I am not here because of you.

a reply to: jamespond

A point of view...thanks for the thanks!

Have been thinking about this.

For as long as I can recall, the doomsayers have been doom saying. And I wonder why Mary just does not get on the Internet and speak freely. Why does she use children and very fallible humans to relay her message? She knows some of them will get her message wrong. Is it a test?

Maybe she does not know how to communicate in ways we can understand? Can aliens know how to talk to us? I mean, my dogs get frustrated that I don't understand what they ask for.

a reply to: katfish

comments like that make the stay in ab0vetopsecret worthy its time...besides the mission everyone of us have...

While I don't know the answer, seems Mary speaks all languages and reads hearts and minds. Then, probably, it is different groups of people who believe and who do not. Many do not accept the message.

Providing we are talking of a real Virgin Mary and not of some alien agenda.

Medjugorje just got a favorable review by appointed cardinal observer of the shrine. Tens of millions have visited it during the years.

If you check the counters of videos of such topics they rarely surpass 300,000. That is to say, the real number of people who care is slightly over the Biblical 144,000. Does it mean those first activists will have a special role, as Revelation speaks about? As I mentioned Rapture, there are views although not so many, that the Rapture will have more than one waves.

If these apparitions fail to guess correctly the sequence of events promised for generations, then something other will fill the vacuum. Perhaps ET contact or Disclosure, as prominent pop-star turned UFOlogist said it would happen in the next 60 days. www.express.co.uk...

a reply to: 2012newstart

a reply to: Phage

Maybe you can learn some manners in 4 days?

Many of us enjoy reading 2012newstart's threads, if you do not, then ignore them or keep your rude comments to yourself.

People ask why the messages are not given more incontrovertibly: perhaps the message has to be given in such a manner that it can be disbelieved so as to not affect human free will?

What I found interesting with Malachi Martin's radio shows was when he said the third secret involved the Ukraine; seemed an odd country to mention in the late 1990's.