Another police involved shooting - Baton Rouge Police Shoot Alton Sterling

a reply to: TDawg61

I'm not opining on any of that right now, you just made an asinine, passive-aggressive comment about him being shot over CDs, and we all know that's not the premise of the use of lethal force.

Whether or not the officers were justified, I have zero clue, because I don't have access to any video at the moment.

a reply to: SlapMonkey

Perhaps you should view the video before you make anymore"Asinine"comments.

a reply to: TDawg61

Mighty fine conclusion jumping! We don't know if any of the shots fired came from his gun. Until we know that, we really know nothing. Also, not executed for selling CD's. He escalated the situation, first by pointing his gun at people then by fighting the police, and had an illegal weapon. I'd say if he was executed at all, it would be for that... but more reasonable people wouldn't jump on the execution bandwagon until more evidence was made available.

a reply to: TDawg61

The video doesn't actually show much. You can't even see his body, let alone his hands. You can't tell where any of the shots fired came from either. I guess you could ASSUME whatever you want though.

a reply to: kosmicjack

I have watched the video a few times. It appears an officer tackled him after he would not comply and he fought back. You can also clearly see he has movement of his arms which is why the officer pulls out his gun when he realizes he isn't strong enough to control the mans arms.

It's sad that this happened. Nobody deserves to die and I feel these officers could have handled it differently, but hind sight is 20/20 and we can't be in those officers mind when it was going down.

How hard is it for people to educate themselves on how to act when an officer shows up. If I am walking to my car in a parking lot and an officers orders me to the ground, guess what I am doing?

Here's a letter that supposedly went out to the LSU community, which is flag-shipped in Baton Rouge:

Dear LSU Community,

As LSU’s president, my top priority is always the safety and security of our students, faculty, and staff. I know that recent events – one as far away as Orlando, the other right here in Baton Rouge – have left many in our LSU community feeling unsafe and concerned. I am here to tell you that at LSU, you are a member of a family. We are committed to an inclusive, diverse and welcoming campus, and we are here for you.

The shooting of Alton Sterling has placed Baton Rouge among one of many cities across the country grappling with questions of social equality and justice. As additional information comes out about this tragic event, LSU will reach out through the Office of Diversity with opportunities to facilitate campus-wide discussion, participation, and feedback. We also encourage you to take advantage of university resources, including LSU’s Division of Student Life, the African American Cultural Center, the Women’s Center, and the Student Health Center.

As the state’s Flagship University, part of our responsibility is to educate the next generation of leaders and thinkers. As I’ve said before, LSU is a vibrant and thriving network of creative scholars, scientists, activists, and critical thinkers. We are a community that is committed to solving the world’s problems through the sharing of ideas and the creation of solutions. Honest and open dialogue is sometimes challenging, but is necessary for us to take crucial steps toward healing.

Sincerely,
F. King Alexander
LSU President

Sorry no link. It's getting some blow-back on local message boards.

1. He was a felon

2. He was resisting

3. He had a gun

Why is this even up for debate?

a reply to: TDawg61

Perhaps I will...when I'm on a network that will allow me to.

In the meantime, why don't you hold off on your passive-aggressive comments and wait until some real information about this has come out before you jump to your conclusions and make assumptions that may, in the end, make you look exceptionally ridiculous.

See, what I did was the intelligent thing--wait to comment about the actions until I can view the video. I don't start the discussion with asininity about people being shot over CDs. Those types of comments are ignorant and intentionally incite anger and hatred...but I think that you know that.

originally posted by: wantsome
1. He was a felon

2. He was resisting

3. He had a gun

Why is this even up for debate?

Because none of those are justification for use of deadly force all of the time. Resisting happens routinely. Felons with weapons happen routinely. The vast majority do not get shot.

We apparently don't have good video of the incident (I have yet to be on a network where I can view it), and without that, obviously we must debate the merits of lethal force.

originally posted by: wantsome
1. He was a felon

2. He was resisting

3. He had a gun

Why is this even up for debate?

1. Did the police know this before or after?

2. Yes he was, and IF the gun was pulled from his pocket after he was killed (see 3) was resisting justification for killing him?

3. witness says was pulled from his pocket after he was shot dead


CCTV and bodycam footage should backup either the witness or the polices version of events

originally posted by: SlapMonkey

originally posted by: wantsome
1. He was a felon

2. He was resisting

3. He had a gun

Why is this even up for debate?

Because none of those are justification for use of deadly force all of the time. Resisting happens routinely. Felons with weapons happen routinely. The vast majority do not get shot.

We apparently don't have good video of the incident (I have yet to be on a network where I can view it), and without that, obviously we must debate the merits of lethal force.

None of those by themselves are reasons to get shot but if you add the 3 together I'd say it's a plausible explanation. But then again what do I know I don't resist the police break the law or carry a gun.

New (extremely graphic warning) video provided by the store owner. Looks like the gun was in his pocket maybe?

It's truly horrible. But, I still kind of side with the police on this - for now - unless and until more info is obtained.I know some will vehemently disagree and I do get the objections and admit to waffling, but he was resisting with a gun in the mix. And no, I don't think the penalty for resisting should be death but this was an unfolding, volatile situation.

It's a tough call, one I personally wouldn't want to be faced with. I don't think the Officers should necessarily skate but it's not murder or abuse of power as some are saying on social media. IMHO. Of course, that's just a cursory opinion, pending more investigation/facts.

For instance, compare it to the two South Carolina Officers who faced criminal charges, one who shot a guy in the back as he was running and the other who shot a motorist who was just routinely reaching for his wallet. That's abuse of power.

This is shocking. Upsetting. Unfortunate. Also totally preventable had the guy complied. It's a terrible incident for everyone involved.

Anyways, the Officers are on administrative leave.


Another source than Daily Beast. Still very graphic.

THIS (graphic) does not look like a person who wanted to kill anyone. Seems just as shocked and upset as all of us.

originally posted by: bender151
a reply to: TDawg61

Mighty fine conclusion jumping! We don't know if any of the shots fired came from his gun. Until we know that, we really know nothing. Also, not executed for selling CD's. He escalated the situation, first by pointing his gun at people then by fighting the police, and had an illegal weapon. I'd say if he was executed at all, it would be for that... but more reasonable people wouldn't jump on the execution bandwagon until more evidence was made available.

I'm amazed that you have all the answers and have solved the case!

Amazing. I thought it may take you a few more days, even a week, but you sure move fast. FBI should give you a promotion.

a reply to: kosmicjack

From your link

On Tuesday night, a 911 caller said a man at the store was threatening patrons with a gun. Officers Blane Salamoni and Howie Lake responded to the call from the Triple S Food Mart and encountered Sterling in the parking lot. Store owner Abduallah Muflahi told The Daily Beast that Sterling was not the person who was causing trouble and was a welcome presence at the store for years where he sold CDs from the parking lot. 

Wrong man, or store owner afraid that he will recive backlash for calling the police

a reply to: lovebeck

Thanks for the praise! Though, it would mean more if you actually read what I wrote.

a reply to: kosmicjack

Still can't see anything. Can't see half his body. Did he reach for the gun? Did it go off? Who knows?

originally posted by: wantsome
1. He was a felon

2. He was resisting

3. He had a gun

Why is this even up for debate?

1. Innocent until proven guilty

2. No he wasn't

3. He did? Prove it.

I am so sick of all the cop bashing. I would love to see any one those hacks put on that badge and drive down the road with little 8 and 10 year old kids pointing toy guns at them, and adults with their finger guns saying I'd kill you right now if I had the chance. You wouldn't last a week. These men and women get up every day and stand on that wall. Knowing that every traffic stop could be the last thing they do. They do it because they know what WILL happen if they don't. If you don't know yet just take a trip to Mexico. Most of the cops there (Not on the cartel payroll) can't even show their face while in uniform. The decent people live in fear that a cartel shoot-out could happen at any second. Or how about the fear that a coworker might get mad at you so they tell everyone you're talking to the police about drug trafficking. You would be dead by morning, no questions asked. Is that the kind of world you want to live in. Or you could go to Russia where, after the fall of the USSR, the Russian mob took over the government so the cops only enforce the laws their told to enforce. Then stop off in south Africa and watch the civil war. These are the things that happen when stupid ties the hands of cops. You want cops to enforce the laws just as long as they don't hurt anyone. It's real simple IF YOU DON'T WANT TO GET SHOT BY A COP DON'T RUN OR FIGHT THEM. The funny thing is that FAR more cops are killed each year than others killed by those cops, why don't those make the news. Their are also a lot of cops killed by rubber-neckers at traffic stops each year where are those complaints ?

Having watched the second video it appears that the suspect is still resisting.

The movement of his body appears that he is trying to bend to be able to reach into his pocket.

Then someone yells " He's got a gun!"

Then after being warned by the police officer he appears to make the same move again.

This would seem like a perfect opportunity to taze the suspect right in the face.

I'm not passing judgement or picking a side but, the armchair quarterback in me thinks this could have been solved with less than lethal force.


ETA: Turns out they had already tazed him and it didn't work.

www.nola.com...

Baton Rouge is bracing for possible fallout with a vigil and more protests planned for tonight. Social media is losing it's mind. Racist whites and racist blacks are all using this to their advantage.

I won't hedge - I'm extremely worried because I have elderly family that lives not far from the convenience store. Fortunately, the State Police head quarters is not far either.

Please, please, please Red Stick, show the world how you ALWAYS pull together in a crisis. Don't be played by outside actors or the MSM.