Wrongly Demonized - Promoters of Goodness & Freedom - Knights Templar, Freemasonry, & Illuminati

a reply to: surfer_soul

originally posted by: surfer_soul
a reply to: Sahabi

It's completely true, and indeed a tragic shame. All this battling over peoples hearts and minds, if only the the protagonists could reconcile their own hearts and minds, or ego's and hearts more like it...

I agree! The best way to secure a brighter future is for the individual to uplift and reconcile themselves under goodness. The individual effects the family, neighborhood, and workplace. These effect cities, states, and nations. These go on to effect the entire world. The world improves with one single person at a time

Templar Banking

I don't know if the point is getting lost in my large posts, but to reiterate:

• There is absolutely no contemporary evidence that the Templars practiced usury, blasphemy, or immorality.

• These rumors originate solely with King Philip IV's inadmissible and corrupt inquisitions.

• There is historic evidence that the Templars are fully innocent of these false inquisition charges: Chinon Parchment

a reply to: tikbalang

I agree. Unless one is a genius prodigy, not too many arts or crafts can be mastered in a short time. Work, dedication, and development are needed to reach mastery.

The Greater Mysteries are indeed beautiful! It's almost ironic that the intangible and immaterial are nearly impossible to articulate without corrupting it with one's own experiences and interpretations.

originally posted by: tikbalang
a reply to: Sahabi

" A mason must never take pride in his work, a Masons work holds a lifetime, but he can never enjoy the fruit, even the simplest of ways or the greatest of deeds, must come from the character within. "

I enjoyed the work you made, cause i have use for it with when i sit with Father Time..

Thank you for sharing that quote!

a reply to: Sahabi

How do you square some of the explicit narrative inside the Masons oath ? Cutting out the tongue and buried awaiting the tides ?. I don't know for sure its there but I have read it many times from other people .

a reply to: the2ofusr1

Great question! I am glad you brought it up.

The true secrets of Freemasonry are not only guarded by oaths of secrecy, but also by allegorical veiling.

"Freemasonry is a peculiar system of morality veiled in allegory and illustrated by symbols.”

Even if the uninitiated were given the entirety of Freemasonry, they would barely comprehend the true teachings because they would be viewing things literally instead of allegorically.

I will not go into full detail because of the fidelity entrusted to me, however, any wording of any oaths also falls into the category of allegory, and not to be taken literally. There are further layers of insights buried within and beneath the literal wordings.


Edit To Add:
In childhood, we used to say; "Cross my heart and hope to die, stick a needle in my eye," without ever intending this to be taken literally.

a reply to: Sahabi

So are you saying that some Masons don't take the allegory literal ?

a reply to: the2ofusr1

a reply to: the2ofusr1

Giving one's word to confide the teachings is literal. I can not say what other Freemasons think, for I do not know the contents of another person's mind. But I do know that there is no substantial evidence that anyone has ever been harmed for breaking their oaths.

In all of the history of former Freemasons divulging the secrets of the Craft (there are tons), The Morgan Affair stands alone as the only allegation of penalizing an oath breaker. The circumstances are extremely controversial, with conflicting reports, one of which accused Freemasons of allegedly paying-off William Morgan, however, anti-Freemasons did launch unsubstantiated allegations of foul play. No evidence of foul-play has ever been uncovered.

It is interesting to note that, during the time-period of the Morgan Affair, fellow Freemason and President of the United States; Andrew Jackson, was fighting long and hard to kill the current Central Bank. He succeeded in taking down the central bank; "The Second Bank of the United States".

Interestingly enough, while the fight was ongoing to stop the central banks, spontaneously the Anti-Masaonic Party appeared, which incited anti-Masonic sentiments among the general population. It was during this moment in time when the Morgan Affair arose.


• The Morgan Affair (Grand Lodge of British Columbia and Yukon)

• The Morgan Affair (Anti-Masonry Points of View)

a reply to: Sahabi

How is the Masonic flock guarded against 5 column unawares ...Do they have a kind of Sargent and do they have a board to govern ? Do the members get elected up or is there a promotion from the top down ?

a reply to: the2ofusr1

You always seem to help spark great discussion and intelligent critical thinking. Thank you for your contributions!


Fifth Column intruders are not much of a concern, because there isn't much influence to usurp. Lodges and Freemasonic leaders do not attempt to direct members' actions outside of the Lodge, other than carrying themselves with respect and dignity.

There are no decrees or suggestions as to which political ideology, party, or politicians to support,... nor any influence as to which religion, denomination, church, or preacher to support.

Because activities outside the Lodge are not directed, any person within a Lodge attempting to orchestrate outside, political, or criminal activities will be recognized immediately and flagged.

This was the case for Lodge Propaganda Due (P2). This particular Lodge became illegal and rogue, as its charter was suspended and revoked by the Grand Orient of Italy.

The criminal activities of P2 leader; Licio Gelli, were well outside the bounds of Freemasonry's blessings, as this Lodge was eschewed and ostracized, with Licio Gelli being expelled from Freemasonry by the Grand Orient of Italy in 1976.

Additionally, the teachings, ceremonies, and etiquettes of Freemasonry are established in dated Constitutions, By-Laws, and Landmarks. Any deviation from standards would be immediately recognized and flagged.



Freemasonic leadership is democratically elected and organized by working one's way up, demonstrating Freemasonic knowledge, and progressing through the various Officer positions.

a reply to: Sahabi

Ok so you may have figured I might get to this point . What can you tell me about

I enjoyed your posts most about the founding fathers and the modern era. But on esoterica I sometimes thought you were misguided. Also the ancient part was very hamfisted.

You are a Mason are you not?

a reply to: Sahabi

a reply to: the2ofusr1

Another juicy one!!! I've always been curious about, and fascinated with, the Israeli Supreme Court building. It's design is extremely different and unique, as compared to other traditional buildings,... it's difficult to ignore.



I want to start by mentioning that the Freemasonic monument in the video is not part of the Supreme Court complex:



This monument is located in southern Eilat, Israel, near the Israel-Egypt border. It sits in a traffic circle on Highway 90, while the Supreme Court Building is located in Jerusalem, in the Givat Ram district.

The video's inclusion of this monument, without any reference, gives the false impression that it is directly related to the Supreme Court complex.



I would definitely flag the Rothschilds as one of the major organizers, if not the top, of the N.W.O. movement. It appears as though the Rothschild Family are one of the greatest patrons of the State of Israel. Beyond the plethora of other Israeli funding projects, the Rothschilds are also noted for:

• The original Balfour Declaration, which promises a National Jewish Homeland in the Levant, is addressed to Walter Rothschild, 2nd Baron de Rothschild.

• James Armand Edmond de Rothschild helped to fund the construction of the current Knesset building.

• James de Rothschild's wife; Dorothy de Rothschild, lobbied for and funded the current Supreme Court building.



Now, back to the Supreme Court building,...

Ram Karmi and his sister; Ada Karmi-Melamede, are the main designers and architects of this project. In numerous reports and interviews, they have stated that the entirety of the building is a commemorative montage of major architectural styles throughout the history of the Promised Land, including inspiration from Herodian, Hellenistic, Greek Orthodox, and modern architecture.



It has been officially mentioned that the pyramid of the Supreme Court building was inspired by the Tombs of Zechariah and Absalom.



Personally, I need more official information before I'd feel comfortable making any definitive conclusions about the complex.

I do not see anything "Satanic" in the structure or complex, however, I do see lots and lots of aspects that can be taken as esoteric, occultic, and even perhaps pagan. There is an overwhelming use of Duality all throughout the building and complex.


The Supreme court of Israel and the illuminati (ATS Thread)

Supreme Court Built To Masonic Guidelines? (Arutz Sheva)

Sinister Sites - Israel Supreme Court (Vigilant Citizen)

a reply to: Sahabi

The video's inclusion of this monument, without any reference, gives the false impression that it is directly related to the Supreme Court complex.

Thanks for the reply and pointing that part out .It is actually a very compelling hook when thinking about the building . In the Know Your Enemy series on YT he has one vid on the building you might find interesting . Its a kind of walk around and through the complex . He does have a few vids on the Rothschilds that starts with this one but follows the history of the money and banking

a reply to: Sahabi

Thank You for your great post
I must admit I have only speed scanned it's totality

As soon as I got to the link for "Diogenes Lamp" Adam Weishaupt - I was hooked
Been searching for further writings of this great and oft misunderstood and maligned soul

So thanks once again ...

a reply to: chris_stibrany



Thank you chris_stibrany, for taking the time to check out the thread and commenting your opinions about it.

on esoterica I sometimes thought you were misguided.

I honestly appreciate your input, but I must strongly object to this specific criticism.

Can you please tell me what I said that you feel is misguided and/or incorrect?

The main-point of the OP Thread is to clear the Templars, Freemasonry, and Bavarian Illuminati of false rumors,... not to give a full exposé on esoterica.

For simplicity, trying to reduce thread length, and avoid taking away from the main point of the OP,... I decided to focus primarily on the interpretations related to the exoteric Lesser Mysteries and the Greater Mysteries that are substantiated by academic empirical-science. Focusing on these two interpretative aspects is not absolute or definitive, simply, I purposefully withheld other interpretations.

In esoteric matters, there are multiple levels and layers of meanings and interpretations to a single point, concept, word, and/or symbol.

I am a student and practitioner of esoterica and the mysteries. If there are any psychological, metaphysical, mystical, or celestial aspects of the Greater Mysteries that you would like to discuss, please don't hesitate to mention it.

Also the ancient part was very hamfisted.

I'm sorry you feel that way. As you can see, the thread body is enormous, and I had to make many cuts to condense the material. And even then, it still took up 19 posts. If the thread body extended beyond one-full page, I think that would have been far too much for the average forum audience.

The only point in the ancient information that I feel was crude was the listing of the ancient cults, religions, and mystery schools. I included links so that people could do their own research, because those topics are far too rich to summarize in a line or two.

Can you believe that just by listing the cults, religions, and mysteries without commentary, I ran out of character length in that post? To included detailed commentary on those belief systems would have probably added 2 or 3 more posts to the OP.

As the main point of the OP was to clear the false rumors associated with the Templars, Freemasonry, and the Bavarian Illuminati,... I made the conscious choice to sacrifice detailed commentary in OP post # 3/19

If there are any cults, religions, or mystery schools in the OP that you would like me to elaborate on or discuss in further detail, don't hesitate to mention it. Any topic in, or related to the OP is fair game, and more than welcome.

You are a Mason are you not?

I am a member of the; "International Order of Freemasonry for Men and Women, Le Droit Humain"



Once again, thank you!

Here, we have John McCain substantiating this thread, i.e., that the "New World Order" is a fairly new movement that has usurped the Novus Ordo Seclorum (New Order of the Ages):




"As we are all aware, that following World War II a World Order was established, which has held for basically the last 70 years





"This is a sign of a possible unraveling of the World Order that was established after World War II."





"70 years we have had a New World Order."





@ Timestamp 7:30

"I do believe that he [Trump] needs to stand up for the greatest experiment on Earth, and that is the United States of America. It's not an accident, we've had small wars, but unprecedented 70 years of peace since we established a New World Order following World War II. That's what we have to preserve."

a reply to: Sahabi

One of the comments I came across that kind of gave me pause for though was that Trump defeated both the Bush and the Clinton camps .Extending that thought forward it was not hard to imagine that to have TNWO would require a choice to both appease and control . The two party system of two sides of the same coin moving the people where they want to go or be is born out with the Hegelian dialectic . The thing for me personally is that Hegel describes what goes on in a spiritual sense .

Would any of Hegel have any component you can identify within yourself and your group ? I only ask because if true then remaining static is not a option and the discharge would manifest in a progressive direction .ie. past history and doctrines developing to something other then ...

The point of your op was not lost on me and has kind of freed me in a sense thanks

a reply to: Sahabi

This thread really should have well over 100 flags by now.

Not just because of the incredible OP, but also because Sahabi has been defending his research to those who have chosen to reply with hostility.

Wake up ATS! All the good threads are being white washed by politics!

a reply to: artistpoet

Hello artistpoet. Thank you for stopping by!!!

I felt very lucky to have found that free version of "Diogenes’ Lamp". There are three more English Language translations of Weishaupt's writings, but as far as I can tell, they aren't in the free public domain yet, still have to buy them:

• "A Brief Justification of My Intentions: Casting Light on the Latest Original Writings"
translated by Dr. Tony Page, Justice Publications, Amazon Kindle

• "Supplement to the Justification of My Intentions"
translated by Dr. Tony Page, Justice Publications, Amazon Kindle

• "The Secret School of Wisdom: The Authentic Rituals and Doctrines of the Illuminati"
translated by Jeva Singh-Anand, edited by Josef Wäges and Reinhard Markner, London: Lewis Masonic, 447 pp.

a reply to: ColdWisdom

Hiya ColdWisdom. Thank you for the bump and kind words.

I think the thread is a lot to take in. It touches many domains and fields,... and challenges so many different points of contention. The encompassing material of the thread stares directly in the face of countless other conspiracy theories and opinions, so naturally, this thread may be received with mental reservations. This is the kind of thread that we have to think about, research points and tangent-points for ourselves, let things stew, and see what results. The thread will just simmer