School calls police to stop 7-year-old kid from sharing Bible verses

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: muzzleflash

Can't Proselytize in public school.

You can talk about religion in school and even show quotes from religious texts in school. You are purposely ignoring our laws.

I'll go dig it up for you since you're allergic to basic research.

originally posted by: muzzleflash

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: muzzleflash

Can't Proselytize in public school.

You can talk about religion in school and even show quotes from religious texts in school. You are purposely ignoring our laws.

I'll go dig it up for you since you're allergic to basic research.

And as an atheist I can complain about your kid proselytizing.

He is a minor. I have the right for him not to be receiving religious information in public school. It is against the law.

A religious kid has the right to do his own thing.

Why do you think their lawyer from the Liberty Council is claiming this kid was outside the school on a public sidewalk?

Here's another link that discusses how the SCOTUS treats religious issues in schools.

It is consistent with the 1st Amendment.

Religion, School, and Law.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: muzzleflash

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: muzzleflash

Can't Proselytize in public school.

You can talk about religion in school and even show quotes from religious texts in school. You are purposely ignoring our laws.

I'll go dig it up for you since you're allergic to basic research.

And as an atheist I can complain about your kid proselytizing.

He is a minor. I have the right for him not to be receiving religious information in public school. It is against the law.

A religious kid has the right to do his own thing.

Why do you think their lawyer from the Liberty Council is claiming this kid was outside the school on a public sidewalk?

He doesn't even have to be on the sidewalk. He can talk about God in the lunchroom or on the playground or anywhere they have free time to chat.

You refuse to read those links showing the Supreme Court rulings against your opinions?

The one I just linked above actually cites cases and explained in detail how the SC interprets this issue.

You lost the debate Annee. You were wrong and now it's time to eat your own words.

You said you support the Law. So support it, stop claiming it says something it doesn't. Your inconsistent with American jurisprudence here.

a reply to: muzzleflash

I'm going to follow this and watch for the ruling.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: muzzleflash

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: muzzleflash

Can't Proselytize in public school.

You can talk about religion in school and even show quotes from religious texts in school. You are purposely ignoring our laws.

I'll go dig it up for you since you're allergic to basic research.

And as an atheist I can complain about your kid proselytizing.

I have the right for him not to be receiving religious information in public school. It is against the law.

You have a right to be protected from the school itself teaching or promoting a specific religion, but they can still teach about it in say, history or civics in an educational format.

You do not have a right to stop another child from talking about their religious views during freetime.

The Law disagrees with you.
I linked to actual cases and valid sources explaining it.

You have zero sources and an ignorant opinion.

This is not Nazi Germany or the USSR or the PRC.

a reply to: muzzleflash

As I said, I'm going to watch this for a ruling.

Its in Palmdale, CA. Desert Rose Elementary

Mom's name: Christina Zavala, Dad's name: Jaime Zavala

Principle: Pagliagro

originally posted by: muzzleflash

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: muzzleflash

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: muzzleflash

Can't Proselytize in public school.

You can talk about religion in school and even show quotes from religious texts in school. You are purposely ignoring our laws.

I'll go dig it up for you since you're allergic to basic research.

And as an atheist I can complain about your kid proselytizing.

I have the right for him not to be receiving religious information in public school. It is against the law.

You have a right to be protected from the school itself teaching or promoting a specific religion, but they can still teach about it in say, history or civics in an educational format.

You do not have a right to stop another child from talking about their religious views during freetime.

The Law disagrees with you.
I linked to actual cases and valid sources explaining it.

You have zero sources and an ignorant opinion.

This is not Nazi Germany or the USSR or the PRC.

Feel free to go off on what ever tangent you want. Doesn't affect me.

As I said, I'm going to follow the case to see what happens.

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: muzzleflash

I'm going to follow this and watch for the ruling.

You are avoiding admitting your sudden realization that you're wrong.

Ruling on what case? When in 2019 or 2021?

Why? Do you hope they overturn long standing case precedent and side against the poor kid they shamed and made cry in front of everyone?

Just admit it, you were wrong, and it's because of the anger in your Heart that blinded you from equality and freedom and Justice.

Admitting it will only make you a better person, not worse, and I will respect you.

I'm sorry for whoever hurt you and clouded your views with anger and resentment, it happens to everyone so don't feel embarrassed. And it wasn't your fault Annee.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: muzzleflash

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: muzzleflash

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: muzzleflash

Can't Proselytize in public school.

You can talk about religion in school and even show quotes from religious texts in school. You are purposely ignoring our laws.

I'll go dig it up for you since you're allergic to basic research.

And as an atheist I can complain about your kid proselytizing.

I have the right for him not to be receiving religious information in public school. It is against the law.

You have a right to be protected from the school itself teaching or promoting a specific religion, but they can still teach about it in say, history or civics in an educational format.

You do not have a right to stop another child from talking about their religious views during freetime.

The Law disagrees with you.
I linked to actual cases and valid sources explaining it.

You have zero sources and an ignorant opinion.

This is not Nazi Germany or the USSR or the PRC.

Feel free to go off on what ever tangent you want. Doesn't affect me.

As I said, I'm going to follow the case to see what happens.

You said it was against the Law.
I showed links proving it isn't.

The Law stands.
They won't suddenly shift and toss out the First Amendment.

They'll probably settle out of court anyways, as 90% of cases are, which means a ruling won't even happen.

Annee, while you're looking up case history please also look up "cognitive dissonance".

a reply to: GemmyMcGemJew

As I said, this is part of living in a pluralistic society. If my kid came home with something like that, it's time to put on my parent hat and talk about it. They are going to learn about this stuff sooner or later and I would rather it be with my guidance as a parent.

I already lay the groundwork now when my kid complains about how someone or other irritates him. We talk about how some people do things differently than we do. It doesn't make them necessarily wrong, just different, and that way may not be our way or a way we like for ourselves, but that doesn't mean it doesn't work for them.

I may not want the school teaching it because that is perceived authority, but if it comes from another kid ... I can deal with that.

Individual students are free to proselytize in school just as they are anywhere else in America. They can bring bibles and sit in a circle and read them at lunch, ask their classmates about Jesus, or whatever else they choose to do, as long as it's not disruptive to the educational setting. That's the key. No one can be permitted to disrupt the orderly functioning of the school. If any activity does that, then school officials are within their rights to stop it.

My personal opinion about this story is that we are not being told the full story. I think christian times has left out key information to slant the readers.

originally posted by: muzzleflash

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: muzzleflash

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: muzzleflash

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: muzzleflash

Can't Proselytize in public school.

You can talk about religion in school and even show quotes from religious texts in school. You are purposely ignoring our laws.

I'll go dig it up for you since you're allergic to basic research.

And as an atheist I can complain about your kid proselytizing.

I have the right for him not to be receiving religious information in public school. It is against the law.

You have a right to be protected from the school itself teaching or promoting a specific religion, but they can still teach about it in say, history or civics in an educational format.

You do not have a right to stop another child from talking about their religious views during freetime.

The Law disagrees with you.
I linked to actual cases and valid sources explaining it.

You have zero sources and an ignorant opinion.

This is not Nazi Germany or the USSR or the PRC.

Feel free to go off on what ever tangent you want. Doesn't affect me.

As I said, I'm going to follow the case to see what happens.

You said it was against the Law.
I showed links proving it isn't.

The Law stands.
They won't suddenly shift and toss out the First Amendment.

They'll probably settle out of court anyways, as 90% of cases are, which means a ruling won't even happen.

Annee, while you're looking up case history please also look up "cognitive dissonance".

I guess we will find out, won't we.

I'm reading/researching.

You need to take a deep breath.

I can understand (and respect) the Separation of Church and State, as this is wise, but this is a child who is doing nothing more than sharing something he finds beautiful with others. Still, in the overall general interest of Peace, I can understand why it is of concern to the School

If one religion is allowed to proliferate, it may quickly become an out of control amalgamation of all spiritual persuasions sharing their respective perspectives....Wiccan, Pagan, Hindu, Buddhist, (please feel free to insert the spiritual path of your calling here) etc....and detracting from Established Lessons during the course of the school day.

While in my heart of hearts I long for the day that All may celebrate in the sharing of their respective spiritual teachings and learning, sadly, Primary Schools are a place of a different sort of fundamental learning, and given that children will be children, the last thing anyone wants is the opportunity to arise for Spiritual Debate or playground "debates" to get out of hand when children of this age should be focused on the basics of Reading, Writing and Arithmetic.

Sadly, the way most "adults" are tackling this issue, I fear it may be a while before any of them are willing to lay down their hard-line perspectives and consider a workable compromise. After all, Schools are in the business of preparing students for the "real world" and it's demands and expectations and Spiritual Matters are more of a personal endeavor.

Perhaps they can schedule an after hours class on various Theologies? That way the kids can stay focused on the task at hand during school hours, and indulge in the sharing of spiritual perspectives after the homogenized "basics" have been covered.

I dunno.
Just thinkin' again.
Sorry about that.
I'll shut up now.

originally posted by: GENERAL EYES
I can understand (and respect) the Separation of Church and State, as this is wise, but this is a child who is doing nothing more than sharing something he finds beautiful with others.

But, you know this would be presented differently if it was a Muslim kid handing out words from the Koran, or a Wiccan, or an Atheist, or anything other then Christian.

I am, without apology, a major supporter of complete Separation of Church and State.

Apparently, you can share religion in school under free speech - - but, it is not absolute. There can be restrictions put on it, times, place, etc. And it can't disrupt education.

a reply to: Annee

Agreed entirely.

Exactly the point I was trying to convey.


Thank you Ms Annee....I always respect your insights immensely.

originally posted by: GENERAL EYES
a reply to: Annee

Agreed entirely.

Exactly the point I was trying to convey.

Thank you Ms Annee....I always respect your insights immensely.

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh,

[[[[[[[[[[ HUGS ]]]]]]]]]]

a reply to: Annee

Don't you find it interesting that it's only the parents and Liberty Counsel who are making the claim? The Sheriff office denied it.

originally posted by: Deaf Alien
a reply to: Annee

Don't you find it interesting that it's only the parents and Liberty Counsel who are making the claim? The Sheriff office denied it.

Any story in the media is misleading.

I would know I was in national news recently and it was all lies, except they got my name right.

My interest in this story was only theoretical and I viewed it as an opportunity to teach Law. My life is consumed in it these days...

originally posted by: Deaf Alien
a reply to: Annee

Don't you find it interesting that it's only the parents and Liberty Counsel who are making the claim? The Sheriff office denied it.

Well, Christians (not all Christians) that encourage their minor children to Proselytize, especially at school, do seem to have tunnel vision.

They only see their own world of being Christian. They don't have any concept that they are intruding on other people.

So, yeah - - - they see only from their own perspective, so it could very well be distorted from what actually happened.