Satanic child abuse beyond belief.

a reply to: Char-Lee

So in essence you are saying that you would commit an assault if you saw that it was needed? Because an unasked for prayer is a spiritual violation.

Also your God has no say over my personal sovereignty. No seriously, you will need to prove you have the right to do this. Not say you do

So in essence you are ok with committing a crime if your God says so? Well then, you and these so called Satanists appear to be one and the same Yes I am being facetious

a reply to: Noinden

I am glad we were both created by the very same being.
Hugs.

a reply to: Char-Lee

That is the passive aggressive nonsense that has been mentioned. Your UPG is Unverifiable, just as my UPG is unverifiable. We have different beliefs.

I return to the fact you accuse these mythical Satanists of unethical behavior, yet condone it in the name of your little Jehovah.

a reply to: Noinden

Do you really see "praying for someone" and "touching someone" as being the same thing? Exactly the same? So if I wish you good will i.e. pray for you - you regard this as being akin - tantamount - to being touched?

That same logic would then mean that "thinking about having sex with someone" is the same as rape. But that would be absurd - most people would recognize such an absurdity.

a reply to: Astrocyte

I do indeed see unasked for attention, to be well unasked for. If I say "do not pray for me, I find that offensive" and you "pray for me". You would have gone against my wishes. On a spiritual level that would be in the very least a minor invasion of my personal space, perhaps more. Thus a violation. I'm not a pacifist, thus I warn people not to, or I will retaliate in kind I'm not adverse to spiritual conflict.

I am not misleading people about satanism. Its not my spiritual path either. Let me make this clear.

I am a Pàganachd, that is a polytheistic follower of the Pre-Chrstian Irish ways. To be Satanic, I'm either going to have to be a Humanist or an Abrahamic follower. Satan, Jehovah, Jesus etc are not my deities, antideities, or reborn demigods. It is clear you have no idea what my belief system is.

Let me make it clearer. The Satanic Panic of the 80s and 90s has been debunked. However many of my fellow pagans were caught up in it, and accused, wrongly of crimes. Most were acquitted.

Satanic ritual abuse on the scale that has been accused, has zero evidence. Thus Hitchen's Razor may be applied to the accusations. I am not a broken record, I am rational, and require proof. Not hearsay, not hysteria.

a reply to: Noinden

If I say "do not pray for me, I find that offensive" and you "pray for me".

If you "find that offensive" - however strange that may appear to me (it's good wishes; you'd think you'd want that, as most people do) I would respect that wish.

On a spiritual level that would be in the very least a minor invasion of my personal space, perhaps more. Thus a violation. I'm not a pacifist, thus I warn people not to, or I will retaliate in kind I'm not adverse to spiritual conflict.

I do believe you. I believe that you would harm another person over something as inconsequential as "I'll pray for you".

Personally, I don't seek revenge, not because I'm a squishy pacifist pu$$y, but because its a feedback loop. Both parties provoke one another into more and more extreme responses to the others effect upon you - so why even get tangled in it to begin with? To prove to others how strong you are? Even when I understand the systemic consequences - for myself, and society? Even when I know - as psychology knows - shame is the essential motivator for "getting back" at the other for "daring" to attack you? Seems - whats the word - "vain" "purposeless" to bother with all of that.

If you like competition, play a sport.

a reply to: Noinden

So I just looked up this concept "unverifiable personal gnosis".

The problem with this concept is obvious: if we share a common systemic structure i.e. were humans, why should it be assumed that some of us operate in radically disparate ways? Is it not more accurate to say that people "end up" where they are, and are usually persuaded by their egotism to make up terms like "unverifiable personal gnosis" to justify the strangness of their "spiritual knowledge"?

If you appreciated systems theory (which you apparently do not) this idea would come off as pure hogwash. But then again - neodarwinism still peddles the delusion that genes are "selfish", as opposed to operating in a system of 75 trillion cells that must, by necessity, correlate their activities in order to bring about a coherent state of organization.

So, if every human body (or dog body, or any other animal body) self-organize in a symmetrical manner, why would the Human being be so drastically different i.e. to experience other human beings in wildly disparate ways - such as conservatives and liberals.

Trauma. I know you probably don't care much for this concept, but the neuroanatomical and functional correlates of trauma have been discovered, and they explain very well how negative experiences become 'attractors' so that subsequent experiences use the trauma as a referent.

Now imagine you live in a world where everyone you meet is different. If you were raised by traumatized sociopaths, you would think that everyone functions just as you do - even though, in reality, your brain has stereotyped your awareness to a certain-wavelength - to expect competition, aggression, and negative feeling.

Trauma is THE scourge of our society. It is beyond frustrating to me how resistant some people are to acknowledging how their brains work: for instance, during prolonged negative experience, your periaquaductal grey releases endogenous opiods which blunt activity between the forebrain (orbitofrontal cortex) and the brainstem. This triggers a 'dissociative' state of derealization and depersonalization. Through this, the body becomes "other" - so that the system as a whole can be affected without the conscious mind (centered in the forebrain) even being aware of it. In this way, external cues from the environment act upon unconscious dynamics that move between the amygdala, striatum and the cerebrospinal tract towards the dorsal vagal complex, leading to a particular muscular state in the body that "corresponds" to the energy state of the brain. The dorsal vagal complex DEPRESSES functions - so, for instance, words you don't want to hear because of an unconscious association with negative affects are blunted by the PAG; the PAG is now always activated - and its molecules released - when the cue appears.

Don't you think religion, or philosophy, needs to adjust itself to accommodate these empirical results at the nexus of neuroscience and psychological trauma?

a reply to: Astrocyte

Ok I know you may not get this next bit, its just a different way of looking at it. SO ....

As a hard polytheist, I view all gods as real. None as supreme. I only show fealty to a few. Thus a follower of another deity, praying for me to that deity, implies that that deity has a say in my well being. I thus reject that, if it is not to a deity of worship of mine. Its a matter of manners.

I am afraid I do not agree with the not seeking retribution thing. However I put that to personal style. I also have read research to show that there is nothing actually wrong with so called negative emotions

Now UPG, there is a problem with the assumption that we "operate in a common systematic structure" all the time. If you look at the different spiritual traditions over history, it is clear that while there are groups of similar ones, there are also groups who are not the same. UPG should be used to acknowledge that "you just don't know". A gnosis is a matter of faith, not record. There is no proof that any single deity exists. By proof I mean data. Nor should there need to be.

So if you see that I am a polytheist, and someone else is a monotheist. There are two combating ideologies there. I say the gods are many, and they say the gods are singular not plural. That would be two different UPGs which are not comparable.

Trauma is a fact of living . To avoid trauma, would to be in essence living a life of separation from everything. How you deal with trauma is important, not the lack of it.

a reply to: Noinden

Idk man you're getting a little crazy up in here, telling people what to think, or not think.

You can't tell someone to not think about you. Or to think about you. They will think whatever they think. You can't control it. I know firsthand... and if you don't know it yet, then idk if you will ever know it.

Sh-t I feel like this could turn into a good childrens book, Dr. Seuss style.

I don't want to write it.
Someone else do it.

"They will think whatever they think." And you know, theres gotta be the bratty character that cries because some other kid thinks something crazy. But then also offers coping mechanisms for when people think crazy things about you that aren't true.

Also someone has to write the "Share your shape with the world" one too. We all have differently shaped bodies, we should have no shame about it. Some are pear shaped. Some are hourglass. Some are big on top, but skinny on bottom. Some skinny on top, big on bottom. Some are tall, some are small. Etc. Maybe it's already been done?

a reply to: geezlouise

No I am stating my view on something. People can think and do as they will. I'll react accordingly.

I've stated that I find someone praying, against my wishes to be offensive. Especially when it is a "I will pray for your soul" which is in essence what one person commented on another here.

a reply to: Noinden

So if you see that I am a polytheist, and someone else is a monotheist. There are two combating ideologies there

Not really, it just means you believe in something different.. Without society and the rules in it, actually in nature, you would be excluded and isolated.. Only reason you still can practice your religion is cause the monotheistic institution lets you.. All the way up 19th century, they would most likely, lobotomize, electro shock therapy, exclude, prison, burn, drown, hang.. Well you get the picture..

When you put the ideologies at first hand, you create a conflict..

a reply to: tikbalang

Yes really. My UPG is the Gods are many. Their UPG is that the divine is singular. IF one of those UPGs also says that their deity is the only deity, and that to follow any other UPG is wrong. It generates the conflict. History shows this. Neither stance can be proven. Thus you will either have people learn to accept that there are differences OR you will have conflict. History shows which happens (hint its not the first option most of the time).

Thus when people say "Satanists do XYZ" with out proof. They are generating another UPG. Indeed when those people lable any non follower of their path, their UPG, they are causing conflict.

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: tikbalang

Yes really. My UPG is the Gods are many. Their UPG is that the divine is singular. IF one of those UPGs also says that their deity is the only deity, and that to follow any other UPG is wrong. It generates the conflict. History shows this. Neither stance can be proven. Thus you will either have people learn to accept that there are differences OR you will have conflict. History shows which happens (hint its not the first option most of the time).

Thus when people say "Satanists do XYZ" with out proof. They are generating another UPG. Indeed when those people lable any non follower of their path, their UPG, they are causing conflict.

You made no sense, but you are right about learning to accept, to bad you fail to realize that

a reply to: tikbalang

No I talked about things you don't understand. Not that I made no sense. You also return to ad homenin attacks. This is an admission of defeat on your part.

a reply to: Noinden

Everyone else failed to understand them also.. Does it mean no one understand your world view?

a reply to: Noinden

Dude you and greggers are the only ones backing the pedos....

At this point I think the least important part of this story is a connection or any mention of Satan/Satanism....

Almost like you derailing...Spare us the "O my don't you know what satanists are?" bs

May God have mercy on your soul...

Char-Lee and others thank you for bringing this to light. I'll be reading up on this and watching the complete videos to make my own informed decision. All seems pretty par for the course but I will at the very least try to keep my bias in check for the sake of Greggers and Noinden's satisfaction.

Keep up the good work CL!

a reply to: Noinden

If someone says that they are going to pray for me and I feel like it is not coming out of a place of love, and instead they're really just stroking their own ego and judging me negatively and treating me like a heathen? Like they're just trying to put me down?

Then my feelings might get hurt.

And I might say, "no you b-tches ain't praying for me and that ain't love." And after I've ousted them in their hypocrisy I'd wish them well (in order to make sure I continue feeling like the "good person") and then be on my way. The end.

But idk man you're saying some wild stuff like it's the same as touching? If that's the case then we're all molesting and being molested with one another's thoughts and we can't escape it. Which sounds kind of intimate... that could be a good time. And if someone says that they are going to pray for me and I sense it is coming from a place of love, then hell f-cking yeah. Go ahead and molest me with all your prayers, baby. I'm a heathen.

a reply to: geezlouise

Do you consider the term heathen to be bad? Many of us use it. By us I mean members of the Pagan community.

What I said is that unasked for attention, be it spiritual or physical is bad. Thus I don't accept unasked for prayers, and in the first instance politely ask them to not do it. Its a boundaries thing.

a reply to: erikthegreen

No try again. WE are backing that there is no evidence the Satanist are doing it. Do pedophiles exist yes. Do pedophile rings exist yes. Want to knows the group which has been shown to have the largest number of kiddie fiddlers? Catholic priests. Are they Satanists now?

a reply to: tikbalang

There are at least tens of thousands who are fellow hard polytheists. So no, others understand my world view just fine.