Forget Wikileaks...this is the real October Surprise that is going to stop Hillary

originally posted by: shooterbrody
a reply to: Greggers

You advocate raising taxes on those making over 700k a year only?
And that will cover obamacare?

Yeah math and stuff........

Perhaps you'd like to present your math. What I do know is that the wealthiest one percent have socked away enormous reserves of cash at unprecedented amounts, while the rest of society gets poorer and poorer. The wealthiest handful of people have enough money to flat-out pay for the healthcare of a vast percentage of the American population.

America's wealthiest 20 people have more money than the bottom 152 million people.

www.marketwatch.com...


Incidentally, these are also the people who own our government.

originally posted by: kruphix
a reply to: mobiusmale

Most people get their insurance through their work, the next largest segment has Medicare/Medicaid. Those that get their insurance through the exchanges, not all of them are experiencing a large premium hike.

The people you are talking about that are effected by these premium hikes are a small minority that won't tilt the election one way or another.

But go ahead and think this will change blue states to red.

So people who get their insurance through work don't pay the $125,000 deductibles?

originally posted by: Mandroid7

originally posted by: kruphix
a reply to: mobiusmale

Most people get their insurance through their work, the next largest segment has Medicare/Medicaid. Those that get their insurance through the exchanges, not all of them are experiencing a large premium hike.

The people you are talking about that are effected by these premium hikes are a small minority that won't tilt the election one way or another.

But go ahead and think this will change blue states to red.

So people who get their insurance through work don't pay the $125,000 deductibles?

My work-provided insurance does not have a deductible....

My apologies if I misinterpreted your statement. I probably did.

I keep hearing this phrase "repeal and replace" Obamcare.....it should be "replace and then repeal" Obamacare....if anyone thinks for a second that the republican party members of congress are going to come up with a comprehensive medical plan for all Americans, I got a bridge to sell you.......so ask one of your (R) political representatives if this wouldn't be the most sane and logical way, so that millions of Americans wouldn't be stranded without health insurance.......you'll hear crickets chirping while you wait for an answer.

I know!!, maybe Trump can just deport all poor people, problem solved, you trumpsters

I'm fortunate enough to have my insurance plan paid for by work- or I was.
This year they changed the structure. I still get it paid for by work, but my coverage dropped substantially- my other choice was to start paying them for it.

Of course, when they made this mess of the insurance, I had a different job and different insurance that I did pay for- and all of a sudden even though I had expensive insurance, my doctors visits cost too damn much out of pocket.
So I fired each and every last doctor I had.

I'm not stupid- healthcare costs wouldn't be out of control if health insurance wasn't so commonplace.
I also know full well that just because my job pays for my health insurance doesn't mean it's not costing me- every dollar they spend on that is a dollar they could be paying me instead.

Everyone was warned well in advance that this healthcare nonsense was a scam, and all the people who couldn't afford healthcare supported it anyway- Look where they are now.
Still can't afford it, but they're being told they'll be fined for not having it, now- and healthcare costs went up for them, to boot.
Everybody loses, and it's exactly what I said was going to happen when they announced it.

a reply to: Greggers

While I see your point. I assume it is in the context of the current programs or future ones presented by politicians who are in bed with the richest people in America.

Truth is, Democrat or Republican, most of these politicians are better at pandering and making something sound good with words as they make policies that only push us forward with the current (horrible) direction.

Obamacare was a blatant blow to the middle class and the benefits of the penalties to making people get a private product has no place in a democracy.

originally posted by: Mr Headshot
a reply to: kruphix
Kinda going to spin off that, but isn't it funny that that is the argument being made by the left now? The poor and disaffected who don't get the insurance through their work (basically the people who were invoked to pass the bill) are going to, now, take the brunt of the hikes.

Hmm Kruphix basically said the poor are a small minority.

It was designed to fail.

Currently, Obamacare is being used to shift and consolidate power and money.

I'll make a thread later if I get the chance.

originally posted by: kruphix
a reply to: mobiusmale

Most people get their insurance through their work, the next largest segment has Medicare/Medicaid. Those that get their insurance through the exchanges, not all of them are experiencing a large premium hike.

The people you are talking about that are effected by these premium hikes are a small minority that won't tilt the election one way or another.

But go ahead and think this will change blue states to red.

Just a small minority?

Interesting.

anything over $500 a month is not feasible for the working class. The Median(not mean) is 30k income per individual, 50k household.

As prices have risen employers feel the cost and have been downgrading plans, along with the cadilac tax on great plans.

They have tried a lot of ways to take down the hard working american but they held strong. They made this TAX unavoidable and may finally be the policy that takes americans down.

The most positive outlook that can be had on the ACA is that it is a purposeful collapse in order to install single payer. The other possibilities go from corruption to stalin and mao evil

originally posted by: jimmyx
I keep hearing this phrase "repeal and replace" Obamcare.....it should be "replace and then repeal" Obamacare....if anyone thinks for a second that the republican party members of congress are going to come up with a comprehensive medical plan for all Americans, I got a bridge to sell you.......so ask one of your (R) political representatives if this wouldn't be the most sane and logical way, so that millions of Americans wouldn't be stranded without health insurance.......you'll hear crickets chirping while you wait for an answer.

I know!!, maybe Trump can just deport all poor people, problem solved, you trumpsters

Actually it's your team mate that dosent care for poor people, just go back to page 1.

Umm. You apparently don't have a clue. I work in insurance and this affects everyone. People are panicking calling the office daily. They are being told that there rates may increase even more after election. People are pis**d. My coworkers make decent money and they can't afford it. If you don't use the insurance a lot, your best move is to put away the money and only use when needed. Hospitals and dr offices will give discounts when paying in cash. Also, there is a religion clause you can use for the penalty to be waved. That's the route I took. Obamacare is messy and reckless and may very well decide election this time.

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: Greggers

While I see your point. I assume it is in the context of the current programs or future ones presented by politicians who are in bed with the richest people in America.

Truth is, Democrat or Republican, most of these politicians are better at pandering and making something sound good with words as they make policies that only push us forward with the current (horrible) direction.

Obamacare was a blatant blow to the middle class and the benefits of the penalties to making people get a private product has no place in a democracy.

I don't necessarily disagree. We're basically providing welfare to the insurance industry. I personally would prefer to eliminate the insurance industry altogether.

originally posted by: kruphix
a reply to: mobiusmale

Most people get their insurance through their work, the next largest segment has Medicare/Medicaid. Those that get their insurance through the exchanges, not all of them are experiencing a large premium hike.

The people you are talking about that are effected by these premium hikes are a small minority that won't tilt the election one way or another.

But go ahead and think this will change blue states to red.

ROFL, that sounds just like a classic Obama pitch. "Only a small minority will be affected by these premium hikes". LOL what a crock, and nobody believes it since the world just heard otherwise. Everything you are saying is the complete opposite of reality.

originally posted by: Greggers

originally posted by: Mandroid7

originally posted by: kruphix
a reply to: mobiusmale

Most people get their insurance through their work, the next largest segment has Medicare/Medicaid. Those that get their insurance through the exchanges, not all of them are experiencing a large premium hike.

The people you are talking about that are effected by these premium hikes are a small minority that won't tilt the election one way or another.

But go ahead and think this will change blue states to red.

So people who get their insurance through work don't pay the $125,000 deductibles?

My work-provided insurance does not have a deductible....

My apologies if I misinterpreted your statement. I probably did.

You are lucky then, mine has gotten outrageous being self employed.
They drain enough of you from the monthly payment, that you can't afford the deduct for services.

Ironically, this steady increase happens, and I haven't been to the doctors in almost a decade.

originally posted by: Mandroid7

originally posted by: Greggers

originally posted by: Mandroid7

originally posted by: kruphix
a reply to: mobiusmale

Most people get their insurance through their work, the next largest segment has Medicare/Medicaid. Those that get their insurance through the exchanges, not all of them are experiencing a large premium hike.

The people you are talking about that are effected by these premium hikes are a small minority that won't tilt the election one way or another.

But go ahead and think this will change blue states to red.

So people who get their insurance through work don't pay the $125,000 deductibles?

My work-provided insurance does not have a deductible....

My apologies if I misinterpreted your statement. I probably did.

You are lucky then, mine has gotten outrageous being self employed.
They drain enough of you from the monthly payment, that you can't afford the deduct for services.

Ironically, this steady increase happens, and I haven't been to the doctors in almost a decade.

The problem is that the insurance industry cannot support the enormous cost of treating our extremely unhealthy population.

It's easy for a pure capitalist mindset to declare health a personal responsibility and to say healthcare isn't a right, but the sociological ramifications of this ideology will engender untenable consequences for society at large.


Did you know that the average doctor has no idea how much a given procedure actually costs? They only know how much the insurance companies will pay, so they charge ABOVE the highest amount covered by the most generous policy, knowing it will ensure them the highest return, and the rest gets written off because it was never a real cost to begin with.

Single Payer solves this problem.

Is anyone actually "surprised" by this though? I am not by any means a demlib but the gop is equally at fault for this to pass.

You advocate raising taxes on those making over 700k a year only? And that will cover obamacare?

I know this wasnt directed at me, but I will respond anyway. The short answer is no. Obamacare shouldnt exist so there is nothing I would suggest to "cover" it. If insurance companies are unwilling to cover a pre-existing condition, then medicare should allow enrollment for that individual. The states can figure out how to fund it and we can continue to let CMS determine the rules that the states must follow. " B-B-b-b-but Medicare is always broke" you might respond?? Insurance payers are the reason healthcare is so expensive in the first place. Medicare should not be a for-profit operation. These programs are always spending their entire budget so they can request a larger budget the next year, otherwise their budget gets cut. Business as usual.

thx
-d

a reply to: Greggers

The problem is that the insurance industry cannot support the enormous cost of treating our extremely unhealthy population.
....Blah blah blah blah....

Oh really? Thats the problem? I suppose you want to tell me that the person on hemodialysis costing 3k per per week in dialysis procedures is the problem and not the cost itself? Maybe we should elect you to run all insurance companies so you can tell sick people to screw off and die?

I've got a **NEWS FLASH** for you, dum-dum. Healthcare exists because there are sick people. Get rid of all the sick people and we don't need healthcare.

thx
-d

originally posted by: drewlander
a reply to: Greggers

The problem is that the insurance industry cannot support the enormous cost of treating our extremely unhealthy population.
....Blah blah blah blah....

Oh really? Thats the problem? I suppose you want to tell me that the person on hemodialysis costing 3k per per week in dialysis procedures is the problem and not the cost itself? Maybe we should elect you to run all insurance companies so you can tell sick people to screw off and die?

I've got a **NEWS FLASH** for you, dum-dum. Healthcare exists because there are sick people. Get rid of all the sick people and we don't need healthcare.

thx
-d

Umm... did you even read my post?

Because if you did, it appears you've responded to something else entirely.


Also, watch the name calling. This is not the mud pit.

a reply to: mobiusmale

Well, not to blow your theory, but before Obamacare our family was paying out $1200 PER MONTH for insurance which we absolutely have to have due to a medically fragile child. It was killing us.

Now we pay $467 with subsidies in place, and if that goes up 25% (which in our state it looks like it will be slightly less than that), we will be paying around $585, which is still less than HALF of what we had to pay before, with LESS out of pocket annual expenses and an amazing pharmacy plan. We might have to change plans so that it will work for what we need, but seriously, even if its a bit more expensive, we will still manage it.

In addition, MOST people are covered through work. My husband is self-employed in a very small business so we take care of our own insurance.

I know the ACA needs fixing, but without it, I am terrified what the insurance companies, unfettered and unshackled from regulation would do to our family - it would put my child's LIFE at risk. Seriously, not even going to let that happen.

- AB