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originally posted by: Annee
originally posted by: seagull
a reply to: Annee
Its really not the same.
It's not? I was bullied because I was different. I was, because of my speech impediment due to a cleft pallet, deemed "retard", in spite of the fact I'm anything but. "retard" "hairlip" etc... But that's not as bad as being bullied because of orientation, or gender issues? Really? The pain seems remarkably similar.
Oh, and where the hell were the teacher when I was being bullied, and others?? Blind eye seems much the same.
Tell me again, how it's not the same.
I repeat. It is not the same.
Did the Governor of your state take the bullies side against you?
Canadians don't seem to understand how powerful, vocal, and political the Christuan Right is in America. IMO
Yes, bullying is bullying. But, the statistics in America aren't made up. LGBT kids are at higher risk.
I'm also a parent and grandparent. I've seen what bullying can do. I've got the psychiatrist receipts to prove that. And that was for a "normal" kid.
However, there are areas in America, especially in the Bible Belt, where protection and equality for LGBT is almost non-existent. Even the opposite. The bullying is encouraged by adults, and those in charge.
originally posted by: tothetenthpower
My kids were bullied for having 2 fathers. They were bullied for NOT being gay because ' how could you not be in a house full of homos'.
I do respect your opinion, but it is different and at odds with what I've personally experienced and/or learned.
Haven't you said you came out later in life? You weren't out as a teen?
We are going to continue to be at odds on this subject. And that's OK.
originally posted by: tothetenthpower
I grew up in a time where being gay - in my teens would have probably gotten me killed or at the very least left homeless.
I came out my first few years of college when I met my husband.
originally posted by: tothetenthpower
As a gay man, I can tell you there is no difference between being bullied for being gay and being bullied for being poor for example.
Bullying - is buylling and using the following fallacy:
In order to some how prove that it is different, doesn't make it so. Individual circumstances can certainly be worse for any individual - but as a group, no, it is exactly the same kind of feelings and reactions.
Gay kids aren't special they don't feel 'harder' than other people do. Being abused for who you are, how you look, how much money you have, where you live etc is all the same at it's core.
To say it isn't, is simply intellectually dishonest and on some level elitist as that implies some people's pain is somehow more legitimate than others because of their sexual orientation, which is just another form of discrimination, or you defending people because YOU think you know whats best for them.
As a woman of past transsexual experience, I think you are full of crap. I'm sure if I was more familiar with gay culture and terminology I could find a descriptive word for what your sentiments make me feel - Uncle Tom, maybe? Not that I'm proposing you latch on to some victimization model but maybe you've so normalized and mainstreamed yourself, you've forgotten the societal and familial pressures outside of the scholastic environment that compounds and multiplies LGBT bullying and harassment? Maybe the culture in Canada is just that much different?
It is funny how you are using your own anecdotal evidence to refute statistics already posted. Your graphic seems rather ironic to me.
At the core, yes, but maybe where you're from being gay is as vanilla as being overweight or funny looking? Around these parts and in places outside of your utopia, being gay or trans carries a lot more baggage exceeding well beyond the campus.
In my retarded state, there are laws that prevent schools from presenting any information that promotes LGBT issues in a positive light for the same stupid reasons as the petition noted in the OP. At an institutional level, being gay or trans is not normal and not to be talked about because parents don't want their children exposed to the concepts. If you don't think this makes LGBT kids already outsiders and that being bullied for it doesn't present a different, more difficult or intense circumstances, then you're living in a fantasy.
See if your local programs don't specifically call out anti-LGBT bullying efforts and if they do, it is because LGBT kids face special risks that straight kids don't. That's an irrefutable fact.
originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
With that said, he was never bullied. I live in the buckle of the bible belt, down here in "backwards" texas (as the sentiment from up north seems to enjoy stating). We talk about this type of stuff, and his feelings circulate more around metro areas, as he has lived in them before.
But here in small town west Texas, neither him or his best friend (who was also gay) were never bullied. Or anything remotely similar. He never had any physical altercations ever.
I think 10th makes a point: the assholes you live around have a lot to do with how you are treated socially. And its not the same everywhere. In Snyder, TX i was discriminated against for not being hispanic. Meaning, having brown skin. Oh well....its their ignorance, not mine.
originally posted by: tothetenthpower
So you start off by insulting me, then insinuating that I'm somehow out of touch with 'being a victim' and therefore I'm wrong?
...And that proves my point, it's relative to where you live and your own personal experience. It's not that way across the board as some would suggest....
Say it with me now:
IN YOUR STATE. IN YOUR TOWN. IN YOUR EXPERIENCE.
IT IS NOT NOT, THE SAME FOR ALL PEOPLE EVERYWHERE THAT ARE GAY, AS I AM PROOF OF THAT AND SO ARE MANY OTHERS.
This does not, in any way, make what you experience, less than what it is. Not by a long shot. But please don't pretend like everybody suffers they way you do or others in your state do.
They don't, that's intelletually dishonest.
You keep proving my point. Anecdotal evidence, based on circumstances of geography, population and political party.
I wasn't implying you were wrong, just somewhat out of touch. I Uncle Tom'd you for lack of better words and didn't mean for them to be insulting per se but I find your lack of understanding or solidarity in this matter somewhat confusing.
Precisely. Even in the more liberal and progressive pockets in this country, LGBT kids are specifically singled out and bullied and physically assaulted for their orientation or identity. Perhaps if you had been out during your teen years and faced being killed or homelessness, you would feel differently? I was and I do have a different opinion and I think my experiences were more typical than unique.
originally posted by: Freija
I wasn't implying you were wrong, just somewhat out of touch. I Uncle Tom'd you for lack of better words and didn't mean for them to be insulting per se but I find your lack of understanding...
originally posted by: pl3bscheese
a reply to: Annee
No. I don't. If it's not very obvious, then you will never see it. Additionally, this has absolutely nothing to do with civil rights whatsoever. I can't believe you would use that word here. It's almost shameful if I wasn't aware you're simply ignorant.