Zapreuder Film

The guy who produced that web-site is a nut job. On the front page of the site he has this to say:

"It`s Me, With A Tie And Vest!
When I dress up, I go the whole nine yards and wear a tie and vest !"


Serious nut-job. I have difficulty believing anything this guy has to say. He also believes Elvis is still alive!

Originally posted by frayed1
Notmindcontrolled Welcome to ATS!




Thanks. I think that everyone has a problem with the video not being clear enough to be conclusive. I also think it was edited that way to throw everyone off track. The eyewitnesses are what confirm the video and the memory of gunpowder scent is also another confirmation. The problem is in the gov't coverup. They threw so many loopholes in this matter that it divided everyone into many theroies. Arleon Spector is one of the biggest cover-up artist in the assassination. So is G.H.W.B. The big question is, who ordered it and why? I think Eric Jon Phelps has a great website that covers the whole spectrum. Some of his claims are outlandish to most, but he documents all of his clamies.

*Sigh*

Ok...I swore I'd never post in this thread again, but just got to do it one more time...

If the driver drew his gun with his left hand, and made the shot, then how come his left hand is still on the stearing wheel ( this crop is from frame 311, just before the head shot in frame 312 ) ?

ALRIGHT BABY !! you got it paused "right on the spot"now look at the CHIN of the passanger then look one or two finger spaces in front of the passanger's chin and you"ll see this "whiteish image" What this whiteish image is the gun in his hand and the driver right about to fire, Watch the film in slow motion and focus as it plays and you'll see him shooting Kennedy.

[edit on 29-1-2005 by SiberianTiger]

[edit on 29-1-2005 by SiberianTiger]

[edit on 29-1-2005 by SiberianTiger]

Almost as far fetched as the supposed guy with the umbrella which shot a poison dart through the president's throat and caused him paralysis and that's why he just sat there prime for the head shot...

Just been reading through all the posts on this thread.
I've never heard of the poison dart theory, I thought the Umbrella Guy
was a spotter for the sniper

Guys I seriously, seriously, doubt that the driver shot him. I can see where he pulls out his gun but as you can see he has it out for a lot of the frames and the reason he has it out is because he is a damn guard! You guys are lame, that would be too out in the open for him to be the shooter and everyone in the car and on the streets wouldnt have just kept quiet about it. He did not shoot him he just had his gun out because he heard a shot and was being protective.

Originally posted by SiberianTiger
ALRIGHT BABY !! you got it paused "right on the spot"now look at the CHIN of the passanger then look one or two finger spaces in front of the passanger's chin and you"ll see this "whiteish image" What this whiteish image is the gun in his hand and the driver right about to fire, Watch the film in slow motion and focus as it plays and you'll see him shooting Kennedy.

I'm sorry...but 2 fingers if front of the passengers chin, I see the drivers shirt, behind his jacket...

Perhaps, if you can download that image and circle the area you see the gun, use MSPaint, if you don't have anything else...

Because I really want to see what you are talking about, to see if there is a gun or not...

OH! WELL MOVE 2 1/2 TO 3 FINGER SPACES THEN, AND WHERE DO I FIND MS PAINT ?

[edit on 30-1-2005 by SiberianTiger]

Start-Programs-accessories-paint.

Also while you're looking for MSPaint, and that gun...

Please compare the photo of where you say the "gun" is, and this photo, tell me how he was able to make the shot through the seat, the Limo didn't have bucket seats, it had a bench seat...




Photo taken from here...

www.jfklancer.com...

[edit on 30-1-2005 by Jedi_Master]

Clearly that's the drivers shirt! How can you not see that unless you are desperate for him to be the shooter! What about the fact that when the driver supposedly shoots JFK not one person in the limo turns towards him? Natural reaction wouldn't you think?

That and a loud gunshot so close would have scrared everyone else in the limo. Noone even puts their hand up to their ears.

The gun cant have a silencer as they said it was a snub nose gun.

Originally posted by frayed1

Originally posted by UnMature
I have a quick question about what is shown of the Kennedy Assasination in the Zapreuder film. Why is Kennedy's reaction so odd? His hands or in the shape of fists on his neck. If you got shot in the neck wouldn't you normally put, say one hand flant against the wound and apply pressure? Any medical reason (or other) as to why he would respond in this way?

Interesting thread....but I'm not sure anyone actually answered this question...Here's one medical explaination for JFK's odd movement:

A spinal injury at C-6 forces the victim's arms to jerk up into a fixed position - parallel with the chin, hands in toward the chin, elbows out. This is called Thorburn's position, after the physician that discovered it in the 1800's. Once the spine is so damaged, the arms lock in that position.

The author of "Case Closed" contends that the Zapruder film shows Jackie trying to push JFK's arms down, but that they will not yield until the head shot occurs, releasing the reflex.

( BTW, Jedi, I was not refering to the 'flicker' that would be inherent in that type of film, but the jerky flow of the motion--as if frames were being skipped....the first documentary I recall seeing that showed the frame numbers confirmed that some frames were not present.) I have since found sites that provide all of the frames, even the damaged ones. One here



[edit on 27-1-2005 by frayed1]

Kennedy does not exhibit any of the signs of a Thorburn poistion. Those espousing this explanation for Kennedy's arm movements have deliberately twisted and misrepresented evidence.

Dr. Lattimer and the Great Thorburn Hoax

Wouldn't JFK's postion after the neck shot still be a neuro/muscular reflex, even if not Thorburn's? .....after reading your Dr. Lattimer link, I did a search on Thorburn's position and found the following:

According to Dr. Kenneth Strully, a neurosurgeon from New Hampshire,
JFK's movements following the neck shot were the result of
direct stimulation of the relevant nerves, not spinal trauma to C6.

The following are excerpts from a letter sent by Strully to Dr.
Robert Artwohl, dated April 9, 1994:

"Before all else, it is necessary to remember that this assassination
reveals a sequence of neural responses initiated in the neck by the
shock wave and cavitation induced by the bullet in its traverse of
the neck. This traumatized all structures in a 6 inch radius in all
directions from the path of passage through the neck. This spread
of forces occurred in a fraction of a second, traumatizing all neural
structures in the immediate vicinity within a fraction of a second as
determined by the speed of the missile according to ballistic studies.
As a result, contraction of the muscles innervated by nerves closest
to the bullet's path took place first; -- right deltoid, left deltoid,
right biceps followed by the left biceps and sequential contraction
of all muscles in the forearms, hands, chest, abdominal walls and
paraspinal muscle groups, with muscles in the lower extremities,
farthest from the shock wave, responding last. All neural structures
in the neck were stimulated at the same moment but the distance an
impulse had to travel to cause muscle contractions in the hamstrings
and gluteal muscles was greater, thus the motor responses in these
muscles occurred much later."

He does go on to say that while it is not "Thorburn's" reflex ...more here

While he might have the wrong answer, I fail to see what agenda Lattimer might achieve by using it to explain Kennedy's movements.....

So...

I guess we can put this one to bed, that it wasn't the driver then, OK ?...

way to kick his butt, jedi. That link to the site that had every single frame was very nice, every other one i went to had several key frames missing.

I Hope this thread is done.....geeeez!

Originally posted by frayed1
Wouldn't JFK's postion after the neck shot still be a neuro/muscular reflex, even if not Thorburn's? .....after reading your Dr. Lattimer link, I did a search on Thorburn's position and found the following:

According to Dr. Kenneth Strully, a neurosurgeon from New Hampshire,
JFK's movements following the neck shot were the result of
direct stimulation of the relevant nerves, not spinal trauma to C6.

The following are excerpts from a letter sent by Strully to Dr.
Robert Artwohl, dated April 9, 1994:

"Before all else, it is necessary to remember that this assassination
reveals a sequence of neural responses initiated in the neck by the
shock wave and cavitation induced by the bullet in its traverse of
the neck. This traumatized all structures in a 6 inch radius in all
directions from the path of passage through the neck. This spread
of forces occurred in a fraction of a second, traumatizing all neural
structures in the immediate vicinity within a fraction of a second as
determined by the speed of the missile according to ballistic studies.
As a result, contraction of the muscles innervated by nerves closest
to the bullet's path took place first; -- right deltoid, left deltoid,
right biceps followed by the left biceps and sequential contraction
of all muscles in the forearms, hands, chest, abdominal walls and
paraspinal muscle groups, with muscles in the lower extremities,
farthest from the shock wave, responding last. All neural structures
in the neck were stimulated at the same moment but the distance an
impulse had to travel to cause muscle contractions in the hamstrings
and gluteal muscles was greater, thus the motor responses in these
muscles occurred much later."

He does go on to say that while it is not "Thorburn's" reflex ...more here

While he might have the wrong answer, I fail to see what agenda Lattimer might achieve by using it to explain Kennedy's movements.....

He deliberately misrepresented Thorburn's work in order to advance his agenda which is to make the lone assassin viewpoint a valid and acceptable viewpoint again.

www.assassinationresearch.com...

www.assassinationresearch.com...

Look at frame 313 of the Zapruder film. There is a line above Kennedy's head. What do you think it is? Do you think it could be the line of the bullet? If it is a line from the bullet, then it looks like the shot was from the air overhead.

Originally posted by Blueangel7
Look at frame 313 of the Zapruder film. There is a line above Kennedy's head. What do you think it is? Do you think it could be the line of the bullet? If it is a line from the bullet, then it looks like the shot was from the air overhead.

its likely that its just a bit of his skull flying away.