Senior German ministers call for ban on wearing the burqa

Senior ministers in Germany have called for a ban on burqas and an end to dual citizenship in response to the threat from terrorism.

Senior German ministers call for ban on wearing the burqa

Well, Germany is waking up and starting to take action to reduce the risk of separatism and difference that things like the Burka highlight. Not only is the Burka a symbol of women's humiliating oppression and control by men, it's a way to hide the identity of the wearer.

Germany are reeling from a series of terrorist related attacks in recent weeks, which are probably the start of a new cycle of violence and intolerence from a small number of the million or so refugees.

However, there are risks with banning Burkas. Firstly it creates resentment from people, who while happy to live in a safe and rich country like Germany, don't really want to give up their backward lifestyle. Banning the Burka just makes them resent the nation they have chosen to live in and that can lead to problems, as we have seen all over Europe in recent months. Secondly countries that have done it have had patchy success.

Other measures the Germans are thinking about include quicker deportation and an end to dual citizenship. If you want to become German, then you have to take on board the entire package.

Is Germany correct to go down this road, or is it throwing away the rights of men to set the rules on what women should wear?

BBC alternative if you cannot access original source
New Humanist on Burkas and feminism
Countries that have banned the Burka

a reply to: paraphi

I don't agree banning it tbh it is a cultural garb not religious.
I agree there should be times where they should not wear it but hey if I can walk around in metal armour and cover my face with a helmet they should wear what they want.
Plus It brings out their eyes lol.

I personally do not care what someone wears or why. If you want to look like a bee keeper that is your prerogative.

Well they Banned Swastika armbands So they can do this as well if they desire.

a reply to: paraphi
if it is being used in such a way to disguise someone's identity, and conceal weapons, then I could understand banning it,

and to TheKnightofDoom - I wouldn't suspect you would explode any moment in your "metal armor and helmets" compared to someone in a burka

a reply to: ware2010

Funny I wouldn't expect people in burka exploding.
No point worrying about that stuff what are the odds? Worry causes stress and stress kills.
Don't worry about burka bombs.

a reply to: TheKnightofDoom
i personally don't have to worry about it, but I'm not all over the world

a reply to: paraphi

More to the point...

...it's a way to hide the identity of the wearer.

Facial recognition software can't ID the wearer. If not already, in the future everyone needs to be tracked in public all the time.

The other bit about oppression is less believable. What about the people that want to dress their culture? We deciding for them about that? Better be consistent across the board and ban all foreign dress. Otherwise it might seem... phobic.

a reply to: paraphi

Expect more like this to come.

My prediction is Chancellor Merkel and her echelons are on the way out.
In 2017 we will see Conservatives reclaim the party... there are substantiated concerns they will cater to the far-right too much, in order to beat radicals in the next elections.
Conservatism must not lose sight of its original statutes (like it happened in the U.S.).

This is just the beginning.

The issue is with our culture of honesty. If we do biz, we want to see the others face. It has to do with trust. That´s how our society works. You also can´t walk into a Bank or Gas Station with your bike helmet (the heavy ones) when it covers your face. Of course that´s up to the owners.

Also, we live in a free land where equality is embraced to a point where we have women quotes that corporations need to fulfill, even in high ranks. So wearing a burka, that does not allow the expression of feelings and acts as a shield to our public socieity. It does not fit. I fully support banning burkas in public.

If they feel they need to wear burkha and value it over the pillars of the society that they live in, I simply suggest moving to a land where they can wear it. It´s a symbol of opression. I once thought otherwhise. I know several egypts since long. It was told to me it has to do with honesty and respect. Indeed at their homes they wear normal dresses. But I have learned, it´s just what the men are telling the women.

It was also explained it has to do with avoiding evil thoughts. Well, I said to him, that´s the difference, if she truly loves some other, why would I force her to stay with me. It´s the cultural difference that made him not understand my points.

I´m against it because it´s delimitating. It´s not friendly nor open to walk around fully hidden. No problem with headscarfes or such, but the complete veil, I´m against it. Nobody can sell my anymore that it´s not a sign of opression. If someone on the street would aproach me in this thing asking for something, I would friendly tell her to either show face or find someone else. If she´s offended by religion, then I can mistrust someone who does not want to show the face when talking to.

a reply to: ColCurious

Now as much as I disagree with the refugee situation, I fear a day will come when the V for Vendetta scenario comes to light. I can seriously imagine a radical Neo Fascist group very similar to the Norsefire Party taking advantage of the refugee crisis. In the movie V for Vendetta the Norsefire party launched a false flag operation and blamed Muslims for the attack. Once power they started rounding up all non whites, homosexuals, and political opponents and put them in Concentration Camps. There, they were tortured and executed.

Oh whatever...I love watching people defend this group of people so dim they believe a magic being in the sky (whose primary voice was a pedophile) wants you to cover your body...

It is of unending joy watching liberals apply completely different standards for Islam and Christianity...

Seriously, these people believe a magical dude in the 7th century (who banged an 8 year old when he was 60) gave a blueprint for how to live a moral life...

It would be hilarious were it not so tragic in its current manifestation...if these people of quantifiably low inherent societal iq didn't settle on a desert atop an ocean of oil then they would be studied as an anthropologist studies Australopithecus...

-Christosterone

a reply to: intrptr

See my post, the main issue most germans have is that it conflicts with our view of trust and honesty.
We want to know who we deal with.

How about banning any further immigration into Germany?

a reply to: starviego

We have something called "human rights".
You cant bend the law. That´s the same reason why the one who cursed on the attacker in munich was reported to the police. Even if they laugh about it, they still have to take action.

The problem is, all those people coming to germany, went through safe countries. Many even say they come for economical reasons. That´s not the point of refugee status. It´s for those that truly need help, and those, according to our constitution, have the right for shelter if they come from a war designated country.

That´s all good. The problem started when Merkel invited everyone and they burned their passports. Those should have never led in to the country without a passport or propper identification. Now many refugees are sad and disappointed because they thought everything is for free.
That you have to work for this and that it only works in a open society without opression by religion, is something they need to learn.

a reply to: intrptr

The culture line is bull# in my opinion, why does a culture/religion get a free pass to walk around in disguise?

Try going into a bank or government building with a ski-mask on, hell even walking through town, a cop will likely notice you and perhaps have a chat to be on the safe side.
Where are my rights to wear whatever the # I like to hide my face?

Why do you give that free pass to a 'culture' as you say, but of course this 'culture' is not associated with any other religion aside from Islam, so you try to belittle the sky-fairy side of it as if that should be respected in some way.

No, it's creepy as # seeing just a pair of eyes looking at me, how do I know they are not up to no good?
But for equality sake's I'd say if Burka's are banned then so should any other form of mask which hides the face.

In reality that is the case with banks and government offices but the religious/cultural dress gets the free pass?
That is discrimination...tough luck if your religion says you hide everything except your eyes, stay indoors then, nobody else gets away with it, why should Islam exactly?

originally posted by: verschickter
a reply to: intrptr

See my post, the main issue most germans have is that it conflicts with our view of trust and honesty.
We want to know who we deal with.

Seeing someone's face still doesn't mean you can 'trust' them, however. This is more about identification for the record. Its always about ID.

Take a traffic stop for instance, they need to see your picture ID on a 'valid' license, your name doesn't cut it. What trust?

a reply to: ColCurious

This is just the beginning.

Precursor to requirements for dress leading to requirements of another kind? Once before, it was the Star of David.

Even serial numbers, tattooed.

a reply to: grainofsand

Exactly. The problem arises with ski masks. Because there is no special law against hiding your face. But then, a ski mask for bike riders or winter is something else then a full veil.

We(as in we germans) had a similar discussion about 10-15 years ago about headscarfes in school. It´s expected to take off the hat / baseball cap at school, a sign of respect. Everybody follows this rule. Then there were muslim complaining about how it´s their religion to wear a headscarf. That they would be discriminated because of their religion.

Kids said then they also want to wear their baseball caps then. The discussion was huge.
If we go out of our way for every religion, where are our own values going?

a reply to: intrptr
Of course I do not trust everyone who´s face I´m able to see.
On the other hand, I mistrust everyone who goes to lenghts, hiding their face.

No, it´s the people, not a conspiracy of the NWO.
Do you live here? I do. In the end it´s about identification, yes. Read up on the minister who brought it up, what kind of wood he is..