The real culling of the populice. Carfentanil laced heroin overdoses spread like wildfire

originally posted by: tiredoflooking
a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

Are you even kidding me right now? The 200 or so ppl dead from this killer heroin over the last few weeks aren't blaming anyone are they? Anyway this thread is not specifically about addiction, chronic pain or dealers and their validity or lack thereof. ..it about a huge quick death toll and why it might be happening.

You have to realize that this stigma about addiction, regardless of chronic pain, will always put those addicted in the worst possible light, just as those giving addicts what they need will be portrayed in the worst possible light: i.e., calling them pushers, etc.

There is very little understanding or subtlety, imho, about this issue. Rather, people are very harsh in their views on this issue and blame cuts all ways and is actively employed and evoked, cutting off real discussions of how to deal with this epidemic issue, unfortunately. Have you hit a nerve? Surely. That's exactly why it's worth discussing, though. It's a huge problem.

Forgive me for saying it again, but many people live in a hellish existence of pain, physical and emotional. In my experience, most addicts are getting "high" to escape one or the other or both types of pain. They aren't just looking for a good time. I've said this for a long time, but there is much resistance to compassionate understanding of this. Part of that, I think, is because within dysfunctional families, no one in the family wants to admit what's causing that pain, for the "identified patient" in the family that tends to carry the burden of the unresolved conflicts of the family....

It's much easier to stigmatize that one member of the clan as being a "problem child," or whatever, than admit that there was screwed up stuff going on all along within the totality of dynamics of that family. And that is just one issue attendant to addiction that many counselors deal with everyday.....there are many others.

Many people suffer from trauma from abuse or violent events they suffered from in their pasts that put them at risk for addiction, in order to self medicate a pain they cannot endure......

This all speaks to emotional pain, rather than physical, however. But emotional pain is no less than physical, really, imho, and certainly when you aren't actively bleeding, people are much less sympathetic or even reactive or understanding of said pain or wounds......

originally posted by: tiredoflooking
a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

Are you even kidding me right now? The 200 or so ppl dead from this killer heroin over the last few weeks aren't blaming anyone are they? Anyway this thread is not specifically about addiction, chronic pain or dealers and their validity or lack thereof. ..it about a huge quick death toll and why it might be happening.

Hang on...so...should we all just panic now......perhaps throw our hands in the air and scream about it.......really?

I must be missing something here ...heroin is a big scary killer and we should all be concerned now ?...really ?

a reply to: tetra50

Sorry was not intended as trying to school you...my bad.....

Its funny how a persons perception can completely change the way a topic is viewed ....perhaps a flaw withing language as we know it

a reply to: tetra50

Absolutely there needs to be change from the stigma that goes with addiction. Harm reduction therapy and understanding for all. It amazes me that people who haven't experienced the cycle themselves generally cannot empathize more but it is one of those things one really needs to experience to understand. Both the chronic pain that cannot be seen and the mental anguish that cannot be seen. Nobody would choose to be in this cycle. Sure maybe some would choose the escape and euphoria of some sort of drug for fun...but the ongoing battle it's just not a choice.

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: tiredoflooking
a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

Are you even kidding me right now? The 200 or so ppl dead from this killer heroin over the last few weeks aren't blaming anyone are they? Anyway this thread is not specifically about addiction, chronic pain or dealers and their validity or lack thereof. ..it about a huge quick death toll and why it might be happening.

Hang on...so...should we all just panic now......perhaps throw our hands in the air and scream about it.......really?

I must be missing something here ...heroin is a big scary killer and we should all be concerned now ?...really ?

I actually agree that addiction in general is a culling......

It doesn't take a lot of logic to see it that way, I don't think. As I already remarked, it's part of a classic Hegelian dialectic of introducing a conflict, a solution that leads to a larger issue: culling. Pain is obviously a common issue to deal with in life. For some more than others. Once afflicted, those afflicted can easily fall by the wayside in trying to solve their conundrum: hence, overdoses.

Is that the fault of doctors, though? I don't think so. Blame is easy. Sussing out the root of the problem, and avoiding blame is much more complicated. Some of us ascribe to a theory called the control system, by which all kinds of culling effects are introduced. I see this as simply another methodology of said control system....

But a more positive way of looking at it is that we are all afflicted in some way throughout living our lives. We will either rise to the occasion and survive, and overcome and transcend or not..... Within that paradigmatic explanation of where we live and exist, blame isn't really useful, is it?

a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

No we should all just sit back in our armchairs pretending there isn't a huge opiate addiction problem in our culture right now...did you read the statistics in tetra's post? Also it has a trickle down effect children are getting pills from parents and friends then moving on to heroin, ya it's always been a problem but not like it is right now. It's exploded...we all need to talk about it and find solutions. It's growing everyday and it's not the same face as before...it's not just the junkie in the alley who nobody cares about, it's you nurse your bus driver you girl next door their mother and grandmother.

a reply to: tetra50

Is that the fault of doctors, though? I don't think so. Blame is easy.

As a patient i go to my doctor for advice on what i should do that benefits me in the best way ....sometimes more than often that will relate back to my doctor advising me to take certain drugs, the doctor even has this ability to prescribe drugs which i can get conveniently over the counter with that very same prescription...which of course i would never had been able to get unless i was good friends with the local street corner drug dealer....

So who do we blame ?...

originally posted by: tiredoflooking
a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

No we should all just sit back in our armchairs pretending there isn't a huge opiate addiction problem in our culture right now...did you read the statistics in tetra's post? Also it has a trickle down effect children are getting pills from parents and friends then moving on to heroin, ya it's always been a problem but not like it is right now. It's exploded...we all need to talk about it and find solutions. It's growing everyday and it's not the same face as before...it's not just the junkie in the alley who nobody cares about, it's you nurse your bus driver you girl next door their mother and grandmother.

Addiction had been a problem long before these specific drugs became a problem......by your logic speeding on the roads is such a large problem we should ban the automobile .....really ?

a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

Sure it's been a problem, sure opiate abuse has always been a problem throughout history...just never on this scale in this demographic. This particular climate also was started by doctors not people getting addicted on the streets.

a reply to: tiredoflooking

Same could be said for for speeding and deaths that are associated with it.....personal responsibility and all that

originally posted by: tiredoflooking
a reply to: intrptr

Seriously? Sure they cut stuff. Where are they getting this stuff? Touching one grain can kill you? They certainly didn't special order the stuff from China. Let's be real. It's either all ready in the heroin they have bought and have to sell to avoid losing money or its somehow being supplied to them. They certainly aren't using it on purpose so WHERE is it coming from??

I though you knew. And don't call me seriously.

a reply to: tiredoflooking

Greetings-

Remember 2001? Back before "The War" Afghanistan produced 7% of the world's opium, now it is closer to 90%.. What has happened in that time? The US first saw an opiate based pain medication epidemic and after those users were cut-off, they went and found Heroin.

Why was Afghanistan invaded again?

Here are some links that will explain the growth.

www.telesurtv.net...
www.nbcnews.com...
en.wikipedia.org...

Now also consider "Private Prisons".. I'd be curious on how many of these folks are incarcerated in Private rooms??

But I'll await on the reason for invading Afghanistan, especially after the US armed and trained them to fight the Soviets remember?

If looking at this from an incarceration angle- All those who were incarcerated during "The Crack War" a tangent of 'The Drug War', are just now getting released after doing their 20-25 year sentences. "THEY" may just need bodies for the jails/prisons..

Proud Member of LEAP-Law Enforcement Against Prohibition

I seriously doubt that a large percentage of addicts are people who suffer from chronic pain.Everyone has different tolerance to pain,some people go running to their doctor for morphine to treat a bee sting and other people won`t even take a tylenol for a broken bone.
There is a fat lazy white trash pig that lives up the street from me and she is always bitching because the doctors won`t prescribe percocets for her anymore,her medical records have a notation that she is a drug addict.
she claims her back hurts and she needs pain meds, well yeah her back probably does hurt considering she is massively overweight but the cure for that is to lose about 100 pounds.

OP, you mentioned Kratom... have you looked into what's going on with that plant lately? Several state governments have been up in arms to ban it this year, and succeeded in Alabama. Despite zero recorded fatal overdoses, despite it's proven benefit in harm-reduction, despite it having withdrawals that are much less severe than traditional opiates and opioids.
At least one person has died after going back to the harder stuff when Alabama put it on their Schedule I list in May.
I was on the "front lines" of the fight to keep it legal in AL, and there was a LOT of sketchy behavior seen by our elected officials.
I'm hearing word now of a possible push to ban it at a federal level.

petitions.whitehouse.gov...

a reply to: Phage

Morphine is converted to herion in the body. The cutting agents are just as dangerous

Along with Kratom look into Ibogain as well. I learned about it after it was featured on an episode of Law& Order SVU (the people i live with are always watching that show). The way it was described in the show, is that, a heroin addict takes it, they "trip out" (hallucinate) for somewhere around 12-24 hrs, then they come out of their trip no longer addicted to heroin, no withdrawals. It works for "most people" (a percentage mightve been mentioned, maybe 90, i dont remember), and of course, its illegal in the united states.

Along with Kratom look into Ibogain as well. I learned about it after it was featured on an episode of Law& Order SVU (the people i live with are always watching that show). The way it was described in the show, is that, a heroin addict takes it, they "trip out" (hallucinate) for somewhere around 12-24 hrs, then they come out of their trip no longer addicted to heroin, no withdrawals. It works for "most people" (a percentage mightve been mentioned, maybe 90, i dont remember), and of course, its illegal in the united states.

I knew when carfentanyl came on the scene that it was not local drug dealers doing this.

It's China and they are playing the long game to weaken the populace.

U.S. President Donald Trump re-emphasized this issue in a Twitter post on Aug. 23. “I am ordering all carriers, including Fed Ex, Amazon, UPS and the Post Office, to SEARCH FOR & REFUSE,…….all deliveries of Fentanyl from China (or anywhere else!).” He wrote, “Fentanyl kills 100,000 Americans a year. President Xi said this would stop – it didn’t.”

“When this professor went back to China, he sent a report to China’s National Security Department proposing that fentanyl should be used as one of China’s national strategies aimed at weakening the United States and bringing huge profits to China. He also emphasized that chemists can easily produce more than 1,000 derivative drugs from fentanyl,” Guo said.

Guo claimed that he reported Cao to the U.S. Embassy in Beijing by providing information on Cao’s green card and his research at MIT. The U.S. Embassy then asked Cao to have a talk with the consuls. Cao then decided not to return to the United States, and instead work with another researcher in a factory in Nanjing to produce fentanyl on a mass scale. In the past, this same factory had engaged in the research and development of biochemical weapons

Guo exposed the CCP special plan codenamed “3F Plan.” Its goal is to weaken, mangle, and ruin the United States. The specific method to be used for 3F is the smuggling of fentanyl into the United States.

“Think about it. Any person who sells fentanyl in China is arrested and will be immediately executed. However, the drug is now sold to the United States in large quantities, yet the Chinese government remains silent,” he said.

According to Guo, fentanyl is the CCP’s chemical weapon, and the total amount trafficked into the United States is capable of killing three times the American population.

“This is no joke,” he warned. “The Chinese communist regime truly wants to kill you. How can you expect the regime to take any action to stop it [the fentanyl trafficking]?”

Guo felt sad that President Trump is the only one who keeps warning the public, yet some Americans persist in challenging and criticizing him.

“Why are these people so keen on denigrating President Trump, but have never shown any interest in finding out what is really going on?” he asked.

“Why are these people so keen on denigrating President Trump, but have never shown any interest in finding out what is really going on?” he asked.

Many people do not believe President Trump’s accusation of China being the origin of fentanyl because most fentanyl is trafficked across the U.S.-Mexico border. A recent fentanyl seizure in Mexico may help them change their point of view.

The Mexican government announced on Aug. 25 that Mexican Custom officials intercepted a large multi-ton fentanyl shipment that came into the Mexican port in cargo from Shanghai, China according a recent report from Breitbart News.

The shipment originating from China was heading to Culiacan, Sinaloa, home base for the Sinaloa Cartel, an international drug trafficking organization.

twitter.com...

It's in Canada too directly from China and their drug lords are living it up in our country untouched.

At least Trump is trying.

This is revenge for the Opium wars and they are getting their revenge.

It must be stopped.

This is war.

a reply to: tiredoflooking

As things go this is a terrible culling method, it is imprecise and would cover too few people to be worth the effort.

Abortion on demand paid for by the state would be about 1000 times more effective Particularly in targeting minorities and the poor to leave the wealthy white elite to rule the roost. Or simply setting off poison gas on the subway system, or contaminating water supplies

population control methods that target small groups aren't real.

a reply to: AaarghZombies



www.npr.org...

That is deaths just up to 2016 and it's gone way up beyond that.

Death is not the only issue but the addicted and unfunctional is also the goal.

The Chinese know from the opium wars, all about it.

It's intent is to destabilize the population as well.

It is, unfortunately, very real.

The Opioid epidemic has spread to every group of people in the United States. The Opioid addiction crisis claims 115 American lives daily.

hospitalizations, overdoses, and deaths are all aspects of the Opioid epidemic currently affecting the 2.1 million Americans with an Opioid addiction. 

www.rehabspot.com...