Medieval Blacks & Racism

originally posted by: samerulesapply
a reply to: WAstateMosin

I know your pain...I had a tooth, it went bad.

It turned all black, I couldn't afford to have it extracted...but I was embarassed about it, having no money, so I pretended the dentist refused to take it out because it was black.

That he'd happily extract it if it were white...an illigical argument since a nice white tooth wouldn't need extracting, but peopl ejust agreed and tolerated my stupid assertion, because I threatened to shoot dentists.

Nope, they are white, yellow, and brown (I drink coffee), have cavities (holes), and they are quite dead, but the roots keep them from fully falling out - they just dangle enough to jam back into the jawbone quite painfully when I am eating. Try eating with THAT problem! But I have to LOVE it, because I'm white and therefore 'privileged' according to the progs who want to revise history!

originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
I'm not sure on that though considering the Protestants were utterly annihilating Catholics at every turn I can't see gospel bad conscience coming into it really.

My suggested theory was not about Protestant attitudes towards Catholics (so I won't get into any arguments about which side was trying to annihilate the other).
My theory was about Protestant attitudes towards black people as compared with Catholic attitudes towards black people.
I have read observations that the society of the Anglo-Saxon colonies was more racist than the society of the Latin American colonies, as illustrated by attitudes towards intermarriage. I was trying to puzzle out an explanation for the difference. Might the difference in religion not have had something to do with it?

So let me re-cap;
Protestant attitudes towards black people;
vs Catholic attitudes towards black people.
Protestant and Catholic attitudes towards each other not relevant to the question.

Sorry I'm tired and sunburnt lol but what do you mean by racist theory? As in the blacks are sub human so it doesn't matter?

Yes; isn't that the point of "racism"? I thought I was just using an alternative expression.

as the demographics of the country and world continue to change and white people become the minority in western nations you will begin to see more and more white people playing the race card, and perhaps rightfully so, maybe then will some white people will finally "get it". hopefully none of this happens as we continue to mix and intermarry maybe then we can put away all the stupid stereotypes and racial divisions.

a reply to: WAstateMosin

Yes, and if those offending gnashers were white they'd also get preferrential treatment, but they are of colour and thus, the dental assciation have declared them unfit and inferior.

Only white teeth get treatment...I toyed with the notion of starting the black teeth matter movement, this was back in the 80's, but there wasn't a platform for me to spout my anti white-teeth rhetoric...if only they had social media in the 80's I'd be the Martin Luther King of dentistry.

But now is the time, for you...you have the world at your feet and a soapbox right here online. Only you'd most likely start the DTM or SDTM because - floss up, don't brush - slightly discoloured teeth matter.

a reply to: DISRAELI

Well do remember that even without catholic influence, the protestant North manage to have a civil war over the issue. Any comparison to catholic and protestant philosophies on race had zip to do with what finally happened.....protestant vs protestant in North America. More specifically protestant north and Anglican influenced south.

a reply to: PhyllidaDavenport

Funny how those who are SMART enough to imitate what works are labelled as 'traitors to the cause' by those too stupid/ignorant/lazy to do likewise. I do not believe the ones calling 'uncle T0M' realize that is EXACTLY WHY they get ZERO respect. They have done NOTHING to make anything actually BETTER, and many have not done a SINGLE DAY'S hard work their ENTIRE LIVES! Just look at their hands: no callouses, no scars, no hyper-developed knuckles from MANUAL LABOR, as I have. BTW, great threat - S&F!

a reply to: Logarock
But why would Anglicans be more prone to racism than Catholics? What's the psychological connection?

a reply to: DISRAELI

Ahh ok with you..sorry

If I could just take it a little further though....at this point in history and prior, many white Europeans had had various amounts of contact with educated intelligent Christian black people, so in theory the false narrative that perhaps the Protestant owners were attempting to peddle should have failed. Europeans had the knowledge and contact that these people were not in fact sub human at all and were in fact the very backbone of many aristocratic houses.

It was also stated by some slave traders and is recorded that it was ok to take Africans as slaves as they were uncivilized and un Christian and yet again we knew this to be incorrect.

The claim that England forcibly transported black to Sierra Leone after the War of Indpendance in America has also been proven to be false. The Black Zionist movement in the 19th C were quite influential and it would appear that many freed blacks wanted to return to their homeland. It should be noted here however that the resurgence of the Christian movement which culminated in many blacks converting to Christianity, meant that many blacks did NOT want to return to African but remain in the USA. For as long as the African black wasn't Christian but muslim or pagan, it seems the Christian Whites were fine and dandy about having slaves but upon conversion of the blacks, Christians particularly the Quakers could no long justify having slaves.

So yes religion on whatever level could have something to do with the situation. Now on that note, another factor to be taken into consideration is the depiction in the Bible to these newly converted Christians, of all the main players actually being blue eyed white men. This again gives the impression of white superiority so that even in their religion, the blacks automatically considered themselves as less than the white man. That is indoctrination at its finest

a reply to: conspiracy nut

We already "get it" there should never ever be any need to play the damn race card...and playing tit for tat achieves sod all

Stereotypes exist and are created by the very people they stereotype ...you don't want to be a stereotype? Stop wearing yer pants down by your knees and showing off yer boxers.....stop selling french bread & onions and wearing a beret & striped jersey.....stop wearing a bowler hat to work....all you chavs stop having kids and wearing bling.....bah who cares?

Again there have been stereotypes throughout history too its not a new thing but personally I think its fairly harmless but can be changed but then a new stereotype will emerge

originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
If I could just take it a little further though....at this point in history and prior, many white Europeans had had various amounts of contact with educated intelligent Christian black people, so in theory the false narrative that perhaps the Protestant owners were attempting to peddle should have failed. Europeans had the knowledge and contact that these people were not in fact sub human at all and were in fact the very backbone of many aristocratic houses.

Perhaps this is partly about the cultural gap (in those days of slow communications) between rural America and contemporary Europe.

a reply to: DISRAELI

aye could be....

originally posted by: DISRAELI
a reply to: Logarock
But why would Anglicans be more prone to racism than Catholics? What's the psychological connection?

Because it, the Anglicans, attached to the Angle/Saxon race superiority, over other white tribes, position and had old deep roots in the South buy the influence of England and slavery on the south if nothing else. Saxon race philosophy is well established.

originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
a reply to: ladyinwaiting

Enlighten me to what my agenda is exactly?

It looks like you have an agenda because you led off with this:

originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport

I thought in light of the many "black" posts, this would be quite an appropriate time to post this as a reminder to all that colour & race are not barriers to success and acceptance but perhaps attitude is

This is victim blaming. It is absurd, asinine and frankly insane to say that it doesn't matter where you start if you have the right attitude you can always overcome. This places the blame upon those victimized, implying that they simply are lacking some aspect of character and so they are responsible for their situation. Your first example is ridiculous. The woman was educated by people who were willing to accept that she was intelligent. She had champions in the social sphere to advocate for her, if she did not have that, or had been given those opportunities she would have died unknown, and probably badly. Slaves really are powerless and dependent upon the good will of their masters, which is what happened. You have an agenda.

Having said that, there is a broader and more productive aspect to this that you've brought up. Bigotry and racism are not necessarily a result of slavery; I will say that it is a common excuse for it though. The dominant culture will dehumanize the enslaved culture. They'll always grab onto something to salve their egos and convince themselves that those they enslave are Less Than. Bonus, if the enslaved culture looks different there is a concrete visual difference that people can sink their teeth into. It's utter crap, but it's convenient, even intuitive.

I do believe that slavery is inevitable. We arrange ourselves into hierarchies. Social status is dependent upon wealth. Slavery feeds into those darker and inevitable social impulses two fold: Blatant straight-forward, visceral dominance and the more oblique accumulation of wealth that bolsters higher social status. I don't think it will ever change no matter how much we mouth words about how wrong it is. We still do it, we just usually call it something else these days, because it is so socially taboo that most won't even acknowledge it while they are in the midst of it.

a reply to: redhorse

I could only be accused of victim blaming if I was addressing the actual victims and not people generations removed who have chosen to say they are victims

The point of the post which I think you may have missed is in regard to colour & race not privilege. Sarah was clever and worked hard and was accepted without incident as were many many more black people at the time and prior. She accepted her new life and was accepted back. She didn't want to go back to Sierra Leone she was happy in England. The race & colour issue do not appear to have been an issue. Therefore what I am saying is, instead of some blacks playing the victim/race card instead of some blacks calling other blacks sell outs, instead of some blacks insisting they are not at fault in any way but every white person on the planet is.....take stock...look further back in your vast history than slavery and see what was and can be achieved. Stop referring to yourself as African Americans but American...its your home and for most... your birthplace. Stop being used and manipulated for someone else's agenda who clearly wishes to start some sort of war.

If medieval Europeans had no concept of race & colour and yet still managed to co-exist then it can be that way again in time

originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
a reply to: ladyinwaiting

Clearly you don't believe as I that this whole current situation is being cleverly manipulated then? Do you not feel that the blacks of today currently protesting chanting and spewing hatred should take charge of their lives, live up to some of their superb role models, improve their lot themselves and stop the blame game/victimhood? Do you not think that these actions hold them back severely?

I would certianly agree there is some manipulation being done to sway us into a situation that's conducive to the powers that be. Still i'am afraid racism actually began when Europeans finally got control of Europe. The concept of skin color wasn't an issue prior europeans getting control, if you was weaker you got conquered. White supremacy is the driving force behind much of todays troubles. White supremacy along with greed was the trojan horse that went into so-called Afrika and enslaved millions of blacks. History have been distorted by white supremacy when you say blacks sold themselves into slavery without an explanation of how it was so. Tell us how can one live up too our superb role models when the mind set of white supremacy killed or discredited them? When you say things like, stop the protesting , stop the blame game, take charge of your life, stop being a victim...etc. Thats easy to do if you weren't locked in this prison of white supremacy.

a reply to: Beenready2go

All I can say is you can see the bars of the cage you're allegeldy in...so unlock it !
Blacks have been lead to believe in white supremacy but that is what it is ...a belief.There is no race more supreme than another. Once blacks can shake off that belief times will change but they should also stop hating themselves and each other too. As I keep repeating, the black history is far far more than slavery. But yes the whole white supremacy thing has been pushed onto them and the only reason I can think for doing that is fear...fear of what I have no idea.

And yes again blacks did sell each other into slavery and that fact is well documented and was commonplace. The girl Sarah in my OP was a slave from an African Royal Family but of a different clan to her captor King Gezo. Certain African tribes made a small fortune from slavery that isn't in dispute...what is in dispute is that this issue should no longer be an issue

Please don't tell me all your black role models are dead or discredited and by white people. That's just plain silly. That I'm afraid is what so many black people are guilty of, ignoring the successful blacks, baiting those that refuse to be victims, those that have moved on from the hate and just want to live their lives. Its a little like Stockholm syndrome some black people hate the whites and yet need us...some black people like their victimhood their moaning the whining the protesting....it gives them purpose but it also keeps them back

Someone is playing the fiddle and the younger blacks are dancing...its so wrong

originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
a reply to: redhorse

I could only be accused of victim blaming if I was addressing the actual victims and not people generations removed who have chosen to say they are victims

The point of the post which I think you may have missed is in regard to colour & race not privilege. Sarah was clever and worked hard and was accepted without incident as were many many more black people at the time and prior. She accepted her new life and was accepted back. She didn't want to go back to Sierra Leone she was happy in England. The race & colour issue do not appear to have been an issue. Therefore what I am saying is, instead of some blacks playing the victim/race card instead of some blacks calling other blacks sell outs, instead of some blacks insisting they are not at fault in any way but every white person on the planet is.....take stock...look further back in your vast history than slavery and see what was and can be achieved. Stop referring to yourself as African Americans but American...its your home and for most... your birthplace. Stop being used and manipulated for someone else's agenda who clearly wishes to start some sort of war.

If medieval Europeans had no concept of race & colour and yet still managed to co-exist then it can be that way again in time

Sir are you aware of the fact that you are a part of the race issue in this country when you say such things? Are you fully aware that we are standing right next to eachother and both are thirsty but only you can reach the water? Sir you talk like white europeans became great all by themselves. I beg your pardon sir. Black North Afrikan Muslims called Moors in 711AD conquered most of West Asia (Europe) and that's what got white europe out of the dark ages. The very first Kings and Queens of Europe was black. Only after the Moors left Europe the white Europeans started a thousand year war between tribes for domination. White people never accepted being ruled by blacks even after blacks helped them to rise, ' just ask the Indians'. You talk about that little girl she had no choice. If blacks and whites got along so great back then why have the contributions blacks gave whites been erased from history? Again you are the problem with that supremist mindset. The only way blacks and whites could get along is by separating the races.

originally posted by: Beenready2go
Black North Afrikan Muslims called Moors in 711AD conquered most of West Asia (Europe)

No, they just conquered Spain (apart from the northern fringe).
Imaginary history does not help understanding.

Firstly I'm not a sir and secondly I'm not your country and thirdly I'm not even remotely part of your home grown race issue

The little girl Sarah had no choice? You're quite correct he choices were go with Forbes to England and live or be burned alive in the tomb of her ancestors.

White people have never accepted being ruled by blacks? Again probably correct and blacks haven't accepted being ruled by whites either but then again no-one on the planet actually "likes" to be ruled

I've already said if you could be bothered reading the posts that the Kings & Queens of Europe were black and those that weren't had black ancestry

Black contributions are not erased from history, if they were I wouldn't have been able to find them. I have listed black Generals, Knights, Princesses mentioned artists composers philosophers. Again please read

Prior to this "thousand year war for domination" no sure which war you refer to exactly has it not occurred to you that the Moors & Mohammed in particular did exactly the same in order to conquer Europe?

You see everything cuts both ways but how does that from over 1000 yrs ago affect blacks in America today exactly?

originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
a reply to: Beenready2go

All I can say is you can see the bars of the cage you're allegeldy in...so unlock it !
Blacks have been lead to believe in white supremacy but that is what it is ...a belief.There is no race more supreme than another. Once blacks can shake off that belief times will change but they should also stop hating themselves and each other too. As I keep repeating, the black history is far far more than slavery. But yes the whole white supremacy thing has been pushed onto them and the only reason I can think for doing that is fear...fear of what I have no idea.

And yes again blacks did sell each other into slavery and that fact is well documented and was commonplace. The girl Sarah in my OP was a slave from an African Royal Family but of a different clan to her captor King Gezo. Certain African tribes made a small fortune from slavery that isn't in dispute...what is in dispute is that this issue should no longer be an issue

Please don't tell me all your black role models are dead or discredited and by white people. That's just plain silly. That I'm afraid is what so many black people are guilty of, ignoring the successful blacks, baiting those that refuse to be victims, those that have moved on from the hate and just want to live their lives. Its a little like Stockholm syndrome some black people hate the whites and yet need us...some black people like their victimhood their moaning the whining the protesting....it gives them purpose but it also keeps them back

Someone is playing the fiddle and the younger blacks are dancing...its so wrong

Sometims the suffer don't know he's suffering like in this case. It's like that with white supremacy. It baffles me when you talk of history and you don't acknowledge the fact it's real, they say history is the best teacher. Seems to me the more you comment i get this undertone of white supremacy. Oh you may mean well but you are condescending in your remarks. I would agree with the Stockholm Syndrome. If i took your child away from you as a baby, took it away from his people , country, religion, even changed its name. took your child into my home started molesting it, beat it,sold it to others,not letting it recieve a proper education, set up laws for further oppression, teach it only my history...etc. Now that child has become an adult i don't want it anymore, it is useless, broken down and sick , mind you i tormented this child for 460 years. Dear sir did you think GOD forgot about slavery and he would just let it go? Since we can never see eye to eye separation is the ONLY answer.